E-Scooter project build. 50 kw peak (video online page 4)

ok. switch to mph let me go faster. but i hate this function can not turn off.

today i hit 300Amps first time. bike is FLYING! really crazy fast on highway. GPS speed was around 141kph but i didnt go faster because its too crazy
 
throttle is not throught CA. just use it to limit amps and LVC.

and kelly IS ALREADY in balanced mode. same shitty start current limit to 20-60A.
kelly worker said it cannot be changed. but when i go 50 and go full throttle its crazy
 
But how can your CA limit anything if the throttle wire is not routed through it? What is connected to your CA, only speedo and shunt, or something else?

And for the kelly it's little weird, I have keb series, I use torque mode and if I put the throttle to the max it instantly goes to the max current limit, even at low speed.
 
which one you have?
550A peak version? i have the best KEB can buy.
factory worker in direct contact with me and he say its a safety feature that current ramped down at low speed. i tried torque, balanced and speed mode. i think balanced is best but i really want more than 60A for start. factory worker feom kelly said its impossible.

CA is only external shunt and speed sensor.
i need limiter for LVC as kellys internal LVC SUCKS. if i put it on my lipos LVC at 64V the current ramped down looooooong before. thats annoying so i need use CA to limit. i only use green wire from throttle signal with shunt.

you say you have high current from zero? before i had a 100A china noname test controller and can do burnouts on gravel. with kelly no chance!
tell me what kelly you use and where? photo from your vehicle?
 
Well, I have the weakest keb, 48 V, 2 kW, on a 65 kg motorcycle.
It pumps up 83 A without problem from the start. But that is only wit everything on 100%, motor amps, battery amps, and speed limit.

You should try this - put everything in kelly to 100%, lower the lvc so that it doesn't cut current, and try without throttle green line connected to CA. CA could easily put some ramp on your throttle response, so try without it. I also think that you don't need it for lvc, I think that kelly's lvc is useful enough.
 
you misunderstand me. i already tried the kelly LVC and like i said: IT SUCKS! ramp down current even battery is still at 60%.
with CA i can use full power also when battery is only 30% left.

before i had no CA hooked up. same result. kellys internal LVC is at 18V. low enough? everything on 100%. maximum. also no smooth throttle or other shit.
throttle voltage is correct and i played around settings for DAYS. no kidding. i tried every damn combination. followed all your tips. even from other forums. result is same.
start up current is limited from 20-60A. only when i go faster like 30-40 it come SLOWLY up to 300A
if i hit 300A the scooter is already at nearly 80km/h.

fact is: kelly lie.
i never see 550A and my 70Ah 21s lipos with almost no voltage drop can handle that power without breaking a sweat. i also have best possible connections and cables. no andersons oder other plugs can limit power.
also the advertised "high start up current for faster starts" is a lie. kelly worker confirmed that.
whatever i do i cant get this shit thing up to 250Amps at start like the rubish noname china controller for 50$! its rediculos and sad.
i even asked them to send me a firmware to disable the stupid "safety features" at my own risk. they cant help me. if you can do that i give you 100 bucks cash in your hand! (like hack the firmware or tell me what i need to change that the controller "thinks2 its already at fast speed and give me more current from zero.
 
Well that doesn't sound good. I'm starting to think that maybe there is something wrong with controller. Maybe it has problems with your motor? Too low inductance?

One more thing that you can try, boost function. It should give 100% of power, at least I think so :mrgreen:

Maybe the KBL series doesn't have that limit at low speeds?
 
maybe.
but thats too much maybe to spend more money on kelly before i dont know for sure. thanks for the boost function. i just got a throttle with thumb button. need to figure out how to connect it. then i try

like i say: i pay 100$ cash if somebody can give me a solution for that. :idea:
 
As to the 550a limit, Kelly advertises their controllers using the phase current. Your controller may put out near 550a phase current when the current limiting is not in effect. The phase current is not measured by the cycle analyst, only battery current. You could put a clamp meter around a phase lead to determine the phase current. It would be impractical, but not impossible. There are also higher current Kelly controllers available. I have seen motorcycle builds with higher amp kelly controllers.

It is somewhat shady advertising to label the controllers that way, but the spec sheets do define phase and battery current limits.

There is at least a 1000a maximum phase current kelly controller, I think there is also a higher current 1200 phase amp burst controller.


Here is the 1000 phase amp controller:

http://kellycontroller.com/khb1210124-120v1000aopto-bldc-controllerwith-regen-p-738.html


It may suffer from the same low speed start current limiting, though, even if it does, the limit would probably be higher than the 550 phase amp controller you have.
 
steam25 said:
maybe.
but thats too much maybe to spend more money on kelly before i dont know for sure. thanks for the boost function. i just got a throttle with thumb button. need to figure out how to connect it. then i try

like i say: i pay 100$ cash if somebody can give me a solution for that. :idea:

I think it's done by connecting brake button to 5 V instead of ground.

But check that one more time, I'm not 100% sure.
 
hi,
yes i forgot about that. in that case my controller works fine at 300A battery current for short time.
problem is still the ramp down at start.
i still dont get why it must be THAT low.
i mean let it be 100A always at start instead of 250A with a 50$ 24FET. but come on! 20 amps? is kelly kidding me?! climbing up to 60A for first 50meter?

i cant even get up small sidewalks or start at a slight hill without pushing it with my feets since i put that kelly in.
and i will definetly not but a new much more expensive kelly and just HOPE it will be little better.

would you?


ok thanks i try the brake button after read more
 
I wouldn't go with a more expensive kelly and hope unless you could like get kelly to loan you one to try and allow you to pay the difference and keep the new one instead if it helped. The other option would be to return the kelly complaining that it doesn't perform as advertised and go for a different option such as one of the links I posted before.

