CYC PHOTON

Hi All. I wanted to let you know that yesterday was the first time I tried CYC Photon. In short, for me it exceeds all expectations. We went for a few laps in Tihany (52 km), mountains, valleys, asphalt, dirt road, grass. With very steep climbs. The whole system provides an amazing experience. On flat terrain, you can reach a speed of 45-50 km/h either by rolling or using the throttle, all this with a 38T gear in the front, 11T in the rear. I think 60-65km/h can be easily reached with the 50T factory gear. The torque sensor is incredibly sensitive, it is possible to maneuver perfectly and sophisticatedly on steep dirt roads and through roots. We went up such steep dirt roads and asphalt roads without any problems that I didn't dare to dream about it. I also monitored the engine temperature, it stayed around 30 degrees on average, it went up to 40 degrees when under heavy load, on a very steep road or when using the throttle. That's a long way from 80 degrees. As far as I know, the engine would shut down above 80 degrees. So I think it can be loaded a lot. For me, 38T gears are the golden mean, I don't think I'd want to drive over 45km/h, it's already an experience, we passed factory bikes with Bosch or Panasonic motors as if they were standing still. It's seriously fun. This also ensures very good climbing ability even on the ground. Many times I didn't even use the two largest rear cogs, 37T and 46T. There is plenty of power and torque to pull you up in critical situations on steep dirt roads. With large rear gears, it is a dream to maneuver on a steep dirt road, between roots. We drove 52 km, approx. 20% capacity is still left from the battery (840wh battery). I think the system can do about 65 km in very demanding mountain and valley conditions, going up several peaks, sometimes even using the throttle. On flat terrain, I think it's probably 100km or more. I think this is absolutely one of the best engines on the market right now. Thanks
 

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Atak_Snajpera said:
Because IT is manufactured in Taiwan?
Click to expand...
Interestingly their business correspondence address is in Hong Kong - I don't know where the manufacturing plant is, but I'm guessing nearby, if not in the same facility.

I was surprised to see their "won't ship to" list - it's pretty long (along with those @hindesite mentioned: China, Hongkong or Macau), and payment and shipping to and from Russia, Ukraine, Cuba, Iran, Sudan, Syria, North Korea, Myanmar, Yemen, and the Crimean Peninsula have been suspended.
 
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lery2 said:
Hi All. I wanted to let you know that yesterday was the first time I tried CYC Photon. In short, for me it exceeds all expectations. We went for a few laps in Tihany (52 km), mountains, valleys, asphalt, dirt road, grass. With very steep climbs. The whole system provides an amazing experience. On flat terrain, you can reach a speed of 45-50 km/h either by rolling or using the throttle, all this with a 38T gear in the front, 11T in the rear. I think 60-65km/h can be easily reached with the 50T factory gear. The torque sensor is incredibly sensitive, it is possible to maneuver perfectly and sophisticatedly on steep dirt roads and through roots. We went up such steep dirt roads and asphalt roads without any problems that I didn't dare to dream about it. I also monitored the engine temperature, it stayed around 30 degrees on average, it went up to 40 degrees when under heavy load, on a very steep road or when using the throttle. That's a long way from 80 degrees. As far as I know, the engine would shut down above 80 degrees. So I think it can be loaded a lot. For me, 38T gears are the golden mean, I don't think I'd want to drive over 45km/h, it's already an experience, we passed factory bikes with Bosch or Panasonic motors as if they were standing still. It's seriously fun. This also ensures very good climbing ability even on the ground. Many times I didn't even use the two largest rear cogs, 37T and 46T. There is plenty of power and torque to pull you up in critical situations on steep dirt roads. With large rear gears, it is a dream to maneuver on a steep dirt road, between roots. We drove 52 km, approx. 20% capacity is still left from the battery (840wh battery). I think the system can do about 65 km in very demanding mountain and valley conditions, going up several peaks, sometimes even using the throttle. On flat terrain, I think it's probably 100km or more. I think this is absolutely one of the best engines on the market right now. Thanks
Click to expand...
Thanks for the write-up - looks like a gorgeous area to ride, too.
 
ncmired said:
Interestingly their business correspondence address is in Hong Kong - I don't know where the manufacturing plant is, but I'm guessing nearby, if not in the same facility.

