It's a Banshee Phantom.
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CYC Photon Gen 2?
- Thread starter raylo32
- Start date
raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
So, do we know what motors have a problem going onto these bikes with the curved down tubes? Seems like an X1 Pro should work OK. Not sure why a Photon wouldn't also work but it might compromise ground clearance a bit more. This current StumpJumper 15 would make a good donor if the motors will go on and it seems to have pretty good space for a battery. The X1 might even be able to use the inside the triangle motor mounting option although that would compromise battery space. But OK for other battery mounts or backpack batteries.
www.specialized.com
Stumpjumper 15 Alloy - Shimano Deore, RockShox/X-Fusion
Stumpjumper 15 Alloy is here to obliterate every trade-off in the trail game. Devour bumps like a big bike? Check. Short-travel control, playfulness, an...
Looks like a banshee phantom v3.2. Curved down tubes are worse for ground clearance with the photon, but not always, as some straight down tubes have big welds like mine that prevent it from tilting up.
oregonxc
🧲 New user
It is not debadged. It is a Banshee Phantom v3.2 XL. I got it specifically for this build. The left crank wouldn't go all the way on without shaving some paint/powdercoat.
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oregonxc
🧲 New user
It works great. I now have about 100 miles on it. Mostly long steep inclines (1500 feet for 2-3 miles typically). It has been great so far. It does warm up a bit but nothing like the ToSeven DM01 it replaced. The torque sensor is better than the ToSeven - it is on par with my Specialized Levo SL torque sensor. I switched from the 36t chainring to a 42t gen 1 chainring to get a bit more top end on the flats. This week is gonna be rainy, we'll see how that goes.
raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
Looks like a nice build... not many Banshee dealers around.
Do you have a throttle? If so, in race mode it should go a lot faster that way than you can pedal. The Gen 1 was the same although hopefully the gen 2 can manage heat better and can do it longer before throttling down. I ran the 42t on my Photon gen 1 bike but wanted more pedaling top end speed so swapped for the 50t. I have only done one or 2 rides with it and it works OK and still climbs our hills, but I had to add a chain keeper to stop if from derailing. I may go back to the 42t and just blip the throttle when I need to go faster than I can spin the pedals, but that really isn't often.
Do you have a throttle? If so, in race mode it should go a lot faster that way than you can pedal. The Gen 1 was the same although hopefully the gen 2 can manage heat better and can do it longer before throttling down. I ran the 42t on my Photon gen 1 bike but wanted more pedaling top end speed so swapped for the 50t. I have only done one or 2 rides with it and it works OK and still climbs our hills, but I had to add a chain keeper to stop if from derailing. I may go back to the 42t and just blip the throttle when I need to go faster than I can spin the pedals, but that really isn't often.
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oregonxc
🧲 New user
Banshee Phantom v3.2 You can buy direct. I did.
No throttle for me. It wouldn't be much use - pretty much ascend and descend constantly here in the the oregon coast range
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I replaced both my CYC cranks with shorter ones from Miranda for my Gen 1 build, a huge improvement. Other people also had the same issue I had - left crank working loose over time. CYC did replace the cranks under warranty, though - so no issues there. I just don't think the cranks CYC are using are very good or have good enough tolerance for the ISIS spec.
The other issue is that the fitting details are a bit vague and the detail varies from the ISIS spec - there is no fixed hard shoulder for the left crank to seat against and the distance from the end of the shaft to the shoulder can be varied by the installer, which isn't great.
How did the 42T chainring fit wrt the chainstay? Also, did you have the Gen 1 Photon and if so, how does this compare?
EDIT: Did you have to remove the ISCG tabs?
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This was exactly my issue with the left crank as well. They sent me out the replacement but also told me to torque it better lol
I temporarily used Loctite on the left crank while I sorted it out, still worked loose but took longer. The problem is that once it works slightly loose, it flogs out the splines immediately and you don't feel the problem until it is too late. It is nothing to do with torquing the bolt, I think there's a slight flex somewhere that slowly works things loose, left side only. Works other way for right side. At least the damage occurs to the crank and the shaft seems bulletproof although I wonder if it is exactly on spec.
