Vector E-bike catching fire

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I would never deny Artur spent reasonable time, but would argue the method and service were less than optimal. Some interesting details and discrepancies. If it were me, like I said I'd seek to optimize things for my own protection, as well as the customers' and industry. Always room for improvement, and attempt to keep or even build face in the meantime.

With what's been supplied here, if I was the buyer I'd be hesitant to spend MORE, discount or not.
If vector could appreciate the buyer's side of this situation, and recognize some of their own potential shortcomings, they might offer at minimum the '1/2 off' as a direct refund, or send parts free of charge. Can we put a price on 'face'?

If I wanted the frame back (honestly, why? it's not worth it to reuse in any professional business sense), I'd arrange to pay for it's shipping and handling if owner was agreeable.
 
Customer -> pissed ->6000€ paid-> on his sight he does "nothing" -> bike burned -> warranty, no matter no excuses.....50% offer for a new bike? 3000€ only lost? are you kidding me? you lose money? hey thats
the game of beeing a seller. pretty sure you lost no money on your other sales and you make your money also without tax/bills/invoices (!)


Seller: -> earn his "money" -> on his sight the bike was 100% perfect quality build -> warranty? maybe, but i dont know what the customer did. as i talked to him he is not very firm with ebike stuff + it is half year old bike...
what should i do now?....what costs me if i give him a new bike? what costs me when maybe a few other customers did not buy anymore from me (because this "case")


we understand both sides...but only one know the truth. the customer. but who should we believe? we cant say.


1------------
i dont know when it starts i hope for the customer that he talked "enough" with artur BEFORE making this public.
if not, he choose the wrong way.
its better trying to find a solution BEFORE pissing on a "vendor"
it makes it easier for him to regulate. easier to make a new bike as a gesture of goodwill.


2-------------
if he does/talk enough with artur, probably artur did it the wrong way and risks with the shitstorm about the "battery" his reputation.



if: customer did all to clear up, but vector refuse -> fight harder with all ugly faces of war
if: customer wants to frock me trying to get a new bike because he made experimentel dangerous changes + start this shitstorm -> refuse any penny. the kid is allready fallen into water. reputation is cracked allready.



we all learn....sometimes easy, sometimes the hard way.
as a "psu-seller" i can recommend artur, making a Video of in/out of complete bikes for the customer with your serial to identify all bikes.

i had once a psu that worked on my site ( i test all before i sell/ship out) and worked only once on customer site. what happend nobody can say.
from this point i made for every buyer a video with full working psu. its for my own security and also good for the customer that he see: yea he is right it WAS everything ok.

as a customer. CHECK YOUR STUFF before you use it. if you buy a complete bike.....make a video how you recieved it. open it, film all, make a description about all you find (good or bad)
if you got a package...make an unboxing video that everyone can see if theres maybe a "shipping" damage.

this helps SO MUCH both sides of a deal.


now its to late i know. just for the future. I hope for both sides to find a solution.
 
A cell can reverse polarity. Very rare. A cell can have physical damage Crushed. The tab can short on can. Poor connection ?
? A battery fire intense a whole fireworks stand just going off.
Sorry I I feel your loss. Good luck
 
Playing with expensive gear/vehicle and especially DIY mods/repairs? You NEED loss insurance, plain and simple.

Way too many variables to lay blame entirely on the vendor/product.

Especially given amount of time lapsed and we’re not seeing a trend of these Vector eBikes going up in flames like this rare example.

Is it dramatic, dangerous, sad, etc? Of course, and I feel horrible for the OP.

But, I don’t see where the vendor is responsible for something the end user has messed with and used for a considerable length of time.
 
This is a tough situation, but I've seen similar problems many times. Product fails and the responsibility is not clear.

In the future, it would be helpful for the maker to have a very explicit warranty document that details the conditions and limitations of warranty and make the buyer sign that they read and understood it before money changes hands. This would help prevent any misunderstandings.

Any large battery has the potential for a thermal event regardless of chemistry. All it takes is a short in the wiring. Bikes are also inherently a bit dangerous and a mechanical failure (wheel falling off, for example) could result in injury and/or damage. As a result, some kind of insurance would make sense. If there had been a serious injury or death, the maker could be in serious trouble. Insurance is not cheap. This will increase the cost of the product but may be a necessary evil.
 
Hello

Thank you for your interventions.

I understand the point of view of everyone and I respect it.

I am waiting for a concrete proposal from the seller Artur.
And no, it is not possible for me to accept 50% on parts and find myself with a bike without warranty


I want to settle this matter in the best conditions. (For me and Artur)
 
I wonder why the HALL connector was cut off and the wires soldered together directly instead :?:
Wrapping the soldering joints than with electrical duct tape only isn't optimal IMO.

