15/18F Silent Controller 36-150V BT-iOS-Android/GPS-$179-199

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Re: 15F/18F SW/SILENT CONTROLLER 36-150V BT-ANDROID/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Jan 11 2017 7:02pm

Adding a sensor and streaming temperature via the Bluetooth can be done quick and easy.
The temperature control rollback would be a matter of modifying the software. Also possible, but will take a bit longer.
thradad wrote:Powervelocity:

I'm interested in thermal rollback that doesn't require a CA. Are temp sensors supported on your current controllers?
Thanks

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Re: 15F/18F SW/SILENT CONTROLLER 36-150V BT-ANDROID/GPS-$179

Post by thradad » Jan 12 2017 3:50am

Great to hear!

What kind of temp sensor (thermistor or something more like an LM35)? Can any of the existing wires out of the controller be connected to the temp sensor, or would the temp sensor wires get soldered to the board?
Powervelocity.com wrote:Adding a sensor and streaming temperature via the Bluetooth can be done quick and easy.
The temperature control rollback would be a matter of modifying the software. Also possible, but will take a bit longer.
thradad wrote:Powervelocity:

I'm interested in thermal rollback that doesn't require a CA. Are temp sensors supported on your current controllers?
Thanks

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Re: 15F/18F SW/SILENT CONTROLLER 36-150V BT-ANDROID/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Jan 12 2017 1:10pm

The module has analog inputs, so, technically, anything that provides linear output/voltage will work. Some simple filtering and smoothing needs to be applied to mitigate high voltage noises that may affect readings. Digital ones can also be fitted and those would be the best insulated from noises. However, I tend to favor 10K thermistors due to cost.
thradad wrote:Great to hear!

What kind of temp sensor (thermistor or something more like an LM35)? Can any of the existing wires out of the controller be connected to the temp sensor, or would the temp sensor wires get soldered to the board?
Powervelocity.com wrote:Adding a sensor and streaming temperature via the Bluetooth can be done quick and easy.
The temperature control rollback would be a matter of modifying the software. Also possible, but will take a bit longer.
thradad wrote:Powervelocity:

I'm interested in thermal rollback that doesn't require a CA. Are temp sensors supported on your current controllers?
Thanks

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by markz » Jan 12 2017 8:06pm

If I got a low power motor, like a 250W geared or 350W geared or 500W direct drive, would there be any problem in using a 18 fet controller?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Jan 12 2017 9:44pm

No. Programming allows you to limit the power delivery from the controller to prevent the motor from frying.

markz wrote:If I got a low power motor, like a 250W geared or 350W geared or 500W direct drive, would there be any problem in using a 18 fet controller?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by markz » Jan 12 2017 10:29pm

Yeah could also just use a Cycle Analyst.

Thanks!

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Baron » Jan 27 2017 10:21pm

Hey sorry if it's been asked before here, but do you guys use a CA or the controller for 3-speed switch and ebrakes for regen? I checked the cycle analyst user guide and found this, "If any controller feature is employed that relies on direct ebrake input (e.g. conventional regen), then the ebrake connection must be run to the controller in addition to the Cycle Analyst." Is this the correct setup for using this controller with a CA? wire the ebrakes to both the CA and controller
CA ebrakes.png
CA ebrakes.png (108 KiB) Viewed 1495 times
How about the 3-speed switch? Do you prefer to use the cycle analyst or program the settings in the controller software? And could this conflict with using the cycle analyst in different throttle modes like current throttle or power throttle?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Jan 27 2017 10:55pm