You aren't supposed to use Loctite BTW, the spec calls for grease
. Miranda cranks fit much better and I've had zero problems since fitting them.Interesting, I might just fit my other bike cranks on and see how that fairs.I temporarily used Loctite on the left crank while I sorted it out, still worked loose but took longer. The problem is that once it works slightly loose, it flogs out the splines immediately and you don't feel the problem until it is too late. It is nothing to do with torquing the bolt, I think there's a slight flex somewhere that slowly works things loose, left side only. Works other way for right side. At least the damage occurs to the crank and the shaft seems bulletproof although I wonder if it is exactly on spec.
You aren't supposed to use Loctite BTW, the spec calls for grease
oregonxc
🧲 New user
I didn’t have a gen 1 photon.
I put a 2mm spacer on the drive side to clear the chainwheel and chainstay
The banshee has a ICSG movable thing. I just moved it out of the way
What’s the biggest chainring that could fit without spacers? That sounds like really good chainstay clearance. I had to put a lot more spacers to fit a 36t since mines built for 30t
raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
That's a great point. My old converted bikes came with triple ring cranks so might have more space that modern 1x cranks. I'll need to keep that in mind if I end up shopping for a new bike to convert. That's another reason to try to see one in a local bike shop.
oregonxc
🧲 New user
42t is about as big as I can go with a 2mm spacer. There is less than 2mm clearance between the chain stay and the chain wheel.
raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
I buy road and gravel bikes direct but MTBs are tougher since the geometry is all over the place with them. And I am a little tough to fit with a longer inseam for my height I always fall in the gray area between needing a L and XL MTB and that can also vary with mfg and model. Size L would usually be OK except my seat height of 32.5" often puts the saddle too high above the bars like on my current old Stumpy. I had to add riser stem and bars to level that up. My even older Cannondale F1000 hard tail is an XL but with a new fork with longer steerer and shorter than OEM riser stem. Both these bikes the bars are now just ~level with the seat.
What size Phantom is yours and how does it fit? If it is a size L could you put the seat at 32.5 from the BB and then measure the drop to the top of the handlebars?
What size Phantom is yours and how does it fit? If it is a size L could you put the seat at 32.5 from the BB and then measure the drop to the top of the handlebars?
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oregonxc
🧲 New user
Mine is an Banshee XL. My seat height is 32". It is almost exactly the same measurement as my L Levo SL. The Levo's reach is about 15mm shorter than my Banshee. I went with the XL to be sure the battery would fit in the frame. Glad I did, I actually like the extra reach.
raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
So, with seat height at 32" from center of the BB what is the vertical distance down from the top of the saddle to the top of the handlebars? I see you cut the steerer tube to leave about 50mm above the head tube (I always do that, too), and you also have riser bars. IMO they make the front ends on these bikes too low... or maybe lot of other folks are on the short leg spectrum for our height? IDK, but it is frustrating.
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lol, didn’t realize the stealth was discontinued a few days prior
Finally got my replacement parts after two weeks.
Bike Setup
• MTB, Medium
• Rider + bike weight: 192 lb
• Chainring: 36T (ghost pedaling starts ~26 mph)
• Speed sensor unplugged
• Battery: 52V 17Ah 60A (full charge)
• Tires: 29x2.6 maxxis exo ii, tubeless, 18psi front 20psi rear (forgot to air it up for a bit more speed)
PAS 3 — Race Mode (Flat ground, no wind, 3.2:1 ratio)
• Max PAS speed (hard effort): 29 mph
• 0–20 mph: 9 s
• 0–29 mph: 21 s
• Max throttle speed: 30 mph
• 0–20 mph: 8–9 s
• 0–30 mph: 22 s
Performance is nearly identical between PAS and throttle, which surprised me — both feel smooth and linear with good power delivery.