Artur, could you explain the reason why the battery was unbalanced?
Normally, a new battery should not show any drift, because the cells should arrive all with the SAME voltage from the manufacturer/supplier (even no matter what kind of charge if those got mixed).
Latest batches of cells will come with much lower voltage because of new shipping laws (batteries must have below 30% s.o.c. when shipped), but the voltage than will be similar as well among different charges, and i don't think that was the case when this battery was built early this year..
 
madin88 said:
I wonder why the HALL connector was cut off and the wires soldered together directly instead :?:
Wrapping the soldering joints than with electrical duct tape only isn't optimal IMO.

Artur, could you explain the reason why the battery was unbalanced?
Normally, a new battery should not show any drift, because the cells should arrive all with the SAME voltage from the manufacturer/supplier (even no matter what kind of charge if those got mixed).
Latest batches of cells will come with much lower voltage because of new shipping laws (batteries must have below 30% s.o.c. when shipped), but the voltage than will be similar as well among different charges, and i don't think that was the case when this battery was built early this year..

We were randomly checking battery capacity, by connecting a smart charger to a cell group and letting it discharge from fully charged to a empty state. I didn't have time to charge this pack back (we did test for each sells group individually ) . This is why first group of cell in pack was lower voltage. But at the end of the day adapt to bms did a job and balanced battery.
The soldering was on a halls signals wires as we had few issues with connectors from adaptto, so we soldered set of motor hall wires to adaptto hall wires. My mistake was that I didn't check how client did all the connections inside the frame after he receives his max from adaptto. I helped him to set up all adaptto parameters in a right order. And as you saw the battery cells voltage was OK from June to September(I think it was last time I received photo of cells voltage from client) .. just to clarify the situation. The fire started not during the charge, nor the high current discharge (I know this from a client), so I may assume after some hit or bump we get disconnected cable or phisicaly damaged cell in battery, taking into account that fire happened in forest.
I can not now what parts were used inside during this happened , but I saw on a picture the client did modifications to the frame side covers and bolts, that is not original components. And any use of not original components already lead to loosing warranty. Not talking about rim now..
I know if I offer new bike , it will be still modified some how.. so I don't want to offer anything with warranty to the same person. So the only option I offered was the full set of bike parts , that client can assemble himself, and be personally responsible on a quality of his assembly.
 
Hello Artur and thank you for your interventions.

I do not wish to conflict with you but to find a fair solution.

The solution that seems to me satisfactory would be to send me a new bike mounted for 3000 €, as you had proposed to me at the beginning of our exchanges.
You can recover the damaged bike and the parts.

Payment will be made at the reception of the new bike and you will be able to recover the burned bike for the parts.

I make an effort thank you for doing the same.
 
By the sound of it, it seems that you may have some loose wires or worse... parts that chaffe against the battery.

When compromise with Arthur will be solved, you should either:
- share pictures of how you fix or install wirings/part
- or ask him to send the assembled bike lol
 
cwah said:
By the sound of it, it seems that you may have some loose wires or worse... parts that chaffe against the battery.

When compromise with Arthur will be solved, you should either:
- share pictures of how you fix or install wirings/part
- or ask him to send the assembled bike lol

The original purchased bike was pre assembled and came with a bunch of loosley taped up joined together wires which looked very shoddy and should have had a connector.

The purchaser was then given permission by vectorbikes to try and do the warranty repair under instruction from Artur. It is at this point that the bike should have been shipped back to Vector, but the OP decided to try and fix it which he was encouraged to do by Artur, which to be honest was a very bad move by the distributor. Thats like buying a tv which has been badly wired and the manufacturer telling you to open it up and repair it by instruction given down a phone line. Ridiculous :roll:
 
Yup, tap protected wires are the worst. I do that sometimes when I'm lazy and it always comes back to me in the middle of the road 6 months later. Usually it becomes loose after some time and start shorting.. especially when it rains.

Now I always make sure I have proper shrink wrap and will spend the extra time to have clean connection... because it's called bounce back with way more pain than the few minutes it saved initially :lol:

Agree that the seller needs to take responsibilities on that one and can't just blame the buyer. 50/50 sounds fair, and even a bit more from the seller as it was under warranty initially and it was his job to make sure everything is done properly.
 
Any of the damage was not caused by *bad wiring, those who has adaptto know this (it was standart HALL error). The wires were soldered and ducktaped just for isolation.. there is no way it can get loose or anything like this. And everything was inside the frame, so rain or whatever you wrote, has nothing to do with it.
I told I will offer 50% for a parts in case we receive the frame and other parts first to inspect (I told over a week ago). Untill then nothing is going to happened.
 
To me, this is amazing; in any other industry this type of egregious problem would be resolved by the offending company as quickly and quietly as possible. Here, the manufacturer offers no recourse (selling you replacement for his cost if you return the evidence at your expense). Do this in the US and the Consumer Protection Agency will make sure it doesn't occur again.
 