That's the correct setup. If you need regen, you have to run you ebrake wires from levers directly to the controller EBS- input. Optionally, you can parallel the signal wire with the CA ebrake input if you need braking to register on the screen. other than that, there is no benefit of running it to the CA.
Baron wrote:Hey sorry if it's been asked before here, but do you guys use a CA or the controller for 3-speed switch and ebrakes for regen? I checked the cycle analyst user guide and found this, "If any controller feature is employed that relies on direct ebrake input (e.g. conventional regen), then the ebrake connection must be run to the controller in addition to the Cycle Analyst." Is this the correct setup for using this controller with a CA? wire the ebrakes to both the CA and controller
CA ebrakes.png
How about the 3-speed switch? Do you prefer to use the cycle analyst or program the settings in the controller software? And could this conflict with using the cycle analyst in different throttle modes like current throttle or power throttle?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by 999zip999 » Jan 29 2017 8:02pm

Hook the three speed switch to the controller and program it there.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by DanGT86 » Jan 30 2017 10:10am

Powervelocity.com wrote:That's the correct setup. If you need regen, you have to run you ebrake wires from levers directly to the controller EBS- input. Optionally, you can parallel the signal wire with the CA ebrake input if you need braking to register on the screen. other than that, there is no benefit of running it to the CA.
Baron wrote:Hey sorry if it's been asked before here, but do you guys use a CA or the controller for 3-speed switch and ebrakes for regen? I checked the cycle analyst user guide and found this, "If any controller feature is employed that relies on direct ebrake input (e.g. conventional regen), then the ebrake connection must be run to the controller in addition to the Cycle Analyst." Is this the correct setup for using this controller with a CA? wire the ebrakes to both the CA and controller
CA ebrakes.png
How about the 3-speed switch? Do you prefer to use the cycle analyst or program the settings in the controller software? And could this conflict with using the cycle analyst in different throttle modes like current throttle or power throttle?

In my experience, you have to parallel the brake signal to the CA if you are using the CA for throttle control. If you do not tell the CA that the brakes are being applied then it will increase the throttle output in an attempt to maintain speed/power. When you release the brake there can be an unwanted burst of acceleration which can be very dangerous. Its best to let the CA know what is going on.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by 999zip999 » Jan 30 2017 11:02am

Or don't run the throttle thru the C.A. If I get this right ?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by ElectricGod » Feb 05 2017 10:41pm

Any news on my controller? It's been weeks since I asked bout getting one.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Baron » Feb 05 2017 11:19pm

I am running my throttle through the CA, brakes paralleled to controller and CA, and 3-speed to the controller.

It seems like the 3 speed switch doesn't work at all even though I programmed the 3 speeds at 100%, 130%, and 20%. Even with the wheel off the ground unloaded, all top speeds are the same. I'm guessing the CA overrides the controller speed since the CA controls the throttle at each different speed setting?

Next I'll try wiring to the CA for the 3 speed switch. But I'm wondering if the CA can do 130% speed, like the controller programming setting. And how different CA throttle modes like current throttle and power throttle interact with the 3 speed switch. I just got my CA a week ago and I'm still learning the intricacies.

Another question, in the programming software I can't set "Regen(V)" below a value of 55. I am testing out 16s lipo which has a max voltage of 67.2V. I think I would need to set a value of around 46 to get the correct regen voltage. 67.2*0.69=46.368

I think you told me the values for voltages in the programming software aren't accurate and that you have to multiply the desired values by 0.69 and input the result in the programming software. But I can't set a value below 55 for regen v.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Baron » Feb 06 2017 6:16pm

I just did a test ride with 16S lipo and a regen(V) setting at 55 to test regen. Hitting the regen raised the voltage shown on the CA, but not to unsafe levels higher than the battery max voltage. Is it safe to use for short bursts? A little concerned since a regen(V) setting of 55 should be putting around 80v back into the batteries right?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Feb 06 2017 6:46pm

Baron wrote:I am running my throttle through the CA, brakes paralleled to controller and CA, and 3-speed to the controller.