⸻
Noise
Overall, very quiet under load — about equal to or slightly louder than a BBSHD when the motor is working hard under load or at top speed.
At lower gear ratios (2.7:1 or below), the sound becomes more noticeable and ramps up quickly at high RPM. At my lowest ratio (0.7:1), it’s definitely loud — RC car–like — though still manageable. It’s not obnoxious, but you’ll hear it.
⸻
Connectivity & Hardware Notes
• Couldn’t connect to the app — possibly because the speed sensor is unplugged.
• When connected, signal was weak and intermittent.
• Removed the speed sensor for now since it looked awkward and insecure (too long for my setup).
• Cranks aren’t perfectly flush — off by about 2 mm per side. Not an issue yet, but could cause minor shifting over time.
• Reached out to CYC twice about this; no response yet.
Edit: chain skipping on the high gear. It was doing this when I first installed the motor 2 weeks ago (no motor power, just pedaling) but it went away shortly after. Even testing today for 15mi under motor power it hasn’t show up until now.
⸻
Fitment & Installation
Not the easiest bike for a conversion, but it worked out well overall.
• BB has a taper, but the Photon’s split shaft allowed a solid mount with drive-side spacers.
• The spacers also gave just enough chainring clearance — my frame maxes out at 32T, and this 36T barely fits.
• Chainline is excellent — all 12 gears work smoothly, which was a big reason I chose this motor.
• Only real drawback: fat BB welds prevent tilting the motor upward.
⸻
Performance & Ride Feel
The power delivery feels natural — like it’s amplifying your pedaling effort rather than just switching on power. Acceleration feels strong but controlled, not jerky.
With the lowest gearing that still hits 20 mph top speed, it now does 0–20 mph in 5 seconds.
Planning a 34% grade hill test next — I expect the MTB gearing to help a lot.
⸻
Comparison to BBSHD (Different Build)
For context, my previous BBSHD setup was on a lighter road bike (about 5 lb less) with higher gearing and 27.5” slicks.
The BBSHD had a more aggressive, on/off throttle feel with noticeably more torque at low speed, but slightly lower top speed on similar stretches. It also relied on the speed sensor to avoid throwing errors.
Top speed on that setup was around 41 mph (long stretch, full pas), but acceleration past 32 mph was slow. I’d usually top out at 32 on most roads and rarely hit 35. 0-20 in 7 seconds. For some reason, the throttle topped out at 28mph, likely due to poor design.
In contrast, the Photon feels capped around 30 mph but delivers its power more smoothly and predictably. While it won’t match the BBSHD’s brute force, it feels more refined and responsive overall.
Edit: another thing to note, on photon I can achieve 20mph on 1.2 gear ratio, 23mph on 1.5 gear ratio, and 27mph on 1.7 gear ratio. BBSHD tops out earlier (20–22 mph at 1.8), it’s likely reaching its effective top RPM/torque limit earlier, or the controller is limiting output at that gearing. The bbshd was on a smaller wheel, but it still looks like photon is likely to reach higher speeds at lower ratios
Bike Setup
• MTB, Medium
• Rider + bike weight: 192 lb
• Chainring: 36T (ghost pedaling starts ~26 mph)
• Speed sensor unplugged
• Battery: 52V 17Ah 60A (full charge)
• Tires: 29x2.6 maxxis exo ii, tubeless, 18psi front 20psi rear (forgot to air it up for a bit more speed)
PAS 3 — Race Mode (Flat ground, no wind, 3.2:1 ratio)
• Max PAS speed (hard effort): 29 mph
• 0–20 mph: 9 s
• 0–29 mph: 21 s
• Max throttle speed: 30 mph
• 0–20 mph: 8–9 s
• 0–30 mph: 22 s
Performance is nearly identical between PAS and throttle, which surprised me — both feel smooth and linear with good power delivery.