I was surprised to see their "won't ship to" list - it's pretty long (along with those @hindesite mentioned: China, Hongkong or Macau), and payment and shipping to and from Russia, Ukraine, Cuba, Iran, Sudan, Syria, North Korea, Myanmar, Yemen, and the Crimean Peninsula have been suspended.
Click to expand...
Imagine having your company in USA and not selling your product in USA. LOOOL.
Maybe controller or even whole unit is manufactured in Taiwan and china imposed sanctions on these products? Economic war against Taiwan is a fact.
 
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Atak_Snajpera said:
Imagine having your company in USA and not selling your product in USA. LOOOL.
Maybe controller or even whole unit is manufactured in Taiwan and china imposed sanctions on these products? Economic war against Taiwan is a fact.
Click to expand...
One of the challenges shipping into china these days is that if American part suppliers find out you are shipping a product with their parts to china, especially to some blacklisted companies, they'll stop selling you parts.... don't ask how I know... very painful...
 
Atak_Snajpera said:
How long did you wait for your unit after payment?
Click to expand...
Regarding U.S. shipments, the first one I purchased from a U.S. vendor, a preorder, took two months from order to delivery (Jan 4 to March 4). The second was a CYC-direct order I canceled (the project timeline moved out), and there was no shipping status update after five weeks (March 14 to April 22).

I also purchased two CYC displays, which came in quickly.
 
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Here in EU even resellers for example fasterbikes.eu do not have Photons in stock. This looks very alarming...
Perhaps I made a mistake purchasing X6 controller for my stealth gen1 from CYC . Maybe I should just buy a new ASI BAC855 instead (assuming that any ASI BAC855 works with CYC STEALTH gen1)
 
 
 
Wapous said:
I did suggest to the CYC technical service to add this text (here in yellow) for clarity. They are working on an update.
Click to expand...
They are probably so familiar with how their interface works that they've lost the perspective of the average user. I bet they aren't testing their app with new users as part of their development process. Adding text is only a patch, the interface itself should be more clear. Maybe both of those values should be labeled as 0-100% with the bar ramp or wedge shaped.

Isn't Ramp Time also a relative scale. ie not 0-10 units of time? So same comments apply there, too.

In any case I want both of mine to go to 11 :)
 
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pxl666 said:
i have build several ebikes and i have bought two new marin rift zone for conversion . i have ridden them with tsdz2 with great pleasure . i ride on mountain foot trails so no special bike trails and i really know how to beat bike and motor with serious mtb ... i believe i know what i need and what i want . as i said - i'd rather save more money and buy bafang integrated than spend so much money to another conversion . period . there is no way cyc gets close to any integrated motor apart from power and speed which i don't need as i do mtb climbing and downhill not flat racing . bafang motors are easily serviceable and way more robust than cyc . not comparable i'd say ...
i was hoping photon was better tsdz2 with a little higher price tag . when it's price is 5x tsdz2 and delivery time is 8-10 weeks and same for spare parts (proprietary chainring wtf) i see no point in being screwed in that way ... sorry .
Click to expand...
For occasional long distance commuting to work (160km round trip with prolonged inclines ranging from 9% to 17%) Photon probably would be better than BBS02 to keep the speed from dropping below 20 or 25km/h regardless of environment. BBS02 might be used for inclines only since during strong headwinds the cadence only PAS could enable constant ghost pedalling which will reduce the force of pumping effect of calf muscle contractions thus reducing the blood flow in feet and will drain the battery faster. Sence TSDZ2 is incapable of keeping the speeds from dropping below 20km/h on inclines then current CYC Photon seems like an only option.
ToSeven DM-01 or DM-02 might be another option but there aren't any teardown pictures published yet. Lingbei is discontinued due to problems with torque sensor and according to reports it was programmed to be excessively similar to cadence sensor.
 
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Can anybody who actually has a Photon confirm or deny that it accepts the de-facto standard 104BCD chain rings?

Either way, your Photon model?

I would note that, although my TSDZ2 did not accept 104BCD rings out of the box, I was able to buy an adapter for cheap on Amazon that gives me access to a drawer full of 104BCD rings from my cycling days.

 
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PeteCress said:
Can anybody who actually has a Photon confirm or deny that it accepts the de-facto standard 104BCD chain rings?
Click to expand...
The Photon doesn't currently accept any B.C.D. standard rings - there's no adapter at this time. I don't think it would be possible to hit the tight chain line that the Photon manages with its proprietary 34T and 38T rings (47.3mm on a 68mm English BB).
PeteCress said:
Either way, your Photon model?
Click to expand...
The build is documented here in my case, a 68-83mm 38T Photon that replaced a Bafang BBS02B.
 
