Mountain Bike Action Magazine/Hi Torque needs to go away!

[mdd0127]

Hi Everyone,

I've been buying Mountain Bike Action for a while now to keep up with the new stuff that's coming out and a couple of their articles really got to me in the last two days. I've never written to a magazine before, muchless posted about one online, but we need to expose crap in the media when we come across it.

So, in the new issue, I read an article that made me steaming mad. I can't find a link to it online and won't recommend buying the issue but the jist of it was that bikes with big travel make people want to ride off the trails and mess things up for everyone else so they should be banned from everything but resorts or races. The idea that an internationally distributed magazine about mountain biking is suggesting that people start banning certain kinds of bikes from public trails enraged me. The people riding the bikes off the trails are the ones to blame for the environmental damage. How about an article suggesting ways to identify and educate/punish people that don't use the trails respectfully? How about a good article reminding people that's it's bad form to go out and tear up the trails when it's muddy? There are so many other ideas that need to be brought up more often because they're IMPORTANT, that the drivel about legislating what kind of bike someone should ride is infuriating.

Also, a little funny is the fact that the same issue that contains the "ban DH bikes" article contains a multi page spread showcasing all of the new gravity bikes. I wonder if the manufacturers of these bikes know how the publication feels about their "legality" on public trails.

Here's a copy of my email to the editor regarding that issue:

Hi Jim,

I just made it through the article about banning downhill type bikes on page 20 of the April edition and if the person that feels this way is working on future editions, I won't be buying them .

If you haven't read the article, you should.....I'm hoping you didn't and it just snuck past you.....anyway

My wife and I ride "downhill" bikes everywhere. We both have 27 speeds and dual crown forks. We both quit riding due to knee and shoulder injuries that we can't afford to get fixed and just started again a few months ago because we discovered big travel.

My old bike was a 4 inch travel Diamond Back Coil. I've had nicer ones in the past but my blown out knees didn't warrant a nice bike. On the Coil, riding the tough trails around Durango and Cortez, CO, was brutal and nearly impossible. The trails are very rocky with roots, ledges, and jumps. I couldn't ride for more than half an hour before my knees and shoulder were done. I basically put bikes away until I got to ride a friend's downhill bike and noticed how the plush suspension made my whole body feel better. I also noticed than instead of spending a bunch of energy trying to pick lines around softball sized rocks in the trail, I could just roll right over them, concentrating on my form and pace, and best of all, the scenery. I can ride again! I don't care if it's heavy! I'm also the type of guy that tears regular frames, forks and wheels up easily while only riding moderately. The supple ride, confidence, and reliability of a downhill type bike are just worth it.

My "new" bike is a Haro MX-3 with custom links and a longer Vanilla RC that's running around 9 inches of overall travel. The fork is a Manitou Dorado Pro DH Carbon. XTR components, etc. It weighs around 40 lbs and I don't mind at all. My wife had quit riding as well so we got her a Specialized FSR DH with a Dorado DH. She loves it and rides a few times a week.

So, just because the author of that article doesn't like the typical DH crowd that just bombs anything, he shouldn't be suggesting that people start sticking their noses into the kind of bikes that other people CHOOSE to ride. Sure, I wear army pants, combat boots, and a hoody and ride a 40 lb bike through the woods down the horse trails. I wouldn't have it any other way. I bet if I put on spandex and rode a carbon xc bike I'd fly.......

By the way, I'm in the process of building a bike that's going to throw the whole industry upside down and redefine the ultimate 2 wheeled machine. It's time to put the weight hype and $7000 taiwan made bike trends to rest. Enjoy it while you can.

Very disappointed.

Today, I went to their website to see if the article was posted there and see maybe if I could post my letter as a comment. I saw a link to this on the first page and decided to start a public information campaign.

http://www.mbaction.com/ME2/dirmod.asp?sid=&nm=&type=news&mod=News&mid=9A02E3B96F2A415ABC72CB5F516B4C10&tier=3&nid=46E54141A74B48C298972559355CD9D2


Those who oppose closed minded, ignorant drivel mass in media should let MTB Action know how you feel.