⸻
Noise
Overall, very quiet under load — about equal to or slightly louder than a BBSHD when the motor is working hard under load or at top speed.
At lower gear ratios (2.7:1 or below), the sound becomes more noticeable and ramps up quickly at high RPM. At my lowest ratio (0.7:1), it’s definitely loud — RC car–like — though still manageable. It’s not obnoxious, but you’ll hear it.
⸻
Connectivity & Hardware Notes
• Couldn’t connect to the app — possibly because the speed sensor is unplugged.
• When connected, signal was weak and intermittent.
• Removed the speed sensor for now since it looked awkward and insecure (too long for my setup).
• Cranks aren’t perfectly flush — off by about 2 mm per side. Not an issue yet, but could cause minor shifting over time.
• Reached out to CYC twice about this; no response yet.
Edit: chain skipping on the high gear. It was doing this when I first installed the motor 2 weeks ago (no motor power, just pedaling) but it went away shortly after. Even testing today for 15mi under motor power it hasn’t show up until now.
⸻
Fitment & Installation
Not the easiest bike for a conversion, but it worked out well overall.
• BB has a taper, but the Photon’s split shaft allowed a solid mount with drive-side spacers.
• The spacers also gave just enough chainring clearance — my frame maxes out at 32T, and this 36T barely fits.
• Chainline is excellent — all 12 gears work smoothly, which was a big reason I chose this motor.
• Only real drawback: fat BB welds prevent tilting the motor upward.
⸻
Performance & Ride Feel
The power delivery feels natural — like it’s amplifying your pedaling effort rather than just switching on power. Acceleration feels strong but controlled, not jerky.
With the lowest gearing that still hits 20 mph top speed, it now does 0–20 mph in 5 seconds.
Planning a 34% grade hill test next — I expect the MTB gearing to help a lot.
⸻
Comparison to BBSHD (Different Build)
For context, my previous BBSHD setup was on a lighter road bike (about 5 lb less) with higher gearing and 27.5” slicks.
The BBSHD had a more aggressive, on/off throttle feel with noticeably more torque at low speed, but slightly lower top speed on similar stretches. It also relied on the speed sensor to avoid throwing errors.
Top speed on that setup was around 41 mph (long stretch, full pas), but acceleration past 32 mph was slow. I’d usually top out at 32 on most roads and rarely hit 35. 0-20 in 7 seconds. For some reason, the throttle topped out at 28mph, likely due to poor design.
In contrast, the Photon feels capped around 30 mph but delivers its power more smoothly and predictably. While it won’t match the BBSHD’s brute force, it feels more refined and responsive overall.
Edit: another thing to note, on photon I can achieve 20mph on 1.2 gear ratio, 23mph on 1.5 gear ratio, and 27mph on 1.7 gear ratio. BBSHD tops out earlier (20–22 mph at 1.8), it’s likely reaching its effective top RPM/torque limit earlier, or the controller is limiting output at that gearing. The bbshd was on a smaller wheel, but it still looks like photon is likely to reach higher speeds at lower ratios
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AFAIK the bluetooth connectivity (antenna) is via the speed sensor. You would be better to just move the magnet.
Almost certainly a mix of different chain and sprocket wear - usually newer chain on old sprocket, those small cogs wear really fast, especially on ebikes.
So finally tinkered with the app, the max watts I was at was apparently only half. Goes 40 now and probably more if I get a longer stretch of road. Feels like it gets there quicker than bbshd too. The fact my mtb is bigger, heavier, and lower gearing than the other build says a lot too. However, I really eat up the battery probably -0.5V per mile for my 873wh pack with 2kw full throttle
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raylo32
🚴♂️ Mega poster
That sounds more like it. Very similar to what my Gen 1 Photon will do at 2kw. But I would never run mine like that for a mile due to heating issues. The Gen 2 should do better.