It seems like the 3 speed switch doesn't work at all even though I programmed the 3 speeds at 100%, 130%, and 20%. Even with the wheel off the ground unloaded, all top speeds are the same. I'm guessing the CA overrides the controller speed since the CA controls the throttle at each different speed setting?
Need to see a screenshot of your settings, as there are tons of possibilities here. Unloaded speed is not a good indicator of whether the 3 position switch is working or not. There are three ways to set up the 3-position switch: a) limiting the voltage, b) limiting the current. c) limiting both. I personally prefer leaving all the speed limits at 100% and using only current limits. That eliminates the throttle dead band is it would be the case with speed/voltage limiting, and it feels more intuitive while riding the bike. At the same time, it will not show on an unloaded wheel because current demand is minuscule on an unloaded wheel. Also, CA has no way of overriding the controller settings as the only feedback it is sending to the controller is that 0.7-3.27v throttle signal.

Wiring can be an issue as well. You need to make sure your switch shorts X1 to ground in first position and X2 in the third position. It should be all open in the second/middle position.
Baron wrote: Next I'll try wiring to the CA for the 3 speed switch. But I'm wondering if the CA can do 130% speed, like the controller programming setting. And how different CA throttle modes like current throttle and power throttle interact with the 3 speed switch. I just got my CA a week ago and I'm still learning the intricacies.
My experience is that 3 speed switch works better if connected directly to the controller. I had oscillations if wired via the CA. You are also likely to have the dead band on the throttle where your bike accelerate to maybe 2/3 of a throttle and then do nothing after that. Feels strange as you still have some throttle left and the bike would not go faster.
Baron wrote: Another question, in the programming software I can't set "Regen(V)" below a value of 55. I am testing out 16s lipo which has a max voltage of 67.2V. I think I would need to set a value of around 46 to get the correct regen voltage. 67.2*0.69=46.368

I think you told me the values for voltages in the programming software aren't accurate and that you have to multiply the values by 0.69. But I can't set a value below 55 for regen v.
That multiplier may now work exactly the same throughout the whole range of values.
The short answer here is set it to 55 and work up a few units if necessary. Watch the regen voltage to be around 66.5v during braking.
I am done fixing the Chinese software, and thought it would be a better use of resources to implement these things the right way from scratch in the Android and iPhone apps.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by FluxZoom » Feb 07 2017 2:36pm

How goes the progress on making a way to display things like speed, watt hours consumed, Wh/mi and so on?

Last I heard vargen was still in beta, has this changed?

Thanks!


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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by FluxZoom » Feb 09 2017 4:54am

Powervelocity.com wrote:It's all in the works.
Have a time frame in mind?


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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by monk3e » Feb 15 2017 5:54am

When flashing the conteoller via bluetooth how do you get around SDA and RX being joined to program? This usually stops the back wheel turning. I assume you have it joined for the Bluetooth songle to program, but then no switch to disable prpgramming mode?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Feb 16 2017 1:40am

I don't connect them. The recent versions of the programmer has the ability to set the chip into programming mode without physically connecting anything.
monk3e wrote:When flashing the conteoller via bluetooth how do you get around SDA and RX being joined to program? This usually stops the back wheel turning. I assume you have it joined for the Bluetooth songle to program, but then no switch to disable prpgramming mode?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Baron » Feb 16 2017 11:52pm

Powervelocity.com wrote:
Baron wrote:I am running my throttle through the CA, brakes paralleled to controller and CA, and 3-speed to the controller.

It seems like the 3 speed switch doesn't work at all even though I programmed the 3 speeds at 100%, 130%, and 20%. Even with the wheel off the ground unloaded, all top speeds are the same. I'm guessing the CA overrides the controller speed since the CA controls the throttle at each different speed setting?
Need to see a screenshot of your settings, as there are tons of possibilities here. Unloaded speed is not a good indicator of whether the 3 position switch is working or not. There are three ways to set up the 3-position switch: a) limiting the voltage, b) limiting the current. c) limiting both. I personally prefer leaving all the speed limits at 100% and using only current limits. That eliminates the throttle dead band is it would be the case with speed/voltage limiting, and it feels more intuitive while riding the bike. At the same time, it will not show on an unloaded wheel because current demand is minuscule on an unloaded wheel. Also, CA has no way of overriding the controller settings as the only feedback it is sending to the controller is that 0.7-3.27v throttle signal.

