deepfraught
100 W
beachcruiser said:
^ mine is from Paul and does not have throttle at assist 0, I think it was neptronix who found the same. Maybe ask to be sure.
New Bafang Crank-Drives
- Thread starter d8veh
- Start date
^ mine is from Paul and does not have throttle at assist 0, I think it was neptronix who found the same. Maybe ask to be sure.
Kepler
10 MW
beachcruiser said:
Cool. Very close to me. Got a bike with you?
beachcruiser
100 mW
Kepler said:
Unfortunately no. 3 kids instead :lol:
astmacca
100 W
quote] mine is from Paul and does not have throttle at assist 0, I think it was neptronix who found the same. Maybe ask to be sure. [/quote]
The below info was from Paul a couple of weeks ago when i inquired direct with him.
" BBS02 kits are programmed with 100% throttle no matter the assist level (including 0 setting) selected and it is also configured so that you have almost full power available immediately when the throttle is opened. The kits are now programmed with 100% speed for all PAS settings and current settings that start from 20% in assist 1 and increase in 10% steps up to 100% in assist level 9. You also have high steady state power available from the PAS as this value has been increased over the factory setting. Speed limit is set by the display and can be adjusted to a max of 50km/h, it is not possible to completely remove the speed limit. The number of PAS assist levels and the wheel size are also set from the display. "
Whoo Hooo! Just got an email from Moon @ EM3ev. The non-battery part of my setup has just been sent off.
I have to say that dealing with Paul @ EM3ev has been great so far. I have been a bit of a pain with lots of questions even before i actually ordered anything but all emails answered clearly in a couple of days at most.
Definitely recommend them as a mob to deal with as they seem to be intent on building and maintaining a good rep among buyers.
The below info was from Paul a couple of weeks ago when i inquired direct with him.
" BBS02 kits are programmed with 100% throttle no matter the assist level (including 0 setting) selected and it is also configured so that you have almost full power available immediately when the throttle is opened. The kits are now programmed with 100% speed for all PAS settings and current settings that start from 20% in assist 1 and increase in 10% steps up to 100% in assist level 9. You also have high steady state power available from the PAS as this value has been increased over the factory setting. Speed limit is set by the display and can be adjusted to a max of 50km/h, it is not possible to completely remove the speed limit. The number of PAS assist levels and the wheel size are also set from the display. "
Whoo Hooo! Just got an email from Moon @ EM3ev. The non-battery part of my setup has just been sent off.
I have to say that dealing with Paul @ EM3ev has been great so far. I have been a bit of a pain with lots of questions even before i actually ordered anything but all emails answered clearly in a couple of days at most.
Definitely recommend them as a mob to deal with as they seem to be intent on building and maintaining a good rep among buyers.
Geebee
1 kW
Do people alter the PAS setting much whilst riding?
I have 2 different recumbent trikes and was thinking that if I fit the display to the boom, I could just swap the boom (would need to make a sleeve as different diameter) to either trike and then only have to swap the battery over?
Does that sound about right? that way I get 2 crank assist trikes for the cost of 1
I have 2 different recumbent trikes and was thinking that if I fit the display to the boom, I could just swap the boom (would need to make a sleeve as different diameter) to either trike and then only have to swap the battery over?
Does that sound about right? that way I get 2 crank assist trikes for the cost of 1
astmacca
100 W
Well on my OH's bike (not Bafang, an Aseako mid drive) which has 3 levels i do all the time depending on the slope, headwind and state of the knees.
The lowest level isn't so useful, but the mid and high levels are. I dont know how they are actually programmed though.
I actually think the 9 levels on the Bafang will be good although i suspect i will mainly use 2 to 4 on mine since 4 will give me 250W assist (should be equivalent to the top level i am used to on the OH's bike?) and that has been plenty on my normal commute.
I reckon if i make changes after i get this running it will be more with the front chain ring than programming. I'm getting the 46T instead of the 48T initially and will see how that goes. My bike currently has 42T that works nicely for me and so i think i'll save to buy an adaptor to std fit chain rings.
eMax
100 W
Geebee said:Do people alter the PAS setting much whilst riding?
I have 2 different recumbent trikes and was thinking that if I fit the display to the boom, I could just swap the boom (would need to make a sleeve as different diameter) to either trike and then only have to swap the battery over?
