Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

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VasiliSk   100 W

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Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by VasiliSk » Jan 12 2016 3:01pm

Nucular controller 12F
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[+] photos
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Maximum power 10 000W (80V+)
Nominal power 5 000W (80V+)
Voltage range 35-90V
Phase max 200A
Battery max~120A
Supply out: 12V 1A, 5V for sensors, each line 100mA PPTC
Bluetooth 4.0
Limiting temperature +80°C
Phase wires 8AWG XT150
Battery wires 10AWG XT90
Size without wires 86*43*125
Weight 525g
Control modes: Square, sensorless, FOC, charger
Temperature and hardware overcurrent protection
Sleep current less 300uA

Thermo Nucular controller 24F
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Maximum power 20 000W
Nominal power 10 000W
Voltage range 20-90V
Phase max 500A
Battery max ~300A
Supply out: 12V 1A, 5V for sensors, each line 100mA PPTC
Limiting temperature +80°C
Phase wires 6AWG terminals
Battery wires 8AWG XT150
Size without wires 86*43*185

Micro Nucular controller 6F
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Maximum power 4 000W
Nominal power 2 000W
Voltage range 20-90V
Phase max 120A
Battery max~70A
Supply out: 12V 1A, 5V for sensors, each line 100mA PPTC
Limiting temperature +80°C
Phase wires 10AWG 5mm bullets
Battery wires 12AWG XT60
Casing size 85*70*32mm

=================
Controllers features:
Fast auto-configuration, hall angle compensation. No need to find right wires combination
Minimum wires, you can connect everything to Display, but controller also have inputs if you need
Pedal Torque sensor (better work - in progress) supported
Speed, torque, or speed+torque control
Charger mode - use any DC source, just connect one phase wire to charge your battery
It is really frosty, not so easy to heat up controller if installed on the airflow (betatesters feedback :) )
CAN bus with supply 12V 1A (Working on LEVCAN open source protocol!)
Analog throttle, analog brake or switch brake, instant response, configurable slope (dA/dt).
Digital or analog halls, motor temperature sensor (TMP35/36, KTY83/84, PT1000, NTC10K 3950)
Speed switch 1-2-3
Two PWM in/out
Enable button or switch, or with bms
Reverse, cruise inputs
We constantly update the software, if you have any ideas or needs - tell me!

Info Display
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[+] photos
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LCD 3" 240*128 FSTN
RGB Buttons
Supply in 8-15V
USB Charger 5.2V 2A with universal driver
Multilinguage WIP
MicroSD slot for software updates

Desc:
Shows charge, speed, power, currents, cell voltages and etc..
Displays information from all devices on CAN bus, updates their software and configures them.
It has light sensor and integrated accelerometer.
A lot of inputs, configurable functions.
Handy back panel for wires inputs. No need for waterproof connectors outside.
Universal GoPro mount, in kit there is steer tube adapter.
Integrated heater for winter use.

Plans for future:
Micro Nucular Controller 6F - at production
16S Micro Nucular BMS extreme small size for scooters, without power stage - planned
24S Nucular BMS for any kind controller, without power stage - planned
Thermo Nucular Controller 24F - testing...

Schematic
CAD-model controller casing
CAD-model of LCD
Some russian links, i will add translations later:
Wiki
Youtube updates playlist (with english subtitles)!

Micro Nucular controller 6F + LCD price 240$ (includes shipping)
Nucular controller 12F + LCD price 350$ (includes shipping)
Additional Nucular controller 12F price 250$ (for dual - triple - quadro motor designs)
I have also different throttle types, 48V3000W 2kg telecom PSU for charging through motor, waterproof julet 6pin connectors (for halls) for sale. Please tell me where you want to connect control, controller or display.
[+] Accessories
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You can ask me in Telegram @vasilisks Nucular electronics chat
Inform me if you need one, there is a big queue, i will note you and contact when ready to ship.
Last edited by VasiliSk on Nov 21 2018 11:59am, edited 24 times in total.

