Forget it, I'm done!
- Thread starter sangesf
- Start date
liveforphysics
100 TW
Arlo1 said:
175wh-kg. Pretty much exactly the same as RC lipo. Only absurdly safe and thousands of cycles. But not the insane C rates you get with RC lipo.
neptronix said:
Everyone keeps saying that on this site but it isn't true.
$1,300 dollars will get you a new 48 volt 24 amp NMC battery weighing seven kilogrammes. The c-rating is just too low for the 12 amp pack unless you have a small wattage motor.
http://www.chicagoelectricbicycles.com/Batteries.html
I forget who originally posted about this. If I find the thread I will edit accordingly.
Edit: Phoebus. I knew they were the name of a moon. Well almost.
liveforphysics
100 TW
Joseph- Those are laptop 18650's bundled into an ebike pack. You can't compare something cobbled together from laptop cells with a pack made from proper EV pouch cells. Day and night differences.
liveforphysics said:
I'm not comparing them, Luke. I know they aren't the greatest cells. All I'm saying is that they are publicly available at such a price and amp hour capacity. The offering from Zero is far superior, and cheaper.
Starson
10 W
liveforphysics said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that you're referring to the Zero packs. Here's a link to the Spec page for the 2012 models. I'm also assuming that these new offerings will have the NMC packs. http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/zero-ds/specs.php Incredible mileage to 80% capacity. Who knows how much they will be charging for these new packs, if they will offer them seperatly at all, and what exactly is inside them??? Luke do you have inside info?
Gary
Joseph C. said:
Allcell is not the only NMC vendor out there and what they're selling is one of a few dozen different variants of NMC.
BMSbattery also sells some NMC stuff, though it's not any lighter than RC lipo, really.
Batteryspace sells some NMC cells as well.
But we don't have accecss to the tasty stuff - the pouches.
BTW, 10AH of 36v RC lipo will be about 5.5lbs without the BMS and packing, whereas the NMC stuff ( from allcell ) is 4.8lbs.
999zip999
100 TW
Wish wish.
Hillhater
100 TW
ez-Ebike said:
Simple... form a reputable , power project /EV company, ....then order EIG's pre made "Power Modules". :wink:
USAEBIKECO
10 kW
We sell lithium manganese battery packs and in all honesty its definitely a better battery than lifepo4 because its significantly lighter. People are starting to catch on to using them. Our sales have been up this year.
maydaverave
10 kW
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2009
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I am tempted to try one of the water bottle batteries from a123rc. Its a 36 volt 12 ah battery that weighs 3.5 kg. 10s 1p so I am guessing 12ah pouch cells.
http://www.a123rc.com/goods-358-36V+12Ah+Inframe-Mounted+%28Bottle-shape%29+LiMnO2+Battery+Pack+for+E-bikes.html
http://www.a123rc.com/goods-358-36V+12Ah+Inframe-Mounted+%28Bottle-shape%29+LiMnO2+Battery+Pack+for+E-bikes.html
maydaverave said:
Says LiMnO2. Different then LiMnCo2. (Missing the Cobalt, if that makes a difference?)
Another thing that gives me pause, is that a 1/3 more battery is only a 1/6 more weight?
(comparing their 9Ah to 12Ah batteries and also the fact they say 10.5Ah in one place and 9Ah in another for the same "9Ah" battery
zEEz
1 kW
"ThunderSags" is a weird name, but i would say You guys intrigued me 
50-60$ for each cell is a fair price for something reliable and safe that can
be rigged up in the fashion of a 18cell pack giving 60V-60Ah ...
If any picture is available, just post it, *please*
It will help me to want it more and to induce me to beg
you all to sell it to me
(it is the motorbike pack that I need )
have fun!
50-60$ for each cell is a fair price for something reliable and safe that can
be rigged up in the fashion of a 18cell pack giving 60V-60Ah ...
If any picture is available, just post it, *please*
It will help me to want it more and to induce me to beg
you all to sell it to me
(it is the motorbike pack that I need
)have fun!
zEEz said:"ThunderSags" is a weird name, but i would say You guys intrigued me
50-60$ for each cell is a fair price for something reliable and safe that can
be rigged up in the fashion of a 18cell pack giving 60V-60Ah ...
If any picture is available, just post it, *please*
It will help me to want it more and to induce me to beg
you all to sell it to me
(it is the motorbike pack that I need
have fun!
From my other post...
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=34074
Here is a pack of 4 in series for 12v
I personally only have 15 - 60AH ones for sale ($70per) but if you wanna mix like 12 - 60Ah ones and 4 - 90Ah($110 per) ones (you could use the extra 30Ah by pulling a separate 12v pair of leads for electrical stuff..). Pm me and we'll discuss it.
P.S. Generally speaking, 16 cells is "60v" 20 cells is "72v". 18 cells is 66v.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but all these NMC batteries have life cycles of 700-800 to 80% capacity (except for EIGs which *may* be in the multiple thousands.) That still makes LiFePO4 the better option for me if I want something that last for year and years. I'm ready to pull the trigger on about $800 worth of batteries and I want the most mileage per the dollar.
ez-Ebike said:
There are so many "Flavors" of lithium based cells, that it DOES get confusing..
One of the best pieces of advice I've seen (when speaking of lifepo4 specifically) is..
Buy more capacity then you'll ever use, only use 70% of rated capacity/C-Rate and you should almost never have problems...
That works out probably the best, because, if you don't need/use a BMS (if you follow the above advice - because the cells will stay relatively in balance) you have one less thing to go wrong.
I've recently stopped using BMSs because I now personally use "cell balancers" on large format TS/GBS type cells since I don't really ever use more than 30% of the batteries on a daily basis.
The cell balancers are for basic "top balancing" of cells, which is all I need).
Of course, if you're going to be running past 80% DOD on a consistent basis , then you either better watch the cells closely or use a BMS.
liveforphysics
100 TW
ez-Ebike said:
LG Chen's cells are >10,000 cycles at high DOD, and >40,000 at low DOD (like 50%)
liveforphysics said:
Now we're talking.
That's pretty amazing if it's true. What about calendar life?
liveforphysics
100 TW
I fumble fingered typing LG Chem rather than LG Chen.
3.65v nominal. >12c burst, >8c constant. Energy density is the same as the best RC lipo, ~175wh/kg.
Sadly, you can't even see the data sheets for them without signing a bunching if NDAs after you've prooved to them you're going to be buying 10's of millions of dollars in cells to even get the conversation started.
3.65v nominal. >12c burst, >8c constant. Energy density is the same as the best RC lipo, ~175wh/kg.
Sadly, you can't even see the data sheets for them without signing a bunching if NDAs after you've prooved to them you're going to be buying 10's of millions of dollars in cells to even get the conversation started.
wiredsim
10 W
LG Chem..
I hope to get my hands on some myself, considering they will be made here in my town. Unfortunately they won't be in full production until Jan. 2013.