Does that sound about right? that way I get 2 crank assist trikes for the cost of 1
PAS on these kits works really nicely. However 9 levels is probably overkill for most I prefer around 5 at 20% increments. Check you PM
Liberator team finished new bike, called Liberator Chilly, with 36V 350W BBS motor and 36V 20 Ah battery:
More pictures in Liberator topic:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=36503&start=50
Even more in FB page:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Särtsuratas/475677072509113#!/pages/Särtsuratas/475677072509113
I had opportunity to do a short test ride with it and it was comfortable and fun ride as with every Liberator In PAS level 3 motor had enough power to move Chilly pretty fast on flat ground. I hope to do a little comparison with Chilly and Little Blue, as first has 36V 350W and second 48V 750W motor. Even though bikes aren’t identical (weight, gearing, etc), I would like to find out how motors perform on flat and on rise and does my “bottom-meter” feel the difference
More pictures in Liberator topic:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=36503&start=50
Even more in FB page:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Särtsuratas/475677072509113#!/pages/Särtsuratas/475677072509113
I had opportunity to do a short test ride with it and it was comfortable and fun ride as with every Liberator
In PAS level 3 motor had enough power to move Chilly pretty fast on flat ground. I hope to do a little comparison with Chilly and Little Blue, as first has 36V 350W and second 48V 750W motor. Even though bikes aren’t identical (weight, gearing, etc), I would like to find out how motors perform on flat and on rise and does my “bottom-meter” feel the difference 32km/h is a very fast average speed considering you are only using 7wh/km, also I have never seen anyone posting such low 7 wh/km on a normal bicycle before over such a long ride so you must have been working very hard !
Maybe this is a factor why your BBs02 motor and gears have lasted so many km's compared to others who has failed very early, it has an easy life as you are doing half the work??? Actually this average wh/km over long distances maybe a good indicator for people to know how fast their kit may wear out. Some unfit person with little peddling that uses 14wh/km per battery charge would wear out his gears twice as fast then someone who gest 7wh/km on the same trip.
It would be interesting to know what efficiency you get and avg speed with low peddling so these type or riders who won't peddle much know what to expect wh/km and avg speed as your above figures are amazing !
Maybe you could compare the same trip but at the half way point ? that way your existing battery is big enough.
eMax
100 W
MargoC said:
This is the best thing I have seen in a long time. Well done! Bravo! Õnnitlen!
opperpanter
100 W
I am planning on a BB02 750W build, but I am wondering what the most efficent RPM range for the BBS02 is.
Does anybody know or have an estimated guess?
The specs says the RPM is 112, which I think is max RPM? Will it run (only) efficient around that range, or possible already from 50% RPM?
Reason to know is to decide on the chainring and gearing I'll be ordering with it.
Standard 46T x 28T gives a whopping 25km/h as *minimum* speed at 100RPM.
Does anybody know or have an estimated guess?
The specs says the RPM is 112, which I think is max RPM? Will it run (only) efficient around that range, or possible already from 50% RPM?
Reason to know is to decide on the chainring and gearing I'll be ordering with it.
Standard 46T x 28T gives a whopping 25km/h as *minimum* speed at 100RPM.
astmacca
100 W
Interesting.
On another thread about fault finding and problems i came across a post by user teslanv which said in part:
" I would check to see what the Low Voltage Cut-off is set to. If it is much lower than 36V that may be why your display is reading full so long."
Now i got a reply from Paul @ EM3ev today to a query about batteries and LVC. He reckons:
" We do not normally change the LVC settings of the controller, they are configured to 30V LVC as standard. The battery is protected by dangerously low discharge by the BMS that is installed. 40V is s typical LVC for such a battery, we can set it to that if you want? "
Now that makes sense to me, the LVC actually being done by the battery BMS, especially if you are selling kits where people are fitting a whole range of different batteries.
But if it is set that low, is that what makes the stock displays battery indicator inaccurate on these units?
Would that indicator be more useful / accurate if the LVC in the controller was set to the same as the battery BMS and perhaps the High Voltage Cutoff (i think there is a setting for that??) setting in the controller was set just above what the battery actually is reading as voltage when its freshly charged ??
On another thread about fault finding and problems i came across a post by user teslanv which said in part:
" I would check to see what the Low Voltage Cut-off is set to. If it is much lower than 36V that may be why your display is reading full so long."
Now i got a reply from Paul @ EM3ev today to a query about batteries and LVC. He reckons:
" We do not normally change the LVC settings of the controller, they are configured to 30V LVC as standard. The battery is protected by dangerously low discharge by the BMS that is installed. 40V is s typical LVC for such a battery, we can set it to that if you want? "
Now that makes sense to me, the LVC actually being done by the battery BMS, especially if you are selling kits where people are fitting a whole range of different batteries.
But if it is set that low, is that what makes the stock displays battery indicator inaccurate on these units?
Would that indicator be more useful / accurate if the LVC in the controller was set to the same as the battery BMS and perhaps the High Voltage Cutoff (i think there is a setting for that??) setting in the controller was set just above what the battery actually is reading as voltage when its freshly charged ??
tungsten2k
100 mW
I'm this close --><-- to pulling the trigger on a 750w BBS02 kit but am concerned since I've never ridden any speed-sensing mid-drive. I did test ride the Felt with mid-drive Bosch setup at New Wheel here in SF and it was dreamy. If money weren't an object, I would buy it in a heartbeat (and from New Wheel - great shop). Obviously the Bafang can't match the smoothness of the Bosch torque sensing, but how "not close" ? Is there anyone with a BBS0x in SF willing to meet up to let me take a short ride on it ? Philz coffee is on me !
