BiGH's Ride!

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 10 2007 10:25am

Hey all - i was too excited to wait for pics - I'll update the first post tomorrow when i get outside with the camera (ran out of batteries today). Got told my hub motor kit left china yesterday:D:D

I've got a donor bike - a Meridia Dakar Front suspension mountain bike - its a decent bike.

Stats on the final setup:
- 72v lipo power source
- 72v 20a controller (with a 72v 35a controller as a backup) - yes i splurged on two controllers. it allows me to modify the caps in each separatly and not have the bike off the road.
- Crystalyte 408 rear hub motor
- Specalised Armadlio Kevlar 26" x 1.5" slick tyres

aiming for a top speed of around 55-65kph or around 35-40mph

Bought it from Solarbbq

excellent service. very well packaged.

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 10 2007 10:39am

Good show !

what lipo's did you go with ?

xyster · Post by **xyster** » Jul 10 2007 10:48am

If possible, later on can you run some acceleration and/or hill climbing tests comparing the 20 and 35 amp controllers? I'm interested in knowing how well a 408 converts the extra power in the real world, not just the simulator. Also, since we're running the same voltage, we can sort-of compare the 5304 at 72v 35a to its comparably-wound 4xx-series sister, the 408.

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 10 2007 10:49am

Ypedal wrote:Good show !

what lipo's did you go with ?

haven't decided yet. I'm waiting for quotes from a few places.

looking for 36v 20ah or 30ah times two, with a bms that will support 72v.

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 10 2007 10:53am

xyster wrote:If possible, later on can you run some acceleration and/or hill climbing tests comparing the 20 and 35 amp controllers? I'm interested in knowing how well a 408 converts the extra power in the real world, not just the simulator. Also, since we're running the same voltage, we can sort-of compare the 5304 at 72v 35a to its comparably-wound 4xx-series sister, the 408.

Certainly will

The 35a controller is going to be borderline for the motor tho- I won't b able to run that for too long.

There will be a lot of testing. I'll put the polar hrm data logger onto the bike for a bit too (it gives speed, graphs, and altitude)

DB2 will come later

EDIT: also expect some good pics (I have a DSLR and associated gear) and a Dig vid cam. (might get my friend who's got a HD-Prosumer vid cam 2 take some flybys

(he works for a TV station as a cameraman))

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 10 2007 11:13am

wich ever Li you chose.. make sure they are happy delivering 20 amps for a good part of the discharge, as the 26" wheel will want to go FAST at 72v. ( 80v on lithium ) and anything below 30 km/h will be 20 amps at the twitch of the throttle.

Shouuld be a decent hill climber tho ..

Keep the updates comming !

xyster · Post by **xyster** » Jul 10 2007 11:28am

make sure they are happy delivering 20 amps for a good part of the discharge,

Depending on your definition of 'happy', a 20 amp drain-rate is not good enough, IMO.

Especially since these are going to be lithium cobalt, drain-rate should be a primary consideration. I'd choose the highest drain-rate I could find in the pack size and price range I wanted. If run near the drain-rate limit, the cells and BMS are at a higher risk of failure, voltage sag will sap upwards of 10-15% of the power, and the cells will also degrade much faster. Some ebike lipoly packs are spec'd for 40 amps or better, and so should work with nicely with both the 20 amp & 35 amp controllers.
http://www.texaselectricbikes.com/catal ... p-165.html

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 10 2007 11:29am

yah i cna't wait

will be looking forward to it.

I'm looking at getting batteries that are too large for the distance i'm doing (so that i can get more cycles out of them), and happy at high discharge rates.

as long as it is faster than the 200w 36v SLA motor i test rode i'm going to be very happy.

the alternate configuration is 4x LIPOs

2 in parallel x 2 in series of 36v 15ah batts
to give:
72v 30ah. - which would also help spread the load a bit

(prolly raise the price a bit too though - hence why i'm still investigating this idea)

edit: xyster - yes those are two of the batt's i'm looking at - but being in shipping to Aus does suck a bit. (and its 15ah) $3k for 4 batteries... $1500 for 2 - not too bad but i'm weighting up options first

xyster · Post by **xyster** » Jul 10 2007 11:35am

I'm looking at getting batteries that are too large for the distance i'm doing (so that i can get more cycles out of them)

This was my thinking with my lithium pack too. Also, having plenty of excess AH's on tap allows me the confidence to go exploring as I ride, without having to plan and map out the entire route. I usually use 10ah or less of my 33ah pack. So I normally charge 80% to 4.0 volts/cell, and run the pack down to 50% or so -- 3.8 volts/cell. This provides about 10ah out of a ~30ah pack in the voltage range lithium cobalt cells are happiest. I'll charge to 4.15v or 4.20v if I'm planning to do some geo-exploring

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 10 2007 12:17pm

Exactly.. example : my 20ah LiMn cells are rated 3C max ( 60 amps ).. the BMS will restrict this to 35 amps.. and i'm using a 20 amp controller. So i can drain this sucker at 20 amps all the way to cut-off and they stay cool as a cucumber. I will NEVER need the range provided by 72v 20 ah.. But charging once a week is kinda cool !

deecanio · Post by **deecanio** » Jul 11 2007 8:13am

yo Hayden,

wheres the pics of the bike????
post em up so i can have a look - kit you ordered sounds like a very good setup - should be fun!!

