GNG, 1000W 48V BB-drive, $400

[jateureka]

Looks like this is a good alternative to the Cyclone setup.

 

[Timbuck]

The ride up the hill was fun , got some more footage. Lost of hard climbing. Very impressed by the whole set up not getting even warm.
The new video will tell the story.

And I'm back on the gold coast now , dad rang and told me he went for a road ride out to a mates place this arvo.
7 or 8km round trip , on one 3ah batt, and still had 42v in it. Tomorrow he will be able to tell me mah used.

I agree whiplash. 2000watts all day long.
I'm getting a smaller front sprocket , just to do more testing.

Tim

 

[Whiplash]

Yeah the only thing I can see keeping it from safely doing the 2000 watts is the belt. If that can take it then your home free!

 

[redstone02]

And I'm back on the gold coast now , dad rang and told me he went for a road ride out to a mates place this arvo.
7 or 8km round trip , on one 3ah batt, and still had 42v in it. Tomorrow he will be able to tell me mah used.

Tim

That is very efficient battery use! The ride your dad took to a mates place is the kind of riding I will do with this setup… to friends, work and round abouts… no hills or off road. Yeah, boring stuff for this thread.

Deciding on battery chemistry now. Lipo sounds great; got 7 year daughter who I encourage to take things apart, so Lipo not so great. LiFePo4 is as a lot going for it with a 7 year playing around.

So any stock reports would be greatly appreciated!

Regards,
Red

 

[Memran]

Thanks for those videos! This looks to be a superb replacement for Cyclones. My Cyclone is just too noisy, and attracts far too much attention. I can hardly hear the GNG over the tyre noise!!!

I want one!

I'm not sure if the shape of my down-tube on my Kona Stinky will prevent it fitting properly though:

What do you think? It is a bit bent!

 

[Memran]

Can someone do a quick test and see if it runs on 36v too please?
I already have 36v lipo for my Cyclone...

 

[crossbreak]

Can someone do a quick test and see if it runs on 36v too please?
I already have 36v lipo for my Cyclone...

I guess the LVC does not accept less than 37 Volts. You could simply swap the controller for a cheap 500W 36V controller (30amps limit, about 25-50 bucks). The cadence would be more humane then

 

[Timbuck]

Memran.

Nice kona mate. I wouldn't be worried about the shape of the frame. Dad's is not round at all , it's more eye shape from front to back ( if you know what I mean ) .
He just has a block of rubber clamped underneath and works fine. Press the button mate

 

[spinningmagnets]

I had assumed that I would likely buy a Lyen controller for one of these, but even adding $100 to the kit price, it seemed to still be a good value. I am very pleased to hear these reports. Since the controller is only warm after hard riding, and its a 9-FET (also notice how FAT the aluminum bar is that's used for a FET heat-sink). It appears that the controller is actually up to the job I'd use it for.

I had wanted to be able to add my pedaling to lower the watt-use, and also get some exercise, but the stock very high cadence meant that if I used full-throttle, the chainrings would be spinning too fast. Its unlikely that I would get a smaller freewheel on the drive, but a larger chainring seems like it would do the trick, not expensive either. I had consoled myself to the thought that this kit would be more of an electric scooter (a bike in name only). I wouldn't bother to try re-winding the motor to a lower kV...

The report of how quiet the drive turned out to be, it's a much appreciated bonus. The low amp-draw result of keeping the motor RPMs high, means that a 15-AH Ping will be more than enough, even with a low C-rate LiFePO4 battery. Also, over time I have grown fond of fat tires and full suspension (pot-holes on my crappy streets, aggressive car traffic forcing me to bail onto sidewalks), and this drive will work well with FS.

 

[Tawnos]

How do these units handle with water and dirt? Think Seattle winters...

 

[full-throttle]

How do these units handle with water and dirt?

Water - prob ok
Dirt - prob NOT ok

Think Seattle winters...

Think not everyone here is familiar with winter in Seattle :wink:

 

[sn0wchyld]

How do these units handle with water and dirt?

Water - prob ok
Dirt - prob NOT ok

Think Seattle winters...

Think not everyone here is familiar with winter in Seattle :wink:

Is dirt purely related to it accelerating wear on the pulleys/ cloging em up?