I didn't realize the current limiting was so extensive. That seems ridiculous that it can't even start on a hill seeing as it is a sensors controller. I would check to make sure that all of your Hall effect sensors in the hub motor are performing properly as that could be cause for the motor not performing well or losing sync at low speed and high load. I wouldn't really be happy paying that much for a controller that can't even start my bike without a push.


Just my $.02

Do what's best for you. Let me know if you want any more advice or info on the other options. I'm glad to help. This is a really interesting project to see going. And I would love to do something very similar if I had the money.
 
Many people have had many problems with kelly controllers. Here is a thread when someone had many current limiting. They were able to get kelly to replace it with bigger controller which helped, but they still had the current limiting issues and eventually moved in to more powerfully and honestly advertised controllers. I would at least pursue a replacement (hopefully higher rated controller) from kelly if it's on their dime.

http://visforvoltage.org/forum/4066-kelly-controllers-junk-no-refund-or-replacement-will-be-given?page=1
 
thank you guys. i try talk to them. no replace, no refund. no help from kelly.

i have very good experience with quanshun motors. professional service, very nice and the motor is incredible.
battery factory soso. cells are good but how they build the pack not. i need repair/replace everything and now its good.
controller... well i said enough about kelly and i am very disappointed in service or quality.

halls are fine. i have 2 sets of halls inside the motor in case 1 are damaged. tested both. its definetly kelly.
dont get me wrong. controller is fine and if you want a normal scooter for city the power is ok.
but after i saw what the 24FET can do i thought kelly will let me
paint black lines on street when i start on gravel. power is awesome if i am faster than 40-50kph. but before it feels like you run a way too large turbocharger on a 1000ccm engine. aloooooot lag and when you expect it less, power comes so hard that it gets uncontrollable. if i am on a little sandy street and start from zero nothing happen at beginning. scooter start slowly. after hit 30 the power kicks in so hard that it want go sideways.
just feels wrong for an electric motor.
today i try change setting to torque one more time and try change throttle.

i know this scooter is more like a toy to many people and not so professional as other builds i saw here, so i really appreciate your help guys. i try what you suggest. then we see.
 
I didn't think the halls were the problem, my bets were in the kelly. Just figured it was best to check before you blame kelly. Not that they dint deserve the blame.


Good luck. Look forward to seeing how it all turns out.
 
i checked. i told the kelly worker about my settings, wiring, battery and motor. he said its normal and should be like this. ramp down current at low speed is a "safety feature" to protect the controller.

i talked to another factory where i got my 24FET for test. they told me that kelly use cheap FETs and thats a reason they do this. i still think the controller could do better if we could disable the crazy strict safety feature we all hate so much.
quanshun offered me to work together and make a profile for sevcon. but i am not sure i want to go that way now. i have no time and mood to sit down a week and study how to do it. i also wrote email to sevcon. told them about my project and i am in china near there factory. wether they can help me. i didnt even get an answer...soooo if there service start like this i am not sure i want do this to myself. if something happen i get no help from sevcon too.
 
Maybe you could check new line of golden motor controllers:

VEC500.jpg


http://www.goldenmotor.com/

Just press on motor controllers on the left menu.
 
i had alot GM stuff before. bad experience and i also know the factory boss. thanks for advice though...i think about it. :idea:


today santa came and bring some stuff. in case of fire i will install that on my scooter now. :mrgreen: :idea:

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and i bought 7 x 12V modified 35A (actually 33A but they run 35A@12,6V now)

they have already build in fans but my experience tell me they get freakin hot. so i use 7 high powered 80mm fans for extra cooling later.
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7pcs @12,6V in series is 88,2V =PERFECT!
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i strap them together. quick and dirty. connect all 230V input ports to parallel and the 12V outputs in series to get 88,2V and VOILA!
cheap 45$ and 35A 3000W charger is done. :mrgreen:

a real 30A charger would be much bigger and around 500$

35amps should be good to charge my battery finish in about 2 hours and if i want get crazy later i just add another 7pcs to double the current
 
then you are welcome to my wonderland. work here is so easy.

ok there are some news:

i made another long distance test. 80% city and 20% highway.
some parts i tried to go energy safing. and other time i really floored it for minutes while stop and go.

motor temperature outside never over 65C° (laser thermometer)
battery temp. 28C°
BMS temp. 26C°
controller temp never over 45C° (the fans i put on would never start to run i think)
enviroment temp was 26-30C°


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distance all day riding around different citys and have a ton of fun with the scooter was aroun 90km
i used 56Ah from 70Ah

often go max speed and draw nearly 300Amps from battery- noooo problem at all that battery takes it like a boss! 8)

even at the end of my journey the scooter have alot punch and is just little slower as before. still draw 290Amps easy at end of charge and goes like the wind. just faster. :mrgreen:


i also finished my quick&dirty 35A charger. its working perfectly and i am happy to have a 50$ 3000W charger now to fill up my battery when i need go outside quick again.
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if you guys have a motorbike, bike or scooter and need a good battery to fair prices let me know. i start to work with this factory now and they can also make bike batteries in frame shape with build in BMS.
this for example is a customer batterie which have 72V and 20Ah. BMS can peak 100Amps and 50A continuous.

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