Cheers

D

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 11 2007 12:54pm

just got home from a very sucessful night - its now 3:54AM -and what did i do? go and take pics of the bike

hehheeheh

edit:

So i wake up in the morning and there's a strut tower brace waiting for me in the hall

thinking thats all that is going to happen today i'm surprised when there is a nock on the door and a massive parcle is delivered!

pics:

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 12 2007 10:33am

ok i've run into the first two problems. I test fitted the motor on the bike. The bike has bottom entry dropouts, the torque arms are designed for side entry... edit after looking at Brett's site (solarbbq) I realise i'm wrong

the other problem is that the bike has integrated shifters AND breaks, meaning i'm going to need new shifters if i run the e-brakes...

can i run the bike without them (I'm assuming yes), i can always strap them plugged in to the controller

also in terms of tyre widths... the rim on the rear wheel is wider than the standard rim. Not sure if i'm going to be able to run my 26" x 1.5" tyres... will have to wait until saturday to check, its almost a cm wider...

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 12 2007 11:00am

The controller will run fine without the Ebrakes conected.. ( I have the same problem on just about every bike out there )

There was a guy making ebrake kits that would hook up to regular integrated setups by glueing a sensor on the underside of the brake levers.. but he's been away for a while.

Good stuff !!!! keep the updates coming !!

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 12 2007 11:30am

Ypedal wrote:The controller will run fine without the Ebrakes conected.. ( I have the same problem on just about every bike out there )

There was a guy making ebrake kits that would hook up to regular integrated setups by glueing a sensor on the underside of the brake levers.. but he's been away for a while.

Good stuff !!!! keep the updates coming !!

awesome

thankyou!

ok now onto tyre widths....

i measured the rear rim - 3.3cm ~1.3" inside lip to inside lip... hope i can run my 26 x 1.5" slicks on them! ( i have them left over from my old commuter mountain bike) should fit (just) heheheh

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 12 2007 1:04pm

The tire should fit the rim, but the brakes might need work, if the legs of the brakes make contact with the tire before the pads hit the rim, shim it up with washers.

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 12 2007 1:15pm

Ypedal wrote:The tire should fit the rim, but the brakes might need work, if the legs of the brakes make contact with the tire before the pads hit the rim, shim it up with washers.

cool thanks

i've already modified the rear brakes to fit

was just worred about the rim since its wider than the norm!

I really should sleep - supposted to be getting up in 2.5 hours for a very full 24 hour day

I'm still trying to work out what battery setup I'm going to go for! :S

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 14 2007 10:53am

ok got my tyres on

26" x 1.5" wide specalised armadilo Nimbus EX **just** fit on the rear rim nice and tight

i'm struggling to get the existing grip off the handlebars so i can fit the throttle.

its slowly coming off though

more pics later today (its 1:53am again lol)

Post by **fechter** » Jul 14 2007 11:01am

One trick I've learned for removing grips is to use rubbing alcohol. Jam a small screwdriver into the crack between the grip and bars, then pour in a bit of alcohol. It acts as a lubricant until it evaporates. Twist the grips back and forth until the alcohol works it's way down the grip.

Once the alcohol evaporates, there's no residue to deal with. Works great for putting the grips back on too.

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 14 2007 11:20am

ahh thanks

i just got it off then...

I got everything mounted. I've gotta get my rack off of my other bike (its at a friend's place) and once the controller comes i'll mount it. If there is room i'm going to mount it under the top of the of the rack. (i'm also going to run a front and rear mud guards.

I *still* haven't ordered a battery yet... i'm considering getting some cheepy SLA batteries, that could be used for local riding only. I'm dying to test the bike out. Its starting to look more like a bike. again

I can't wait to go riding around.

with 3x of these: http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.as ... &SUBCATID=

Post by **Ypedal** » Jul 14 2007 1:04pm

anothe rhandy way to get grips off.. compressed air !

Blow air into the end of the grip into the hollow tube of the handlebars and they pop right off.

or use an adjustable wrench set to the OD of the handlebars and push the grip off instead of trying to pull it off as the rubber streches and makes it impossible...

PICTURES MAN !!!!!

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 14 2007 11:53pm

here's a bumper picture update!!!!

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 14 2007 11:59pm

more pics !

edit more pics didn't want to seem to attach so i'm uploading them insted....

BiGH · Post by **BiGH** » Jul 15 2007 12:25am

xyster · Post by **xyster** » Jul 15 2007 8:09am

Since mounting the motor, how much harder do you find it to pedal?