Allcell to introduce higher V, higher discharge A packs?

L

Lemlux

100 W
Joined
Mar 21, 2011
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I just read the following on San Diego Electric Bike's battery page in the AllCell section:

"60v 25ah (50amp BMS "Continuous") 18lbs price to be determined
Enquire about [present production!"

http://www.sdelectricbike.com/BATTERY.html

Today I fired off an email to Allcell's Greg Albright, Project Manager, and Scott Novak asking if and when higher V higher discharge C packs will become available.

Some of you may remember that Scott invited ES members to participate in a technical webinar on April 26, 2011. It was very interesting, and I've been waiting since then for the answer to the the question I again posed to the AllCell folks.
 
Interesting... isn't 2C what their current packs are rated for, though?
 
The current packs already "handle" 2C continuous. But that is stressing the battery. They only live because they have a heat dissipation material around them... that's it!

No discharge graphs have been posted, nobody has really tested them out and noted the voltage drop either.

These are, i believe, samsung 18650 laptop cells. Hence their high energy density, but low power density - which is their selling point.

Currently with batteries, you can't really have your cake ( small size/weight ) and eat it too ( high power ) with a cherry on top ( low price )..

So don't expect magic with a next generation. For best performance, these should be ran at 1C or lower. But they are so pricey...
 
Hmmm... I only need to draw 1000w... would it be a waste for me to look at the 48v12ah AllCells? How stressed would they be at 2c, do you suppose? Looks like no one is running these batteries here, at least not above 500w...

The Dow-Kokams from FFR Trikes seem to be a good option...
 
Phoebus said:
Hmmm... I only need to draw 1000w... would it be a waste for me to look at the 48v12ah AllCells? How stressed would they be at 2c, do you suppose? Looks like no one is running these batteries here, at least not above 500w...

The Dow-Kokams from FFR Trikes seem to be a good option...
Click to expand...

You'd be pushing the allcell pack, if that wattage is continuous or close to it. Don't expect it to last long.

They don't last all that long anyways - 500 cycles is not that great. Dow Kokams have 3-4 times the cycle life and equivalent or better discharge rates, at the cost of being a bit more expensive.


RC Lipo is about a third of the cost, only a bit heavier, 10 times more powerful, and the cycle life is only 200 cycles less. Ya wonder why most of us are RC Lipo junkies here.. and the allcell gets no love... ;D

Even A123 20AH is a smokin' deal compared to the allcell, great safety and cycle life ( well over 1000 cycles ) but it is notably heavier.
 
Thank you, neptronix.

My primary focus by far is weight, as I'm currently using a backpack battery.

Have a Dow-Kokam pack on the way, am using LiFe right now, but always looking at what else is out there... Can always use another pack for something : )
 
Yeah - this would be a good option for light weight, but it certainly has it's drawbacks.

If you want a *super* big pack, you can get the panasonic 18650's. They do about 1C or lower in real life.. but with a big enough pack, no big deal.
 
I have an 48v AllCell pack and it is awesome!. I bought mine from chicago electric bikes 9 months ago. I have noticed no voltage sag.. Performs great in the cold. I love how small the pack is.

:mrgreen:
 
No voltage sag? not possible, even a nanotech RC Lipo pack sags.
Even my 20 amp hour 20C RC Lipo pack sags on a 1.75C load.

You're telling me a 12AH 2C pack doesn't sag? kind sir.. i want some of whatever you are on :mrgreen:
 
If it does sag I don't notice it while riding.
 
:lol:

Yup, draw peak amps ( as in, point it up a hill so that the controller maxes out ), record the amps, record the voltage. Let the bike sit for about a minute, report the resting voltage... then from the resting voltage, loaded voltage, and amps, we can determine what the sag looks like.
 
Phoebus said:
Have a Dow-Kokam pack on the way...
Click to expand...

Can you provide any details about capacity, vendor? Thanks!
 
Thanks Phoebus!
 
Allcell's and SDelectricbike.com's websites have been modified to show the top Allcell pack voltage at 51.8V on the 25Ah pack up from 48V on the lower capacity packs. I understand that Allcell's 36V packs were 12S and the 48V packs were 15S. I imagine the 51.8V pack is 16S. Apparently no 60V pack yet.
 
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