 

[full-throttle]

Is dirt purely related to it accelerating wear on the pulleys/ cloging em up?

I'd say so. Or else why would Gates Carbon go through all that effort of making sure their system is 'dirt friendly'

 

[Tawnos]

How do these units handle with water and dirt?

Water - prob ok
Dirt - prob NOT ok

Think Seattle winters...

Think not everyone here is familiar with winter in Seattle :wink:

Doesn't really rain very often, but mists a lot. Riding around without fenders leaves you splattered with mud and road grime front and back. I've seen people around here with direct drive hubs, but don't think that would handle my size and our hills on the east side.

Considering biting the bullet anyway, $400 is hard to beat, and it would be a good start...

 

[crossbreak]

I did a short calculation, based on the posted data. It calcs

-the max speed of your setup, based on the max power rpm
-the max climbing ability (gain and angle in degree)
-chain and belt forces
-some dimensions of the sprockets, ratios, rpm...

It tells that this drive will be used best @37Volts, assuming a humane max power cadence of 80

It is split into motor drive and pedal drive. They should match, but they often do not, this is why I divided it to show the differences. The values of the motor drive that influence the pedal drive where just associated, so you can play around with it.

It looks right atm, but maybe there might be faults in it. Please post any fault you find.

Edit: I will keep this posted updated with corrected version of the calc

 

[flyingdutchman]

It took a little modification but I've got my installed on my Foes full suspension DH bike. The speed and torque with the stock controller is actually pretty impressive. Feels like it could climb a wall. It does fall a bit short in the taller gears. Doesn't have enough torque to really take advantage of the gearing. Top speed is 20 to 25 mph. It looses speed in the taller gears. I don't have my speedo hooked up so the speed is an estimate. My CA indicates around 1000watts under full load. I'm was running at 44volts off the charger so it seems to be around 15amps.

I just got my lyen extreme modder controller yesterday. I'll be running at 63 volts off the charger and roughly 30amps. It took some time to sort out the phase/hall wires but OH BOY NOW WE ARE TALKING. It's running 2000watts wide open and is easily as fast as my HS5304 clyte motor at 3000watts. It started raining just as I got everything dialed in....should have some better test results when I get home today. I only ran it for ten minutes but it didn't seem to get hot or act like it was going to fail. I love it. It rips...like it wants to pull the front wheel. I've never had a cyclone so I can't compare...but it isn't very loud in my opinion. With the lyen controller I'm guessing a top speed of 40 or 50 mph. Hoping to get the speedo hooked up tonight.

 

[wildharemtbkr]

Does your Foes have an 83mm bottom bracket shell? I want to put one on my Norco, but was wondering if it would fit. I'm assuming they use a 73 mm BB and 2.5mm thick steel to fit the bikes that have 68 mm BB shell. So anyone know if it fits the wider BB?
Looks like it would be a lot of fun in the hills!

 

[tmho]

WELL......
Just had a very very fun , ride with dad. Mono's wheelies , donuts , jumps , and crashes... Ha ha
Amazing to see a smile on dad's face , like he was a kid again with not a worry in the world. Few $$$ of lipo's for fathers day , SMILE price less.
Got a great video loading up.. And here is a teaser..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FN14KJTEtJw&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Hi Timbuck, thanks for the video. If your bike originally was 3 x 8 speed, now it should be only 1 x 8, right? Is this good enough? Would it be better that it can be 2 x 8 speed or even 3 x 8 speed? Will there be enough room (or possible) for GNG to make it 2 x 8 or 3 x 8 speed like the cyclone?

 

[flyingdutchman]

Does your Foes have an 83mm bottom bracket shell? I want to put one on my Norco, but was wondering if it would fit. I'm assuming they use a 73 mm BB and 2.5mm thick steel to fit the bikes that have 68 mm BB shell. So anyone know if it fits the wider BB?
Looks like it would be a lot of fun in the hills!

It took two 2.5mm spacers and I had to modify a tire jack to mount it or the belt drive would have rubbed on the swingarm. I was able to use the provided bb cartridge. You might get away with one steel. I had to swing the whole unit forward and fab a mount. The foes frame is pretty crowded and wide but i wedged a tire stop in there and its actually really sturdy n h mayas good clearance. It may take some tinkering but it should work.