-=dave
-=dave
tomjasz
1 GW
The Bafang may not be as smooth but it WILL leave the Bosch in the dust. From everything I've read the Bosch is limited to 20MPH and there's a big power difference between the two kits. Knowing and having pedaled around SF in my youth, and riding a 8fun 350W currently, I'd definitely want a 750W for SF riding. Just make certain you use one of the few consistently reliable sources for purchase and leave those Felt kids in the dust.tungsten2k said:I'm this close --><-- to pulling the trigger on a 750w BBS02 kit but am concerned since I've never ridden any speed-sensing mid-drive. I did test ride the Felt with mid-drive Bosch setup at New Wheel here in SF and it was dreamy. If money weren't an object, I would buy it in a heartbeat (and from New Wheel - great shop). Obviously the Bafang can't match the smoothness of the Bosch torque sensing, but how "not close" ? Is there anyone with a BBS0x in SF willing to meet up to let me take a short ride on it ? Philz coffee is on me !
-=dave
T
opperpanter
100 W
I have a front hub with PAS and it's not smooth at all, the BBS02 won't be neither (check youtube).tomjasz said:The Bafang may not be as smooth but it WILL leave the Bosch in the dust. From everything I've read the Bosch is limited to 20MPH and there's a big power difference between the two kits. Knowing and having pedaled around SF in my youth, and riding a 8fun 350W currently, I'd definitely want a 750W for SF riding. Just make certain you use one of the few consistently reliable sources for purchase and leave those Felt kids in the dust.tungsten2k said:I'm this close --><-- to pulling the trigger on a 750w BBS02 kit but am concerned since I've never ridden any speed-sensing mid-drive. I did test ride the Felt with mid-drive Bosch setup at New Wheel here in SF and it was dreamy. If money weren't an object, I would buy it in a heartbeat (and from New Wheel - great shop). Obviously the Bafang can't match the smoothness of the Bosch torque sensing, but how "not close" ? Is there anyone with a BBS0x in SF willing to meet up to let me take a short ride on it ? Philz coffee is on me !
-=dave
T
But it as said above, the bafang will have loads of power compared to the Bosch.
tomjasz
1 GW
Link please, lots of choices...opperpanter said:
Thanks,
T
opperpanter
100 W
I think this one has lots of info. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLngOq7jWnM
Althought he is wrong about the throttle, because you can set the throttle to work 100% in every PAS level or even without PAS.
Althought he is wrong about the throttle, because you can set the throttle to work 100% in every PAS level or even without PAS.
tomjasz
1 GW
Thanks, still not sure what this "smooth" is that you're on about in PAS. Frankly I expected given your critique that you'd link to someone reviewing the motor in SF as the poster is referring to. Do you ride a BBS0X?
opperpanter
100 W
I think at some point he explains that it takes a little time before the motor picks up after moving the pedals.tomjasz said:
I am not saying it's not good (I will be buying one soon), but just wanted to inform the "asker" about the big difference between PAS and Bosch torquesensor based systems.
tomjasz
1 GW
We have differing experiences. I can'r compare since I haven't ridden the Bosch, but a well tuned BBS0X hasn't a delay that I find excessive or irritating. And for the 2 grand left in my pocket it performs very well. BTW having owned Bosch appliances I'm not particularly enamored by the brands reliability.
KINNINVIEKID
1 kW
My BBS02 Pas kicks in after a third of a revolution of the crank so not much delay at all.
My throttle speed is also just slightly above PAS speed in every setting.
My throttle speed is also just slightly above PAS speed in every setting.
tungsten2k
100 mW
opperpanter said:I have a front hub with PAS and it's not smooth at all, the BBS02 won't be neither (check youtube).tomjasz said:The Bafang may not be as smooth but it WILL leave the Bosch in the dust.tungsten2k said:I'm this close --><-- to pulling the trigger on a 750w BBS02 kit but am concerned ... Obviously the Bafang can't match the smoothness of the Bosch torque sensing, but how "not close" ? Is there anyone with a BBS0x in SF willing to meet up to let me take a short ride on it ? Philz coffee is on me !
But it as said above, the bafang will have loads of power compared to the Bosch.
The Bosch had enough power for me (up and down both sides of Bernal lickety-split, but still feeling like I was riding a bicycle and not an electric scooter). My motivation is that I live at the very top of Mt. San Bruno and the 1200' vertical climb right before getting home makes me ride less for pleasure outings (meet people downtown, etc), and end up driving more. I don't mind a 1200' vertical climb when I'm out on Mt. Tam for that sole purpose, but to go to the store and back, it's tedious.
The PAS smoothness issue being referred to in the other video is probably similar to the same guy reviewing the 350W here (I've watched most of these videos already): http://youtu.be/Lj1Z2Mh4gWs?t=7m28s
Anyway, I'll keep searching for someone local that might be interested in helping out.
I'm also considering just getting it anyway, with the expectation of possibly retro-fitting a better-designed PAS system at a later date (assuming we're on the cusp of a big shift in PAS integration quality).
Thanks for the input !
-=dave
redcliffs-rider
10 µW
Here is an installation movie for people wanting to see how it all goes on the bike.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia8lpz5J1pI
Paul
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia8lpz5J1pI
Paul
stompatompa
100 mW
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2014
- Messages
- 36
Prefect mechanic-nails!
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