Type of temperature sensor to use in motor (thermocouple, NTC thermistor, resistance thermocouple)?

[mindgames11]

What kind of temp sensors are used for sensing motor temp? Besides on the inside or outside of the motor case and using that as a reference for what's going on inside, what/where are the probe locations? Geared feels like it would be more difficult with the more moving parts inside.
I've used thermocouples for designing products to comply with UL standards, not really familiar with NTC which I'm guessing would be the type many use.
I would likely route the sensor cable to my bars where I have a bunch of riv-nuts/mounts/etc and connect a display, which I may or may connect as desired. I don't know if I would rather have something unitary like a small panel meter as opposed to something arduino based that would have more wires/mess. If I really consider it, a system I like and can run with a little esp32/stm32/small model arduino would probably be best since I could easily enclose that along with a tiny display quite easily and get some logging out of it too.

I'm looking to add a temp sensor to my various e motors since I like sensors and would love to know what combinations of factors produce certain conditions, and motor temp seems like the most relevant (E bike motors feel much to me like non-tweeter speakers- momentary over-power doesn't kill them but prolonged power damaging the voice coil. over-excursion can damage the speaker surround and I guess I'd compare that to mechanical damage to a planetary gearset, although is there an equivalent kind of non-heat mechanical damage for a DD motor?).
I've been pondering over-powering some of my motors (I have maybe half dozen DD scooter motors/two working scooters, one DD hub motor that I think is 1.5kw, and two 250w geared hub motors listed for 36v which I'd like to try at 48v for top end assistance since the motors are on a 20 inch Kuo+ A2B and 14 inch swagtron single speed and I have no problem getting from zero to ten miles an hour. I also have a pair of bafang hub motors that I'm nearly certain came from 26" bike share bikes, one of the older 36v models and one of the newer, much more powerful ones that runs at 52v.) but the limit to my knowledge about the official specs for these motors is the voltage of the product they came from, and for most what the intended power limit for that application is. And of course what their actual capabilities are may be something else entirely.

Related: Is there an encyclopedia of hub motors? some page that lists "all" known motors with pics and stats where available? Cause I don't know jack about most of my motors( while I'm not the original owner on any of these items, I cant stand that manufacturers don't provide any technical information. even the non-china companies. really disgusting.) .

 

[Gruesome]

For a list of motors and their properties see Motor Simulator - Tools .

 

[mindgames11]

For a list of motors and their properties see Motor Simulator - Tools .

While I've been aware of the motor simulator for a while I haven't really attempted using it until recently (like once last week.) when I watched a very informative two hour video by grin detailing hub motor parameters-that video was phenomenal and I wish there were more long format seminars/videos on related subjects.

I appreciate your input and while it is somewhat helpful I was hoping more for something like a table listing all of the motors in the pull-down menu with info on ( included choices stemming from my "needs improvement" comprehension) release date, MSRP at release date, popularity/estimated number built, stator wire gauge, turns/kv, rated and/or estimated power handling, Magnet size/type, for geared hubs: reduction ratio, planetary gear type/style (are there standards, some cross-compatibility?) weight, dimensions, positioning configuration options (front, rear, freehub/wheel), some kind of metric that would allow comparison of torque output (still mentally processing the grin video)

I will likely start trying to collect this data although knowing myself and how I flit between projects, it might be slow going or die on the vine. If there's something like this already in existence or development I'd love to know.

 

[Gruesome]

I know exactly what you mean... Once the hard part is over it's amazing how quickly one can lose interest.

Sounds like a good table. Go for it!
If you create the table as a google docs/google sheets live published document, then it will survive in whatever state it is when you lose interest in the project, and you don't have to manually update or republish it. I haven't tested whether inserting such a document as a picture is possible in endless-sphere.

 

[fill]

So how are you adding the additional sensor? physical limitations halted my idle thoughts..

 

[mindgames11]

So how are you adding the additional sensor? physical limitations halted my idle thoughts..

my first instinct is to see if I can thread a thermocouple along with the phase and hall wires and attatch the lead termination to the stator. however, electromagnetic fields of course interfere with thermocouples, so I'll have to read or experiment to see how much. I think the flux is weakest right between the poles. Maybe grin shows some clips that I can infer how they set their stuff up for testing or I can email them.

If the thermocouple proves to be too much of a hassle, something comparatively easy would be to mount an IR thermosensor so it's pointed at the case (being contactless makes it in a sense wireless).

who knows, if I get real wild and into this I might try for some kind of platinum RTD.

for now I'm off to fool with this apollo scooter that I bought broken and have brought back to life (what ridiculous designs so many scooters have... sheesh.) The fact that it's nearly silent is odd... zipping around manhattan in the middle of the night on empty streets.

 

[mindgames11]

I know exactly what you mean... Once the hard part is over it's amazing how quickly one can lose interest.

Sounds like a good table. Go for it!
If you create the table as a google docs/google sheets live published document, then it will survive in whatever state it is when you lose interest in the project, and you don't have to manually update or republish it. I haven't tested whether inserting such a document as a picture is possible in endless-sphere.

so far my method has been to take documentary images of anything I take apart, some pictures with scales and calipers