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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by neptronix » Jan 13 2016 10:15am

My suggestion is to sell it to the public. That controller sounds effin' awesome. :)
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now."- Chinese Proverb

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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by parabellum » Jan 13 2016 10:38am

Awesome! :D
Is it trapezoidal?

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VasiliSk   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Jan 13 2016 12:25pm

(archived)
Since finally i've got some results, it's time to get feedback :)
I'm designing 12F high efficiency controller, capable of running 100kERPM in sensorless/sensored mode. Up to 200A 30sec and 120A continious phase current with proper cooling.
Main advantage - using high switching speed of mosfets, proper designed power plane - low inductance, direct phase current control (capable of current request response almost instant), overcurrent protection (but not overregen :twisted: ), temperature protection, dual sided cooling for mosfets. Fits in 9F infineon casing. Futher it will take up even less space
Image
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phase currents:
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It is 100V mosfet and capable to run up to ~90V. I've seen 7200W from this installed on my Adventure Bike, it kicks ass when you release brake with full throttle.
As for now im succeed running sensorless in less than 60 ERPM and up to 100kERPM stable, but got some problems from higher amps on my "cromotor", current recovery lasts for too long sometimes. Also i have no test bench, so i'm run all test on my ass :D
Also implemented as for now step-up converter mode (charge battery through motor or any other inductance). In plan using bluetooth or wifi for configuring and flashing new softwares.
Suggestions?

neptronix i should adopt it to mass production first. there is a small bunch of problems.. moving in this way:
Image

parabellum yep. maybe later there will be sine wave avaible (DTC-SVM, FOC or simple sine PWM) but not now.
Last edited by VasiliSk on Jul 18 2018 7:38am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by Punx0r » Jan 13 2016 7:14pm

Does it have voltage or current throttle?

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VasiliSk   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Jan 14 2016 12:49am

it is capable of current + speed, or only current control. Working on tesla-style driving, where you need only throttle to start/stop

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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by neptronix » Jan 14 2016 3:33am

Prove that it can drive some nearly impossible motor to drive, like the colossus motors from the Croatian crew, or one of hobbyking's larger rotomaxes, then offer up a few samples for sale... and go from there.

These large RC motors with high RPM capabilities and high pole counts are currently just waiting for the right ebike-sized controller to be exploited.
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now."- Chinese Proverb


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parabellum   10 MW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by parabellum » Jan 14 2016 8:43am

VasiliSk wrote:the only high pole count motor i have to test ERPMs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RcsN_ZUSRE

Predator 30-8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKp6QjuzmMM

these was made on old pcb
Was 124000erpm controller or voltage limited? What is the practical erpm limit for your controller?

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circuit   100 kW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by circuit » Jan 14 2016 9:28am

neptronix wrote:These large RC motors with high RPM capabilities and high pole counts are currently just waiting for the right ebike-sized controller to be exploited.
Rotomax, at least 150cc, is actually quite nice and no too hard to drive. Inductance is 17uH, which is still manageable by most cheapo controllers.
smart and Tiny BMS solution
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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by neptronix » Jan 14 2016 9:58am

VasiliSk wrote:the only high pole count motor i have to test ERPMs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RcsN_ZUSRE

Predator 30-8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKp6QjuzmMM

these was made on old pcb

super impressive, bro! now, let's see it with a load on it.. :twisted:
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now."- Chinese Proverb

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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by neptronix » Jan 14 2016 10:02am

circuit wrote:
neptronix wrote:These large RC motors with high RPM capabilities and high pole counts are currently just waiting for the right ebike-sized controller to be exploited.
Rotomax, at least 150cc, is actually quite nice and no too hard to drive. Inductance is 17uH, which is still manageable by most cheapo controllers.
I remember checking ES for a year or so to see if anyone was actually using them... and didn't find anything.