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PeteCress said:
FWIW, I am running a 28-tooth ring on my Tongsgeng.
Click to expand...
Why? What does 28t get you? Or do you have to use 28t because you can't use the lower gears on the cassette due to the munted chainline?

I run a 32t/34t with 50t on the rear, and while that is fine with an acoustic bike, it is close to being quicker to get off and walk :), and with the Photon, it can climb almost anything.

With the availability of 52t and 520% range cassettes, maybe it is time to reconsider just how small the front chainring needs to be? We have more options now.
 
hindesite said:
Why? What does 28t get you?
Click to expand...
28 gets me a stump-pulling low gear.

That said, I get spun out in top gear at 18-19 mph.

But the motor is on a tadpole trike and not a bike and the trike has it's limitations - which make a really-low Low and not much of a High reasonable for a semi-cripple like me:
  • It's seriously heavy with the motor, battery, and all the junk I carry. 104# last time I weighed it, so it sucks pretty badly at climbing... but I ride it with electric assist as little as possible and I'm older than dirt - and the ultra-low 1st gear is easier on what's left of my knees.
  • IMHO, the thing lacks a bicycle's stability, so I don't really feel safe on it at much over 15 mph.
    • Steering is by turning instead of leaning. Try turning your bike's front wheel at anything faster than a slow walk and you will get the idea.
    • The suspension is minimalist: no shocks and less than inch of elastomer travel. I think bad things could happen hitting a bump or pothole at any kind of speed without the built-in suspension of standing on the pedals. No jumping obstacles...
If I could ride a bike, this thing would be on Craig's List tomorrow... but I can't and it beats hell out of lying on the couch all day.
 
PeteCress said:
28 gets me a stump-pulling low gear.

That said, I get spun out in top gear at 18-19 mph.

But the motor is on a tadpole trike and not a bike and the trike has it's limitations - which make a really-low Low and not much of a High reasonable for a semi-cripple like me:
  • It's seriously heavy with the motor, battery, and all the junk I carry. 104# last time I weighed it, so it sucks pretty badly at climbing... but I ride it with electric assist as little as possible and I'm older than dirt - and the ultra-low 1st gear is easier on what's left of my knees.
  • IMHO, the thing lacks a bicycle's stability, so I don't really feel safe on it at much over 15 mph.
    • Steering is by turning instead of leaning. Try turning your bike's front wheel at anything faster than a slow walk and you will get the idea.
    • The suspension is minimalist: no shocks and less than inch of elastomer travel. I think bad things could happen hitting a bump or pothole at any kind of speed without the built-in suspension of standing on the pedals. No jumping obstacles...
If I could ride a bike, this thing would be on Craig's List tomorrow... but I can't and it beats hell out of lying on the couch all day.
Click to expand...
Congrats on getting out & about. Funny, you don't look old as dirt - must be the sunglasses.

I mostly errand ride on narrow roads - not good trike conditions.

We need more real world owner miles to be sure, but I'm optimistic about the Photon motor longevity.
 
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I mostly still ride my pedal bikes but I got a TSDZ2 about 2 or 3 years ago to convert an old hard tail I had laying around. Changed it to OSF along the way. The internals are still all original except for my copper cooling mod. But then I don't have more then maybe 500 miles on it. But as I get older and slower I can see the time coming when I will want to use an e-bike more. Hope the CYC Photon or similar with torque sensor proves to be a more reliable and lower maintenance option than TSDZ2. I may get one soon to try... or to perhaps convert my GF's hardtail, so I can get her out to ride with me more.

Wapous said:
The TSDZ2 motor is not expensive and gives good performance.
But its maintenance is frequent.
Click to expand...
 
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PeteCress said:
The avatar photo was taken long, long ago and far, far away.

If I can make it to July, I'll be 82
Click to expand...
I've a ways to go age-wise to catch up, though I feel like I'm there already. I'd love to try a trike and/or recumbent, powered only, but I'd only be able to ride "one-track" bikes most of the time. My rural roads are narrow, with no usable shoulder - just ditches.

True pedal-assist riding (versus throttling along) should gain back some leg strength, and I've lost 90 lbs so far, with another 90 to go.

Bolting together bikes has been a lifelong hobby for me - some are hopefully applied thought experiments, such as this AMTRAKed, then the GAP Trail & C&O Canal, Pittsburgh to D.C. tour purpose-built bike:

20230317_104158.jpg

I've got a few years to prove the bike & motor reliability and improve my riding abilities before taking a stab at the ride.
 
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