Electric assist bikes ridden by RESPONSIBLE people have just as much right to be on the trails as anyone else. It's up to the user to be safe and ride appropriately. We don't ban Jeeps because they "could" be driven over curbs. Should we ban fixies and unicycles too??? Please let them know how you feel if you agree.

The Editor's email address is: mbaction@hi-torque.com

 

[John in CR]

What environmental damage? Did someone put a tire mark on some spotted owl droppings or something similar? Enviro-freaks are just as bad as the religious freaks that go around killing people in the name of religion. If they're so worried about the environment why aren't they all on planes to Japan to volunteer to go in and get the job done regardless of the cost.

 

[vanilla ice]

They will be assimilated.

 

[dogman dan]

Depends on the location I guess. Destination riding places could be getting trashed. I was watching a DH competition the othe day, and comparing it to the local rock crawler competion. Localy, the 4x4 competition is catching hell because the people on foot watching it step on a cactus or some grass, and the footsteps create a trail to the good watching place. Anyway, watching the bike competion, I was thinking good thing what I'm seeing isn't happening here. Folks would be getting a rope.

Anyway, places like Moab or whatever could be getting pretty torn up with the freestyle riding. I can't see banning the type of bike being the solution. But if you want to ban that kind of riding, then you have to police it. The comunity of riders will have to police themselves to turn it around.

 

[Ypedal]

bunch of tree hugging hippies... :lol:

seriously tho, the damage done on a bicycle is nothing when you look at the big picture, no belching 2 stroke fumes, no oil and grease spills ( other than chain grease stains on pant legs.. ) and only noise is from hoots and hollering of people having fun outdoors.

I love riding trails, i grew up in the country and spent many years hacking away at my own trail network in my parents 200 acre back yard to get into the logging roads, you want to talk about destroying nature you should look at the tree harvesters they have now, they can rape a forest in days what would take a lumberjack years to cover.. a 2" rubber tire on a bicycle seems pretty tame in comparison..

 

[dnmun]

i totally agree with bill on this and disagree with gaston about the use of timber harvesters to cut, limb and length the timber as it is cut. they have revolutionized timber harvesting, even though it takes only a few guys to harvest the same amount of timber as it did when i was a kid and we had truckloads of loggers, flatheads as they were called, who would have to be carried into the woods to fell the timber, then limb it and then cut it to length. by far the most dangerous job in the world. harvesters also have minimal impact on the ground too, able to place the felled timber where the skidders could reach them in one place without skidding them all together first. a huge improvement in maintaining the forest.

we had hundreds of thousands of acres of timber we had to care for, for the full length of the 99 year leases, and it was almost impossible to keep people out of the woods we owned, because they felt they had the right to go anywhere they could if their 4 wheel drive truck would get them through. these people would go out in the woods and just destroy the roads by driving them when they were way too muddy for travel and make ruts so bad we would have to waste weeks repairing the damage they caused and our expense entirely. they would cut the locks off the gates on the roads into the timber, drive around the gates by taking off through the woods to get back onto the road on the other side, or do whatever they wanted unless there was someone there to stop them. they would find our dozers and other equipment in the woods and steal the batteries and fuel, sometimes they would shoot up the equipment with their guns, so we could never leave equipment in the woods over the weekend even or it would be vandalized. i am talking 10 miles off the paved road in the atchafalya swamps, yet they felt it was their right to go where ever they wanted even though it was private property, they had been sold on how the 4 wheel drive was their ticket to freedom and they used it in the most destructive way possible, tearing up the roads to the max, making it impassable for those of us who had to work in the woods, on our own property.

then the guns, they would just shoot up everything, when the logs would get to the mill, there was a time before about 1965 when we used to be able to send them through the sawmill after debarking and just cut them up into lumber. then after a while there was so many bullets embedded in the trees that the bandsaw would hit the bullets and tear the band saw blade apart while it was running at high speed, about 80 mph, and when it exploded the entire bandsaw blade would fly out of the head rig tearing up the head rig itself and sometimes injuring the head rig lumber puller who had to stand with a few feet of the head rig to pull the boards over onto the conveyor. there once was a time when people just used the guns with some discrimination to hunt, but at a certain point it seems like people just go out to shoot and shoot and shoot.