2old said:
To me, this is amazing; in any other industry this type of egregious problem would be resolved by the offending company as quickly and quietly as possible. Here, the manufacturer offers no recourse (selling you replacement for his cost if you return the evidence at your expense). Do this in the US and the Consumer Protection Agency will make sure it doesn't occur again.

so far we saw nothing, just a pictures from client. what if he burned it for purpose? didn't think about it? and what strange in the fact that we want to inspect the frame to open a new facts hopefuly? as I said, before we inspect the frame - nothing going to happend..and if you or anybody else dont like it - try to to do it with any other product.
 
When a customer needs this much support, and obviously lacks basic knowledge, it's an overwhelming risk there are hidden mistakes as well.
Only based on my own experience from helping people that try to do something they know nothing about.

I would not expect Artur to be responsible under these circumstances, I even think the 50% deal is a show of goodwill.
Especially since he rode the self modified bike for 6months.
 
Artur, you do not want to accept my proposal?

I will not send the frame, and surely not at my expense!
And once you are at home, you can tell me that you have no responsibility and I am left with nothing.

The bike wreck will remain in my possession until we reach an agreement.

I took a step towards you, I am open to dialogue, I even agree to lose some money (because I used the bike for 6 months) but I will not accept either, Whatever.

Read the comments of the people around, take their opinions into account and it seems to me that your reaction is not in your interest (commercially)
 
vectorIbike said:
Artur, you do not want to accept my proposal?

I will not send the frame, and surely not at my expense!
And once you are at home, you can tell me that you have no responsibility and I am left with nothing.

The bike wreck will remain in my possession until we reach an agreement.

I took a step towards you, I am open to dialogue, I even agree to lose some money (because I used the bike for 6 months) but I will not accept either, Whatever.

Read the comments of the people around, take their opinions into account and it seems to me that your reaction is not in your interest (commercially)

After you put so much dirt on Vector and me personaly, telling story just from one side, I have no intention to do anything for such a person! I was ready to loose money and to cover return shipping of the frame to inspect everything first, and then to offer you a 50/50 solution for ALL parts you need! You didn't agree, and you choose blackmailing tactics.. Then I blocked you on whatsapp and you start posting all this bullshit aka. "VECTOR WILL EXPLODE" and so on.. Tell me, why should I do anything for you now, after all of this? Will you post everywere - "Vector gave me all bike components I needed to build a bike for half price, even I was using non original components", like you posted dirt everywhere? I doubt..
 
given that following is the truth (otherwise please correct):

hall connection to the motor was done messy
controller had halls error
battery was unbalanced when shippend and got unbalanced every time anew (probabaly a dead cell?)
unaware user was told he can continue to use the bike, despite the fact that there was a problem with the battery
battery caught fire

is it only me who sees a connection between those points?

sorry for your loss vectorIbike. I hope things will go out well for you.
 
madin88 said:
given that following is the truth (otherwise please correct):

hall connection to the motor was done messy
controller had halls error
battery was unbalanced when shippend and got unbalanced every time anew (probabaly a dead cell?)
unaware user was told he can continue to use the bike, despite the fact that there was a problem with the battery
battery caught fire

is it only me who sees a connection between those points?

sorry for your loss vectorIbike. I hope things will go out well for you.

You're not the only one. Selling any item with faulty parts is unprofessional and the vendor should be ashamed. Sending a bike with an unbalanced battery and then making excuses about not having enough time is just crapola. Most civilized countries have consumer laws to protect against this type of nonsense (if you buy the product in the same country at least).
 
I always love it when someone says: "Gee I would have done all these things if only you hadn't done this." We all can watch these type of comments fertilize grass.
 
madin88 said:
given that following is the truth (otherwise please correct):

hall connection to the motor was done messy
controller had halls error
battery was unbalanced when shippend and got unbalanced every time anew (probabaly a dead cell?)
unaware user was told he can continue to use the bike, despite the fact that there was a problem with the battery
battery caught fire

is it only me who sees a connection between those points?

sorry for your loss vectorIbike. I hope things will go out well for you.


1) if you mean soldering by saing messy, yes, we used soldering. any problem caused by using soldering for hall wires?
2) no, bike was fully working, and customer received fully assembled ready to ride. The first problem the client has was a bended rear whell (someone forgot to pump it..)
3) I think I have posted 2 photo here of the battery cells, or you didn't see them? if not, please do so.

Artur said:
Talking about battery:

June:





September:



3 month time period and it is on same level prety much..

4) did I miss something? what problem? I was chating with client 1 day before fire! Everything was ok with a bike and it's components!!
5) yes, but we dont know what was the reason by now. We didnt have a chance to see the bike yet..
 
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