New exceptional charger! 20Amps, full balanceing, tiny!

Joined
Oct 28, 2008
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Location
Manhattan Beach, CA, USA
My favorite charger company has made a new charger. I love the input voltage range (4.5v to 32v), I love the ability to charge at 20amps/350w, and I love that it can discharge at 600w! (to an external source of course).

It also has 16mb of data logging flash memory, and a built-in Ri meter.

The outputs are completely isolated from the source, so for charging more than 8s lipo or 10s LiFePO4, you can simply use a pair of them.

I own 4 of the previous model of this charger, and they absolutely kick-ass. They do everything I could ever ask of a charger better than any other charger I've ever owned (even ones that cost 3x more), and they are tiny! You can fit them in your back pocket!

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9005

Best Wishes,
-Luke
 
Wow, Luke, you are right. This is a great find. Being able to do 8s is a major improvement, not to mention the much higher charge rate. The reason I like 8s is because most LiFePO4-based setups are multiples of 8 cells. What is the max charge rate at 8s? I'm assuming it is not 20A, as that would be about 600W, but I'm guessing it'll be at least 10-11A, which is pretty amazing, especially for something this size. I also like the 350mA balance current rate. This makes it viable for use with larger capacity setups.

-- Gary
 
Gary, with LiFePO4, it can even do 10s!

It has 350mA balance current.

WIth my 10s units that are rated to "300w or 10A", I can get them to do 9amps at 40v (360w) if I keep the input power voltage high. If these are the same way, then you might get more current than what it takes to make it's rated 350w.

I'm pretty pumped about them :)

I can totally see helicopter guys charging 2,000mAh 3-4s LiPo packs at 10s with this... Lol! The crazy thing is, the super high C rating cells actually will take that kind of abuse! You can cycle a pack 3 times in an hour with a charger like this an a hungry helicopter :)
 
Forgive the newb question, but is it necessary for the input voltage to be higher than the total pack voltage for these chargers to operate?
 
Good question, and the answer is "No".

You can connect 5v input to this charger, and charge a 10s LiFePO4 pack with it. However, to charge at full current potential, they like to see more than 13-14v. I'm really happy this charger can handle 32v input. That enables us to use even more compact and lower current power supplies to power the charger. :)
 
Now we just need a simple way to splice these in on the bike to handle regen. That way my stationary charging rig could be a friction drive directly off my windmill or directly from the lead battery bank when the wind is too light.

John
 
liveforphysics said:
Gary, with LiFePO4, it can even do 10s!

Yes, but in balance mode, it's 8s. That's fine, though, as two of these will be perfect for a 16s a123 pack, or three for a 24s setup.

liveforphysics said:
It has 350mA balance current.

With high charge currents and this much balance current, this could work well for higher capacity setups, even those on motorcycle conversions. These are small enough that they definitely could be part of the permanent installation. One question is whether or not they draw anything if they are left connected to the pack, but without the input supply hooked up.

liveforphysics said:
WIth my 10s units that are rated to "300w or 10A", I can get them to do 9amps at 40v (360w) if I keep the input power voltage high. If these are the same way, then you might get more current than what it takes to make it's rated 350w.

In my mind, anything above 10-12A is fantastic. :)

I also like that they can make use of much higher input voltages. High-power 24V supplies are quite plentiful. :)

-- Gary
 
Hi Gary,

GGoodrum said:
What is the max charge rate at 8s? I'm assuming it is not 20A, as that would be about 600W, but I'm guessing it'll be at least 10-11A, which is pretty amazing, especially for something this size.

-- Gary

Depending on which specs it looks like it could be pretty close to 20A:
This looks like its limited to 350W?
Capable of handling up to 350W or 20A charge rates. Lipoly, LiFe and Lilo compatible as well as able to charge up to 8 cell packs.

But this looks like 350W with an input of 18V but 600W at 30v which would be pretty close to 20A with LiFe. Based on Luke's experience with the earlier model, and comparing those spec's with Luke's results I think its probably close to 20A.
Maximum charge power capacity: 350W @ input voltage > 18V
Maximum extern discharge power capacity: 600W @ 30V/20A

Measuring Internal Resistance of the Battery

Luke:
Do you think it measures cell capacity as well as Ri?
If I used one for charging single cells in series, charging at a slow rate, how closely matched would the cells need to be at the start of charging?
 
Yes, the discharge modes definately will measure battery capacity, even each indivdual cell's capacity. This thing has 12Mb of memory, so it can log temps, current, voltage, capacity, Ri, for each cell for a 36hr run of auto cycleing the battery or whatever you set it up to do. These chargers are very very slick.

Get this, you can actually power the charger from the very battery that it's charging, and just set it to balance and log data rather than to try to charge. Then you have on-board balancing, and you can upload the data to see how each indivdual cell's voltage was holding up through your ride. These chargers are very slick, and smaller than a little paperback book.

