1969 Schwinn Class act

[OrganicFat]

Here she is, in all her '69 steel tube glory. The paint's a little chipped, the rims are roached, brakes are broken, and the chrome needs a spit shine... But HEY! She was only $60!

This ol' girl needs a few new bike parts to make her road worthy along with top of the line color matching for period accurate classy-ness.

I'm building it for my girlfriend who picked the bike out. She has requested about a 40 mile range, which poses some challenges:

1. EVERYTHING seems to be made from non standard parts and measurements compared to contemporary parts.
2. There is a budget of about $1000. Its nice but I can't go hog wild.
3. My GF is picky about how this thing is going to look. I think she wants it to appear like a restored '69 Ladies Schwinn.
4. I'll probably have to modify the bike in some way to fit new parts.

 

[OrganicFat]

Now for some bike nerrrrd pics and info...
Front dropout spacing: 3.485" or 88.52mm
That roached front rim is 26"x1.15" and a 36 spoke. At least this is standard ish...

 

[OrganicFat]

Rear dropout size:
4.2" or 106.7mm

At least the Sturmey Archer 3 speed hub shifter still works! I'll keep it.

 

[OrganicFat]

Dat Shifter housing is raoched including the plastic stop thing

 

[bchaney]

Cool bike. Luckily with the steel frame you can "coax" those dropouts to the width you need. Any ideas on the plan? Front hub motor? How fast does she wanna go? 40mi range is pretty serious.

 

[OrganicFat]

@bchaney She definitely wants to go with a front hub motor. The rear dropouts are SUPER weird in size... and the Shifting hub STILL WORKS! 8) If its not broke, don't broke it more.

I think we can just pry the forks apart by hand and everything will fit nice, nice.

She just purchased the Smart Pie V5 Golden Motor kit with a charger and 17.0 Ah White Whale Battery. Linky
She's a classy lady who wants to go the distance.

 

[LewTwo]

@bchaney She definitely wants to go with a front hub motor. The rear dropouts are SUPER weird in size... and the Shifting hub STILL WORKS! 8) If its not broke, don't broke it more.

I think we can just pry the forks apart by hand and everything will fit nice, nice.

She just purchased the Smart Pie V5 Golden Motor kit with a charger and 17.0 Ah White Whale Battery. Linky
She's a classy lady who wants to go the distance.

The GM has a large diameter axle so you are likely going to need to deepen the dropouts as well. At least you do not have to worry about "lawyer lips". If you are lucky you may be able to get the Torque Arms to anchor in the same holes as the fender struts.

 

[OrganicFat]

@LewTwo

The GM has a large diameter axle so you are likely going to need to deepen the dropouts as well. At least you do not have to worry about "lawyer lips". If you are lucky you may be able to get the Torque Arms to anchor in the same holes as the fender struts.

Hmmm, this is concerning. I've gotta few questions... What is the diameter and flat to flat dimension of the V5 axle? Also *ahem* what are "lawyer lips"?

So I measured the Schwinn's dropout shape and goes as follows (I pointed them out in the pic):
Diameter: Ø 0.45" (Ø11.4mm)
Slot width: 0.35" (8.9mm)

The Diameter of my Crystalyte HT3525's Axle is: Ø 0.59" (15mm)
The flat to flat legnth is 0.5" (12.7mm)

I wonder if the 2 motors use a similar axle?

 

[LewTwo]

I think that there are two size axles in common use for hub motors
1) M12x1.25 with 10mm wide flats
2) M14x1.5 with 10mm wide flats

Modern bikes have have drop outs designed for smaller diameter axles (9mm I believe) that sometimes need to be filed a bit so the 10mm wide flats will fit in the slot. They also sometime require "deepening" in order to the accommodate the full depth of the axle. That does not look like either will be a problem with that fork.

Lawyer lips;

copied from Sheldon Brown's web site:

Lawyer Lips, Lawyer Tabs
Because some bicycle users are competent enough to remove their front wheels but not competent enough to secure them properly when they reinstall them, virtually all new bike purchasers have been deprived of the handy function of quick-release front wheels.