So anyway; easy to drive, you say? who's running one at full tilt on this forum?
My first major build: 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The wheelie machine: 20" Rear Magic Pie II on a Trek 4300 MTB

"The best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time is now."- Chinese Proverb

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SjwNz   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by SjwNz » Jan 27 2016 4:42am

neptronix wrote:
circuit wrote:
neptronix wrote:These large RC motors with high RPM capabilities and high pole counts are currently just waiting for the right ebike-sized controller to be exploited.
Rotomax, at least 150cc, is actually quite nice and no too hard to drive. Inductance is 17uH, which is still manageable by most cheapo controllers.
I remember checking ES for a year or so to see if anyone was actually using them... and didn't find anything.

So anyway; easy to drive, you say? who's running one at full tilt on this forum?
I am only running the Rotomax 50cc motor at 3kw with my DIY controller but would like to play with the 150cc some time in the future.

Good work on your Controller, I want to try Sensor-less sometime.

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VasiliSk   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Feb 15 2016 9:59am

some progress on dyno. soon i will get real data from rv160s
Image

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by peters » Feb 15 2016 1:58pm

On your video I saw STM Studio for a second. Which uC are you using if it's not a secret?
I just started to experiment with STM32F3DISCOVERY board and hope its 72MHz will be enough for sensorless FOC in C.

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by macribs » Feb 15 2016 5:53pm

The future of e-biking looks bright, amazing work.

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VasiliSk   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Feb 16 2016 2:08am

peters wrote:On your video I saw STM Studio for a second. Which uC are you using if it's not a secret?
I just started to experiment with STM32F3DISCOVERY board and hope its 72MHz will be enough for sensorless FOC in C.
it is cheap stm32f103. i not planning to run FOC on this board, it is much more expensive in hardware

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by kiwifiat » Feb 20 2016 4:27pm

peters wrote:On your video I saw STM Studio for a second. Which uC are you using if it's not a secret?
I just started to experiment with STM32F3DISCOVERY board and hope its 72MHz will be enough for sensorless FOC in C.
The STM32F103 has more than enough power to run FOC in sensorless mode. Download the free IAR EWARM and ST's Motor Control Workbench http://www.st.com/web/catalog/tools/FM1 ... m32100-pr1# and you can compile the FOC code that includes field weakening in under the 32K limit for the code size restricted EWARM. A cheap fleebay STLink usb dongle and a cheap USD4.46 Maple Mini clone (STM32F103CBT6) and you are on your way. I am playing about with ST's patented single shunt FOC topology now which if successful should make for a very low cost FOC controller.
The only source of knowledge is experience.
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VasiliSk   100 W

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Mar 09 2016 4:14pm

LCD is coming... it is gonna be multilanguage and custom font supported :)
Image
Image

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Mar 22 2016 3:07am

Got this data from RV160 short using trapetzoidal control
7 pole pair
25 wire turn on tooth, 6 wires in parallel D0.8mm
Delta commutation, virtual wire cross-section 5,2 mm2
80mOhm
300uH
33.36kV (RPM/V)
0.22kA (Nm/A)
this gives me 39.6Nm on shaft of motor with 180 phase amps

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Apr 21 2016 8:59am

I've run some tests on rv160s motor. On this graph horisontal - rpm, vertical - power consumption...
Image
as you can see when motor runs 4k+ RPM, power rises above 1kW!! I have find out that main problem of such losses is a big bearing, it is heats up instantly when motor spinning 4k.
Here is explanation vid: https://youtu.be/qTRJ4jqASRA it is in russian, but easy to understand where is problems
So i replaced this original NSK 6814 bearing to NTN 6814, cover now spins much longer!!

And finally some photo of RV160s
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Image
Image
magnet width 25mm... winding NOT 6 parallel wire, but 5. im quite dissapointed with this motor

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by straby187 » Apr 21 2016 8:25pm

Can you verify the lamination thickness?

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Re: Designing of 12F 100kERPM Sensored/Sensorless controller

Post by VasiliSk » Apr 22 2016 1:30am

64 laminations with overall thickness 22.8mm, this gives about 0.35 per lam

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