Cheap build opinion

K

karoldem

100 µW
Joined
Jul 31, 2024
Messages
8
Location
Poland
Hello guys,
I think about buying this kit and I have several questions.
1727713571482.png

I'm lured with $100 price and I don't understand why nobody else in Warsaw is interested in this device.
Am I going to be able to install PAS in this. It doesn't have counter, only 1-4V analog.
What do you think about it generally?


www.kaufland.pl

zestaw do konwersji tylnego koła roweru elektrycznego 24 V 250 W Zestaw do konwersji

Ważna uwaga:Ten produkt jest przeznaczony do rowerów o średnicy piasty mniejszej niż 36 mm.Ten produkt nie zawiera akumulatora ani ładowarki.To nasz najnowszy zestaw do rowerów elektrycznych. W tym zestawie zębatka jest przymocowana do szprych koła, dzięki czemu pasuje do...
www.kaufland.pl www.kaufland.pl
 
These are brushed motors.
They won't take pas because the controllers are never built for that feature.
They're very heavy for their power output and not efficient.

I suggest spending another $100 and getting a hub motor if this is your first time.
 
Outlined above.. it's going to be inferior in every way to a brushless.
 
Yeah, geared hub motor is typically a better option.

But the motor you’re looking at isn’t horrible, for the money anyway. That said, spend a bit more and you can get XYD versions of those motors (rather than the Unite ones), that use an aluminium motor casing. They’re lighter, quieter, more powerful, more efficient, and less likely to overheat.

As to PAS, yes, there are suitable controllers, at least in the USA. Look for the replacements for the Currie controllers, from memory they’re available from one of the “scooter” stores, perhaps monsterscooterparts.com?
 
glennb said:
Yeah, geared hub motor is typically a better option.

But the motor you’re looking at isn’t horrible, for the money anyway. That said, spend a bit more and you can get XYD versions of those motors (rather than the Unite ones), that use an aluminium motor casing. They’re lighter, quieter, more powerful, more efficient, and less likely to overheat.

As to PAS, yes, there are suitable controllers, at least in the USA. Look for the replacements for the Currie controllers, from memory they’re available from one of the “scooter” stores, perhaps monsterscooterparts.com?
Click to expand...
I rather thought about this:
 
Cheapest is always to get an e-bike that stopped working for somebody else, and make it work for you. Usually that's a simple matter, unless the bike has been sitting for long enough that you need a new battery.

The problem with the cheap brushed motor system you're looking at is that it can't be made much better. It will always be low powered and inefficient. An average hub motor can step up to higher power levels if you decide to upgrade the battery and/or controller. Your prospective system's chain secondary drive will be noisy and wear prone without any offsetting benefits.

If you get a secondhand hub motor system, you would probably be able to easily increase its capabilities later if you want more to work with.
 
docw009 said:
I also paid more ($225) in 2015 for my first geared kit. Still running too,

I see that PSWpower wants $75 shipping plus some sales tax, so it's around $270. STill not bad. Comes with a KT controller though, but only the LCD5.
Click to expand...

Now you can buy a complete ebike for less than that price on Amazon.

Not just one but multiple different bikes.

The one I am randomly looking at right now is rated 500W (with 750W peak) and has a 4.4 stars out of 5 stars ( from 654 reviews) and UL2849 certification.
 
Last edited:
Chalo said:
If you get a secondhand hub motor system, you would probably be able to easily increase its capabilities later if you want more to work with.
Click to expand...

Yep. If you hunt around you can probably find front hub motors almost for free. I have two sitting in my garage that are there because I just didn't want to throw them away. A front hub motor should work well for a trike or at least most trikes. Maybe if you describe what you want to build and how you intend to use it people here can be more helpful. Also, keep in mind that the battery is often the most expensive single component.
 
karoldem said:
I wanted to cut corners
Click to expand...

Hi Karol

Buy cheap, buy twice.