 

[Timbuck]

WELL......
Just had a very very fun , ride with dad. Mono's wheelies , donuts , jumps , and crashes... Ha ha
Amazing to see a smile on dad's face , like he was a kid again with not a worry in the world. Few $$$ of lipo's for fathers day , SMILE price less.
Got a great video loading up.. And here is a teaser..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FN14KJTEtJw&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Hi Timbuck, thanks for the video. If your bike originally was 3 x 8 speed, now it should be only 1 x 8, right? Is this good enough? Would it be better that it can be 2 x 8 speed or even 3 x 8 speed? Will there be enough room (or possible) for GNG to make it 2 x 8 or 3 x 8 speed like the cyclone?

1Q...yes
2Q...yes depending what and where and how you want to ride it.
3Q....defiantly....better with a 2 or 3rd cog on the front. We are happy with the speed for dad...BUT if it needs to be lower geared for those very steep climb's. I'm talking the 5kph type riding.

How it is standard , is great for everyday riding , on the road or trails with hills. Standard it will climb 30'deg no drama's

Tim

 

[crossbreak]

Standard it will climb 30'deg no drama's

I absolutely doubt that. My calcs say with stock 48/44 chainrings and a common 11-32T cassette it will more likely climb 8.5 degree (14.7% gain) max @ 100kg bike+rider weight. To get up a 30 degree (50% gain) steep hill you would need a 13T chainring with the same cassette, and really good road grip
For the stock GNG a 52/32 chainring combination should perform best in most cases.

btw. the motor reduction seems to be weakly dimensioned. At http://www.electricscooterparts.com/beltcogs.html.com spare parts for it are available. Maybe one could swap the stock 80/14 belt reduction for a more reasonable 95/16 one (using custom jackshaft mounting sheet, which could be easily made with homespun remedies).

 

[Timbuck]

Interesting calc's crossbreak.
So I guess the mountain's in the video must be less than 8.5 deg , even though they are hard to walk up.

Most wheelchair access ramp's are steeper than 8.5deg.... Just sayin..

http://www.discountramps.com/articles/correct-wheelchair-ramp-length.htm

 

[comradegerry]

Just bought one too, seller seems on top of things, emailed photos of unit and shipping details which is good and a refreshing change.

Always nice to have another option to drive through the gears.

I do have an idea to weld a carrier to the frame as the BB won't work for me unfortunately.

Keep up the reports, 750w through the gears, reliably is all I need.

I did give the ebay seller a link to the Sphere forum with an invitation to drop in!

Gerard

 

[heathyoung]

btw. the motor reduction seems to be weakly dimensioned. At http://www.electricscooterparts.com/beltcogs.html.com spare parts for it are available. Maybe one could swap the stock 80/14 belt reduction for a more reasonable 95/16 one (using custom jackshaft mounting sheet, which could be easily made with homespun remedies).

Interesting, especially the threaded 90 tooth one... Very useful link there, thanks for that!

I'm thinking one of these and a BMX flip-flop hub (its a jackshaft, with bearings)

 

[fabiograssi]

It took a little modification but I've got my installed on my Foes full suspension DH bike. The speed and torque with the stock controller is actually pretty impressive. Feels like it could climb a wall. It does fall a bit short in the taller gears. Doesn't have enough torque to really take advantage of the gearing. Top speed is 20 to 25 mph. It looses speed in the taller gears. I don't have my speedo hooked up so the speed is an estimate. My CA indicates around 1000watts under full load. I'm was running at 44volts off the charger so it seems to be around 15amps.

I just got my lyen extreme modder controller yesterday. I'll be running at 63 volts off the charger and roughly 30amps. It took some time to sort out the phase/hall wires but OH BOY NOW WE ARE TALKING. It's running 2000watts wide open and is easily as fast as my HS5304 clyte motor at 3000watts. It started raining just as I got everything dialed in....should have some better test results when I get home today. I only ran it for ten minutes but it didn't seem to get hot or act like it was going to fail. I love it. It rips...like it wants to pull the front wheel. I've never had a cyclone so I can't compare...but it isn't very loud in my opinion. With the lyen controller I'm guessing a top speed of 40 or 50 mph. Hoping to get the speedo hooked up tonight.

Hey, flyingdutchman, what exactly controller model from lyen you installed, and what is the wiring combination with infineon?