so then they had to install metal detectors in front of the headrig to stop the logs from going into the saw which had bullets in them, or the big nails people would use to nail the hunting blinds onto the trees with in the woods. this is all because of the idea people had that they had the right to go hunt and kill the animals on our property just because they could get out there in their 4 wheel drive pickup truck.

this is the same mentality of the guys who go tear up the woods by riding off the trails and tearing up the undergrowth, because they don't have any use for the woods except as their recreation, that their need for the xtreme fix of adrenaline is more important than the need to be respectful of others rights to use the woods also.

sorry should not have hijacked bill's protest with my rant, but he is spot on in this.

 

[sk8norcal]

i have to check out that article...

I believe MBA have always being pro-moto..
i read a lot of their testers ride moto cross...

main problem is speed...
dh bikes makes it easier to go faster downhill...
thus complaints from other trail users..

 

[mdd0127]

When it comes down to it, people with no respect are the problem, whether it's going too fast, or off the trail, or just consuming air around us in general. It is possible to go fast, have fun, respect the trail, and respect other users. I was riding a few weeks ago and cruising along at maybe 20mph. There is one little three foot jump at this place and I hit it at the perfect second to intercept some hikers. They were about fifteen feet down the trail from where I landed but instead of ripping past them, I grabbed a handful of brakes mid air, and landed at a complete stop, the suspension sucking it up completely, immediately said hi and struck up a conversation about how beautiful of a day it was. They were surprised for a second when I came over the hill but that was it. They hiked on and had a great day and we passed on the trails a few times. If I would have come over that jump, landed right behind them, tore off the trial for a second, and sped on, they would have been outraged and rightfully so. Having 8 inch rotors and a supple suspension can make you go faster but it can also stop you faster too.

About the downhill bikes could go faster downhill thing..... since a twenty year old rider can go faster down hill than a 60 year old rider, should we ban twenty year old riders from the trails??? What tricky territory we get into when trying to legislate what COULD happen.


Anyway, I've been working on trying to figure out a way to identify and educate riders that don't respect the trails/other riders without having to confront them on the trail and the best thing I can come up with for popular trails is a number system. Everyone gets a number and wears it, just like a race. The local bike shop could issue them, keeping a name/address/number log, and there could be signage at the trail head letting riders know that they need a number and where to get one. I think a lot of people are good nice people and just don't know better. If they got a letter from the bike shop saying, "Hey, your number has been reported riding like an a-hole and tearing up the trails.", they would have a chance to either better themselves, or get banned. The only user policing that would need to happen would be making sure people on the trails have a number and reporting them to the Sheriff or BLM ranger if they don't want to comply. It sucks people just can't be nice and my wife hates it when I tell people how I think on the trail so this is the best thing I can come up with. And of course, this is only for popular trails/areas with heavy traffic.

Anyway....back to work...

 

[gogo]

This is the trend in most media. Say whatever sells rag and makes you money in the process.

 

[sk8norcal]

^ possibly...

yah, I don't see how they can regulate the bikes people ride...

I used to mt bike in the 90's, and remembered reading about rangers with radar guns....

edit:
ranger at 0:23
(2010 bay area)
[youtube]2gKfDRbLllI[/youtube]

 

[sk8norcal]

http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=694587

http://www.vitalmtb.com/forums/The-Hub,2/DH-bike-ban-MBA-at-it-again,5516

 

[mdd0127]

He wrote back!

Here's his response:

Hey Michael:

We got massive feedback on that story and most was from upset riders like you who hated the opinion. I’m running a lot of letters in the next issue (July) and I’ll continue to run them for as long as they come it.

This may sound nuts to you, but I love the uproar the story created. It will be great to follow up over the next few months and keep track of the opinions.