You can buy individual components as well, but it is not the easiest thing to lace a wheel.

www.pswpower.com

electrical bicycle E-bike Motor MXUS 36V 250W 350W 48V 500W High Speed Brushless Gear Hub Motor Front Rear cassette Wheel Drive XF07 XF08 XF08C XF15F

electrical bicycle E-bike Motor MXUS 36V 250W 350W 48V 500W High Speed Brushless Gear Hub Motor Front Rear cassette Wheel Drive XF07 XF08 XF08C XF15F
www.pswpower.com www.pswpower.com

My advice is: buy as powerful legal motor as you can afford (for example 250W motor and 500W controller). Buy good quality battery.

As far as I know KT controller offers interesting functionality - you can have full legal throttle.

Why trike and not bike? Is there a special reason?
 
@karoldem the 24V motor you linked here can be found in Razor E300 scooters (can find used one pretty cheap)
But it's not a great motor - it heats up quite a lot and the whole drivetrain is noisy as hell.
MXus offer linked above looks much better in comparison.
 
rafalg said:
the whole drivetrain is noisy as hell
Click to expand...
That's my problem with geared hubs. I've always used direct drive hubs for the quiet. I'm sure there are almost silent geared hubs out there but how would you know before you buy?
 
Diggs said:
That's my problem with geared hubs. I've always used direct drive hubs for the quiet. I'm sure there are almost silent geared hubs out there but how would you know before you buy?
Click to expand...
A planetary geared hub would have to be broken to make as much racket as one of the spur gear/chain reduction motors that the OP posted.

Even a geared hub can be almost silent if it's run with a sine wave controller. Likewise, even a direct drive hub can be pretty buzzy at low RPM , and ringy at high RPM, when run with a trapezoidal wave controller.
 
Last edited:
Chalo said:
Even a geared hub can be almost silent if it's run with a sine wave controller.
Click to expand...
...and that's my point. "Can be" but how do you know until you own it? Sure, there's some confidence when buying Bafang or other known product line but when shopping on the inexpensive side you just don't know. My inexpensive builds have been with a 1,000 watt 48v direct drive hub motors. I've thought about smaller hub motors but worry about gear noise. (I sit on my front porch and hear geared drives chugging by way out on the street.) ...and 1,000 watt direct drive systems are a nice sweet spot with price/performance.
 
Diggs said:
...and that's my point. "Can be" but how do you know until you own it?
Click to expand...

I'll put it this way: I've never heard a geared hub that was noisy, unless it was being powered by a noisy controller. Even ones with damaged/smooshed gear teeth have been pretty quiet when backdriven.
 
glennb said:
Yeah, geared hub motor is typically a better option.

But the motor you’re looking at isn’t horrible, for the money anyway. That said, spend a bit more and you can get XYD versions of those motors (rather than the Unite ones), that use an aluminium motor casing. They’re lighter, quieter, more powerful, more efficient, and less likely to overheat.

As to PAS, yes, there are suitable controllers, at least in the USA. Look for the replacements for the Currie controllers, from memory they’re available from one of the “scooter” stores, perhaps monsterscooterparts.com?
Click to expand...

It looks like the PAS version of the Currie Controllers are discontinued at MSP:

eZip Trailz Men's Electric Bicycle Parts - ElectricScooterParts.com

Parts for Currie eZip Trailz men's electric bicycles.
electricscooterparts.com electricscooterparts.com

L-faster does sell a version of this Left hand side drive with PAS though. It has brush-less motor:

www.l-faster.com

Pedal Assist Sensor Bicycle DIY Ebike Left-Drive Motor Kit

The 26" ebike with this DIY left-drive motor kit can run about 25km/h, fit the bicycle with V brake and disc brake, support pedal assist sensor (PAS)
www.l-faster.com
 
It is such a poor design on so many levels. I don't understand why somebody might even consider it as an option.
 
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