Wiring can be an issue as well. You need to make sure your switch shorts X1 to ground in first position and X2 in the third position. It should be all open in the second/middle position.
Baron wrote: Next I'll try wiring to the CA for the 3 speed switch. But I'm wondering if the CA can do 130% speed, like the controller programming setting. And how different CA throttle modes like current throttle and power throttle interact with the 3 speed switch. I just got my CA a week ago and I'm still learning the intricacies.
My experience is that 3 speed switch works better if connected directly to the controller. I had oscillations if wired via the CA. You are also likely to have the dead band on the throttle where your bike accelerate to maybe 2/3 of a throttle and then do nothing after that. Feels strange as you still have some throttle left and the bike would not go faster.
Baron wrote: Another question, in the programming software I can't set "Regen(V)" below a value of 55. I am testing out 16s lipo which has a max voltage of 67.2V. I think I would need to set a value of around 46 to get the correct regen voltage. 67.2*0.69=46.368

I think you told me the values for voltages in the programming software aren't accurate and that you have to multiply the values by 0.69. But I can't set a value below 55 for regen v.
That multiplier may now work exactly the same throughout the whole range of values.
The short answer here is set it to 55 and work up a few units if necessary. Watch the regen voltage to be around 66.5v during braking.
I am done fixing the Chinese software, and thought it would be a better use of resources to implement these things the right way from scratch in the Android and iPhone apps.
Is it possible to use regen with 12s lipo 50.4V max?
can you reprogram the controller for lower voltages somehow?

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Feb 17 2017 1:46am

Edit:
I've just remembered that X4 pin on the board should accomplish the same thing, so it may be easier to use that one instead. You route a jumper wire outside of the controller connecting one to X4 and another one to the ground. Connecting them together should lower the actual LVC and Regen voltage. I know this is by design but I never had to test it as I have no packs smaller than 13s.

***

Yes, but you will need to open the controller and do a simple hardware mod.
Connecting these two solder pads on the PCB by the small transformer will lower the actual LVC and regen voltage. I haven't tested by how much but one of my customers is running 36v (10s) with this mod. Just set it to the lowest value and work it up by small amounts if necessary for the regen to start kicking in.
lower_V_mod.jpg
lower_V_mod.jpg (57.34 KiB) Viewed 2303 times
Baron wrote: Is it possible to use regen with 12s lipo 50.4V max?
can you reprogram the controller for lower voltages somehow?
Last edited by Powervelocity.com on Feb 18 2017 8:38pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by alsmith » Feb 18 2017 7:43pm

Hands up, I did the low voltage mod. I can verify it worked for me but those pads are small so be careful when soldering. I have 2 of these controllers, I ran wire from each pad on one to make it switchable. The other I screwed one pad up (soldered ok but somehow managed to pull one of the wires pulling the pad off) but got an alternative solder point from Vlad so ran a wire between them. Best choice is to just short them, don't try running wires to make it a switchable mod - the pads aren't big and not designed for connecting wires to them.

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Re: 15F/18F SW/Silent Controller 36-150V BT-Android/GPS-$179

Post by Powervelocity.com » Feb 18 2017 8:36pm

There are a couple of tricks how to minimize the risk of pulling the solder pads from the PCB after soldering wires onto them. The easiest one is to tie those wires in a knot right in front of the silicon gasket exit point. That way pulling wires from the outside will not cause pilling the solder pads inside as the knot will be stopping it. However, I would go with the X4 pin mod first.
alsmith wrote:Hands up, I did the low voltage mod. I can verify it worked for me but those pads are small so be careful when soldering. I have 2 of these controllers, I ran wire from each pad on one to make it switchable. The other I screwed one pad up (soldered ok but somehow managed to pull one of the wires pulling the pad off) but got an alternative solder point from Vlad so ran a wire between them. Best choice is to just short them, don't try running wires to make it a switchable mod - the pads aren't big and not designed for connecting wires to them.

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