what is wrong with my set up 'Updated'

[lifepo4ever]

Hi every one, since i have my new lipo set up there something wrong about it , i blown a fuse evertime i run the bike ,
my crystalyte controller can handle 100 volt and 100 amps


also my shunt from my Ca reduce to much power and i don't know why so i run the ebike with out Ca and i have full power until the fuse blown!!

my lipo pack is turnigy 5000mah 24sp2

look the drawing I made its exactly what is have i run 4 fuse of 30 amps each

the reason i do this because i want to give controller the maximum current of 120 amps (4x 30= 120 )

the last fuse always burn at full trottle and i burn 2 today

sorry i if i dumb but i am here to learn ..

 

[heathyoung]

I'm having a hard time understanding both your diagram and question.

You have 8 X 6S packs correct. It appears that you parallel at the positives, with a 30A fuse in series.

This will give you a current rating of 30A - not 120A.

If you want 120A, you can parallel the 4 30A fuses (although this is a *very* bad way to do this).

I'll draw you a diagram...

 

[AussieJester]

hrmz...letz see...30 amp fuses...100amp controller...lipos capable of 200amp plus without breaking a sweat... it
is a mystery Gets some beefier fuses :wink:

KiM

 

[lifepo4ever]

ok so i was wrong thinking i have 120 amps lol ok thanks i will wait to sse the drawing

 

[heathyoung]

First image is what you have - 6 series packs, two paralleled together, 4 in series with 4 series 30A fuses.

Second image is what you SHOULD have - 6 series packs, two paralleled together, 4 in series with 4 PARALLELED 30A fuses.

Can I ask what the breaker does - is it a circuit breaker with enough capacity to achieve what you want (it needs to handle 120A or it will blow placed where it is) - could you omit the fuses and just run off the breaker?

Tell me if there is anything in the circuit diagram you don't understand.

 

[colby]

just get yourself 1 80amp fuse and you'll be set.

you want a fuse rated a little lower then the max (100amp controller) current draw.

fuses can pass more current then specified for short periods.

hope this helps


colby

 

[Doctorbass]

+1 for heathyoung secod diagram.. it's WHAT YOU MUST DO.. but i would just put 2x 40A fuse in parallel..... or 4 x 20A not 4 x 30A

i'm using 2x 40A fuse in parallel on every of my packs and i have 210A burst on my controller without any blowing fuse problem.

The 40A are orange.. not green like the 30A

Also.. instead of putting ONE big fuse.. I STRONGLY RECOMMAND USING MORE LITTLE FUSE !!

it's more accurate and safer cause teh average of each fuse tolerance is better than the tolerance of one fuse.



Put 3 x 30A or 2 x 40A or 4 x 20A parallel fuses between the controller positive and the positive of the last battery in serie ( just like heathyoung is showing.. but with diffrent fuse combinaison)


and. your fuse blowing problem will dissapear! :wink:

Doc

 

[knoxie]

Glad to see folks are using fuses so many people dont bother...so not a good idea when using Lipo only quickly read the thread but you should have your answer in there, remeber the last fuse in line will take the full current of the packs.

I run a main fuse and smaller fuses between the packs for discrimination, any link plugs I have has a fuse in it to avoid the possibility of connecting it straight in to a battery!! most, most of these fuses are solderred inline to help reduce the resistance only the main line fuse is in a socket.

I never blew a main pack fuse on my bike in 4 years but nice to know its there if you need it.

Good Luck

Knoxie

 

[colby]

+1 for heathyoung secod diagram.. it's WHAT YOU MUST DO.. but i would just put 2x 40A fuse in parallel..... or 4 x 20A not 4 x 30A

i'm using 2x 40A fuse in parallel on every of my packs and i have 210A burst on my controller without any blowing fuse problem.

The 40A are orange.. not green like the 30A

Also.. instead of putting ONE big fuse.. I STRONGLY RECOMMAND USING MORE LITTLE FUSE !!

it's more accurate and safer cause teh average of each fuse tolerance is better than the tolerance of one fuse.



Put 3 x 30A or 2 x 40A or 4 x 20A parallel fuses between the controller positive and the positive of the last battery in serie ( just like heathyoung is showing.. but with diffrent fuse combinaison)


and. your fuse blowing problem will dissapear! :wink:

Doc

for some reason i thought this was one big pack sorry i was a little confused with the diagram.

yes, what doc suggest sounds good :wink:

 

[amberwolf]

Can I ask what the breaker does - is it a circuit breaker with enough capacity to achieve what you want (it needs to handle 120A or it will blow placed where it is) - could you omit the fuses and just run off the breaker?

As far as I can tell from what Lifepo4ever and I were discussing via PM, your diagrams have it correct in both cases.

As for the breaker, it is his cutoff switch, in case of emergency, basically, if the fuses don't blow (or they do but somehow the system remains shorted) or he just wants to switch it off completely.


As for the CA shunt (stand alone model) reducing power; I don't really see why that would happen. Unless something else is wrong, the shunt wired in series with the pack to the controller would not introduce enough resistance to cause any kind of problem at up to 45A continuous, peaks of 100A. If you are drawing lots more current than that, more than momentarily, you might need a bigger shunt so as not to damage the shunt. There is a separate model of CA, the CA-HC, that is designed for that but you could rewire the one you have to do it. They also have a shunt in stock for 200-300A continuous currents, and up to 800A peak, or you can find one elsewhere with different (higher or lower) ratings.
http://www.ebikes.ca/drainbrain.shtml

 

[lifepo4ever]

thanks every one for the help i am very happy !!

ok i will respond to the ask question

the bresker is rated to 2500A i don't think it will blow !!

the goal of that is to proctect my pack individualy so if i connect it wrong i wll have just a fuse blowing not a ligth show!!