Here is a link to the users manual:
http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/iC208B_en.pdf

Special features



l High power, high current, high-performance power conversion circuit. The iCharger series uses advanced Synchronous buck-boost DC/DC converter technology with an output conversion efficiency that can reach over 90%. This not only saves power and reduces heat build up but also makes the charger more compact and conveniently mobile.

l Input power with 4mm bullet connectors (25A) butt-welded alligator clips and wide input voltage ranges from 4.5V to 32V. The output power can be adjusted to align with the available input power, thus preventting input current overload and protecting the DC source.

l The iCharger series can be used with three types of Lithium batteries - LiPo, Lilo, LiFe - and has a fully integrated cell balancer.

l Internal temperature sensor and temperature controlled automatic cooling FAN controls the internal temperature and provides intelligent protection. When the internal temperature is over 60℃(140 oF), the output power is automatically reduced by 25%. If the temperature exceeds 65℃(149 oF) the charge cycle is stopped.

l Convenient set of 10 battery profile memories that can be saved and loaded by number.

l 2x16 backlit LCD screen that provides rich information including active mode, current, voltage, total charge (mAh), charging time and temperature etc.

l Various charging/discharging settings and cycles to meet a wide range of customer needs. For Lithium batteries: balance charging, normal charging, fast charging, storage, discharging, ext-discharging, charge/discharge cycling, and battery monitoring. For NiCd/NiMH batteries: charging-auto, charging-manual, discharging, charge/discharge cycling and forming charge. For Pb batteries: charging and discharging.

l Unique Lithium battery expanding discharge program. When you connect the external capacity resistance, you can use it as the maximum discharge power capacity—600W (@30V/20A).

l iCharger 208B has a 16Mbit flash storage, which can log offline charge and discharge data in 36 hours. The users can transfer these data to logview for analyzing and plotting when it is necessary.

l Unique Lithium battery Monitor program. When you use other equipment to charge or discharge a Lithium pack, you can use the iCharger to monitor the per-cell voltages, battery temperature and process time. If any individual cell appears over-charged or over-discharged or the pack is too hot or the process has gone on for too long, the iCharger will generate an alarm sound and the related information will blink.

l Electric motor test mode can be used to run-in electric motors, test motor parameters and performanc, e, check tolerances etc.

l Foam-cut drive. In th, is mode, the charger acts as a convenient power supply for a hot wire foam cutter.

l Battery interior resistance measurement. The iCharger can not only measure the internal resistance of the battery pack, and also can measure the per-cell internal resistance (only available for lithium battery).

l Perfect protection. The iCharger has protection for reversed polarity (input or output), low input voltage, battery temperature, charging capacity and time overrun.

l Support upgrading the hardware program by USB port. The iCharger also support the “logview” software and can display, plot and analyze the charge and discharge data by it. (See detail information about logview in the following website: http://www.logview.info)
 
Hi Luke,

Thanks for the detailed reply!

Sorry for the belated Thank You!

Mitch
 
Hi,

ZapPat said:
:shock: Per-cell Ri testing!!

And it might be good enough to act as a BMS too with it's low voltage warning... I just wonder how much standby current it draws though?

Quite a few (most or all?) RC chargers have Per-cell Ri testing. Less (very few?) check Per-cell capacity.

These might be a better option for LVC:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9229&start=0
Best damn 6S lithium monitor on the planet for $15

The huge pluses for this charger are the 20A per channel max charging rate and the 600W discharge capacity which works out to charging Lipo at over 17.5A and A123 at 20A:
"Maximum extern discharge power capacity: 600W @ 30V/20A"

Since it accepts 32V you could probably even charge Lipo at over 19A with a 32V 20A power supply.
 
MitchJi said:
ZapPat said:
:shock: Per-cell Ri testing!!
Quite a few (most or all?) RC chargers have Per-cell Ri testing. Less (very few?) check Per-cell capacity.

The turnigy accucell chargers don't, and the GT brand chargers don't, and I don't think the IMAX chargers do either. I'm not even sure the small 50W iCharger one has the Ri testing function? So if you shop at hobbycity, that leaves only the large iChargers (250W, 300W, 350W) that have this feature...
 
Hi ZP,

ZapPat said:
:shock: Per-cell Ri testing!!

MitchJi said:
Quite a few (most or all?) RC chargers have Per-cell Ri testing. Less (very few?) check Per-cell capacity.

ZapPat said:
The turnigy accucell chargers don't, and the GT brand chargers don't, and I don't think the IMAX chargers do either. I'm not even sure the small 50W iCharger one has the Ri testing function? So if you shop at hobbycity, that leaves only the large iChargers (250W, 300W, 350W) that have this feature...

I guess I should have said 2 others :oops:

The CellPro 10s has it and its less expensive than the iChargers ($169.95) plus shipping from the U.S. is probably less than from H.K. Maximum charge amps are less though, about 6.5A for 10s A123. Higher power balancing also:
http://www.fmadirect.com/new_applications/10s_charger.htm
FMA Direct has combined the features of Full Power Balancing with new capabilities never before seen in a LiPo charger. Experience, passion, and unprecedented design features are wrapped up in this unique product from FMA Direct.

This one has most or all of the features of the CBA (Per-cell Ri and mah). It also 12S but limited to 180W and has a clunky interface:
http://www.aero-nuts.com/product_info.php?products_id=570
MegaPower 960SR 1S~12S Li-po/A123 Charger + LCB12S - US$199.00

The earlier version of the iCharger 1010B+ (the Chargery 1010B) probably has this feature as well:
http://www.lightflightrc.com/
Direct link won't work. Select Products -> Chargers -> Chargery 1010B. The Chargery 1010B is lower wattage, (either 200W or 250W depending on firmware) and doesn't have the built in usb port for charge monitoring/firmware updates so its not as good a unit but its worth mentioning because its currently available for only $114.95 (clearance).
 
Fred Marks(FMA) and Boucher( Astroflight) are both American geniuses and I would spend a bit more to get their stuff. IMHO!
otherDoc
 
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