Jim "Jimmy Mac" McIlvain
Editor
Mountain Bike Action

And mine:

Hi Jim,

I've never written to a magazine about an article before and for sure not started a thread about one online but this article hit hard on many fronts. It's not just because I choose to ride a style of bike that was targeted by the article.

The part that really riled me up was the reactionary banning of something based on what it could do in the wrong hands. This is a HUGE problem with the way we live and I'm hearing more and more people talk about liability, insurance, and banning than ever before. As Jello Biafra once said, "We have to rise above the need for cops and laws!" Banning "things" based upon what they could be used for is anti freedom and only a solution for people that don't have the basic skills to be human in the first place. Laws don't change people, they make businesses money. The only thing that will change anything is teaching people make a stand to protect their environment, their freedom, and their right to be respected by others. In our case, which is disrespectful trail users, of any kind, not downhill bikes, taking this stand by confronting people of the trail probably isn't the best idea but something should be able to be worked out by the intelligent, respectful riders of the community.

Like I said before, I posted a thread about this article on an electric bike forum I frequent( Gasp!!!! Electric bikes!!!). Anyway, I also browsed many similar threads on other mountain bike specific forums, and if your article was a publicity stunt, I think it failed drastically.

Here's one of my posts from the thread I started showing an example of a more thought out way of addressing the same subject, along with a suggestion about how to actually fix things instead of creating more conflict.

"My Post from above- When it comes down to it........ people with no respect are the problem ................etc."



Maybe it would be a good idea when considering potentially offensive/ignorant articles for future editions to consider the following things:

1. Is this my personal opinion based upon ignorance, emotion and fear?

2. Is this generally negative and finger pointing in nature?

3. Could this cause conflicts on the trail?

4. Will this offend my readers?

5. Will this offend my advertisers?

6. Will this make me look closed minded, and short sighted?

If the answer to any of these questions is "yes", it's probably not a good idea to print it

I might flip through the new issue in the grocery store and get a laugh at the responses but when I'm done, the whole stack of MBA's is going behind WWE magazine. In this case, your opinion is obvious and not something you can really take back. Buying your magazine is paying your paycheck and until I see a whole issue dedicated to personal responsibility, respectful trail use, tolerance of other trail users regardless of what they're riding, less lycra snob attitude, and just an overall more positive attitude, paying your paycheck makes me want to puke a little.

Other people's ideas were much worse than the WWE coverup. One guy suggested collecting all of the subscription forms, writing little notes about his feelings on them and mailing them back to you on your dime. I got a little chuckle out of that one.

Anyway, good luck at the new garbage man job......

 

[mdd0127]

I just read about the CEO of Hi-Torque, the publishers. I was looking for his email to copy him on the email above. Not worth the trouble.... He's a KOOK supreme. I will be boycotting all Hi-Torque publications from now on.

Here's the tip of the iceberg:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/evilbike.html

Quite a few nice threads about him on other forums too. A real open minded, logical, kind soul .....that was sarcasm by the way.

 

[etard]

It sounds like a good marketing ploy to me. They get the readers all riled up and now you have an army of worker ants going to the internet and directing traffic to the offending magazine website. It would be interesting to see the raise in traffic for that website over last month. I have read that magazine in the store (never bought one) and it always contains a lot of nice big pictures, but doesn't have much content when compared to Dirt Rag or any other magazine that tests bikes that cost less than your first born child.

On the subject of trail damage, yes it is a problem, I'm sure, but the main problem is people riding above their skill level and blowing through switchbacks and around rock gardens, and here in SoCal riding in the mud is the biggest issue because it sometimes doesn't rain for months so the tracks left stay rock hard all summer. There will always be a few that ruin it for everybody, just wait till a lobbyist group like MADD gets angry at Ebikes after thier precious child dies on one of these multi KW beasts in a Lipo fueled blaze of glory. You ain't seen nothin yet!

Maybe there should be some manufactured certified test that is implemented before you can take ownership of any bike over 5" of travel. Wouldn't that be something?