I understand the diagram your made but this doesnt protect each of my pack

another example if i go ride my ebike and one cell of one pack puff what gonna happen ? a light show!! but if they are fused its cut the process or at least it gonna help

 

[yopappamon]

the bresker is rated to 2500A i don't think it will blow !!

I think you might be confusing the breakers interupting rating with its trip rating.

 

[cell_man]

If you want to have some protection on each of the packs you will have to increase the current rating of each of the 4 fuses you are using to something like 80A. The fuse holders and more specifically look a bit thin for that sort of current, you might want to consider a bigger fuse. see what I did with a 300A fuse (I know it's a bit too big, but it's what I had lying around). I also doubt that breaker is rated to 2500A, maybe 2500W, but that is likely the AC rating, not the DC. You'll soon find out if it's not up to the job as it will just fail. Why not just use brake levers with the ebrake switch, alternatively you could use a suitably rated relay or pair of relays and have a a switch on the bars to turn them off.

View attachment CIMG0981.JPG

With high volts, large controllers and high C rated packs a pre-charge resistor is advisable IMO on so many levels

 

[Doctorbass]

Here is what you need:

you can replace the fuse by the value you desire. 2x 40A can be ok for 200A short burst (displayed by the calibrated C-A)

Pay attention to the way to connect parallel thing whne sharing the current equally! ( like i shown in the exemple)

i'm using this exact setup for 6000km now and it's perfect... saved my controller from frying alot of time and avoid welding tools like long noise or screw driver...

Using multiple parallel fuse reduce alot the spark and blast that a single fuse normally do.. it's like the spark is shared in time in all the parallel fuse so at high voltage ( 72V and up ) it REALLY HELP !... a normal 40A 32v car fuse make a huge blast! but two 20A fuse in parallel just dont.

Doc

 

[torker]

I think others are right about 2500 being the interrupt rating. A 2500 amp breaker would be huge. But it is obviously big enough to do the job and makes for a nice disconnect. Nice drawing Dr. Bass

 

[cell_man]

Multiple small fuses seems like a good idea as suggested by Doctorbass. It might also help with the bell wire that seem to be connected to the fuses in the picture you've posted too That fuse holder doesn't look capable of sustaining high current for long and will have some voltage drop, times 4. If you double them up it will definitely help.

 

[lifepo4ever]

so if i understand i have to add 4 more and put each fuse on the positive lead from each pack so 8 pack and 8 fuse

but how many amp will handle this set up? i just want my 100 amps that it , My CA is not programmable because it stand alone and he's not working properly

he become blank after 85 volt so its useless for now

 

[lifepo4ever]

oooh I forget to say very nice draw both of you thank you i feel so much better now i was so sad yesterday !!

 

[cell_man]

so if i understand i have to add 4 more and put each fuse on the positive lead from each pack so 8 pack and 8 fuse

but how many amp will handle this set up? i just want my 100 amps that it , My CA is not programmable because it stand alone and he's not working properly

he become blank after 85 volt so its useless for now

Just use appropriate fuses. i would have thought you would need 40A fuses, but you might be OK with a little less. Just parallel the 2 fuse holders exactly as was shown in the drawing, no need to split all the cables, just parallel a 2nd fuse holder where the existing 1s are now connected. Just try it, the worst that can happen is a fuse blows and you need to replace it. I would check to see if the wire leading to the fuse holder gets hot. They look a bit small to me, but if they don't get hot, they should be fine.

I beleve there are ways to remedy the CA problem, best to speak to Ebikes.ca, I'm sure they can tell you exactly what is required.

 

[amberwolf]

My CA is not programmable because it stand alone and he's not working properly
he become blank after 85 volt so its useless for now

As I'd said in the PM (that I also suggested you start this thread in):
"There is a possible wrong part in there, if this is one of the newer ones with two buttons. Talk to Justin at ebikes.ca, because it might be this problem:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19540&start=0
which can be fixed under warranty. "

 

[lifepo4ever]

thank you amberwolf but this tread is useless for me i have the old model with the buton on the right

what can i see i will need a resistor ...

 

[lifepo4ever]

i use 8 fuse of 30 amps for each positive lead my pack is a 24sp2 lipo pack and the fuse still burn what that mean ? i will go with 40 amps fuse i have no choice i think

 

[amberwolf]

8 fuses in parallel, on each + lead? Like this?
View attachment parallel fuse.PNG
Because if it's paralleled it shouldn't blow unless you are pulling more than 240A (assuming 8 fuses on each + lead).

Or 8 fuses in series, like this?
View attachment series fuse.PNG
if it's like this, in series, then it's still like you had before with 30A being the theoretical max the system will take before a fuse blows.

 

[lifepo4ever]

sorry i use 1 fuse for each positive lead so total of 8 fuse for the entire 24sp2 pack but my pack are parallel 6sp2 x 4 pack

i will send another picture

 

[Ariane]

Salut,

Je ne comprends pas ce qui n'est pas clair dans le dessin que Doctorbass t'as fait, tu dois mettre 2 fuse de 40 Ampères en parallèle (sur chaque fils positif de tes batteries) pour espérer avoir 120 ampères du coté contrôleur et tu protège ainsi chaque pack de batteries comme tu le souhaitais. C'est sur qu'une fuse de 30 ampères va bruler si tu lui demande un courant de 120 ampères, même si tu mets une fuse 40 ampères, tu va encore avoir le même problème.




Hi,

I really don't understand why you didn't use the explanation from Doctorbass, you really need to put 2 fuse of 40 amps in paralleled on every single positive lead of each batteries pack to expect 120 amps on your controller and this way each batteries pack are protected. Don't expect to get 120 amps on the controller side, with a 30 amps fuse on the batteries side.


Good day!
Black Arrow