This has been done by encumbering fork ends with extra hardware, ridges or lumps that keep the wheel sort-of attached even if it has been installed by someone who doesn't know what he or she is doing. Unfortunately, this means that the quick-release mechanism must be re-adjusted each time it is used, seriously slowing down the operation.

Since this extra stuff was installed as a defense against frivolous lawsuits by ambulance-chasing shysters, the extra bumps are sometimes known as "lawyer lips" or "lawyer tabs."

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_l.html

Obviously I was also wrong about the fender strut eyelets. Those dropouts look like they were formed by pressing the tube to form a flat section at the bottom. I recommend a good set of torque arms.

 

[tomjasz]

Finshing a 73 blue here soon.

 

[Chalo]

Obviously I was also wrong about the fender strut eyelets. Those dropouts look like they were formed by pressing the tube to form a flat section at the bottom. I recommend a good set of torque arms.

The forks on less expensive Chicago-built Schwinns were Ashtabula forks. They weren't tubular at all, but forged from a solid bar of steel in the same way as their one-piece cranks (also made by Ashtabula) or a wrench. They're particularly strong, aerodynamically efficient, and heavy (compared to other contemporary forks).

A really astute torque arm for an Ashtabula fork would take the form of a plate with a milled slot that fits snugly over the outside parallel edges of the fork tip. That way, it could be mounted like an axle washer, with no attachment other than the axle nut.

 

[OrganicFat]

The forks on less expensive Chicago-built Schwinns were Ashtabula forks. They weren't tubular at all, but forged from a solid bar of steel in the same way as their one-piece cranks (also made by Ashtabula) or a wrench. They're particularly strong, aerodynamically efficient, and heavy (compared to other contemporary forks).

A really astute torque arm for an Ashtabula fork would take the form of a plate with a milled slot that fits snugly over the outside parallel edges of the fork tip. That way, it could be mounted like an axle washer, with no attachment other than the axle nut.

Hmm, I was really hoping not to need any torque arms because the fork is steel... I may have to make a custom one and paint it cherry red.

 

[Chalo]

Hmm, I was really hoping not to need any torque arms because the fork is steel... I may have to make a custom one and paint it cherry red.

Pretty much any open slot dropout needs a torque arm. The axle is also made of steel and it has tremendous mechanical advantage to pry the fork tips open with.

 

[OrganicFat]

Soooooo... Disaster has struck. I wanted to get new rims, but apparently no one makes 26 1-3/8" rims any more! It seems like Schwinn was designing in a vacuum and had no regard for standard parts in '69 (big surprise).

I can find a rim that has a similar ERD (effective rim diameter) of 590mm. The Schwinn's ERD is 597mm.

The extended reach breaks https://www.amazon.com/Tektro-Reach-Calipers-Silver-55-73mm/dp/B006Z0OVWC BARELY make contact with the breaking surface...

Any ideas ebike wizards?

 

[Warren]

Schwinn and most American companies of the time, as part of a former English colony, thought the sun would never set on the British Empire.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/tires/597.html

There is a lesson in there somewhere.

How many furlongs in a metric?

 

[Chalo]

You can use MTB rims or non-Schwinn 26x1-3/8 (590) rims with longer reach calipers (BMX/cruiser type), or you can use 700c rims with the calipers you have already. Old Schwines like that tend to have relatively high bottom brackets, which suggests a smaller wheel diameter. But the brakes will work better with 700c wheels.

Don't make the mistake of using 650B (584) or 650C (571) rims. The former is needlessly expensive, and the latter has almost no choice of tires.

Definitive tiebreaker is whichever wheel size your old lady likes better.

 

[Warren]

I don't think the fenders will clear the 700c.

 

[Chalo]

Consider that the radius of 700C is almost exactly half an inch different than the radius of Schwinn 26x1-3/8". If you can judge half an inch, you can decide whether or not it will fit. There's no wheel size in between 597 and 622.

Edit:.
For what it's worth, the photo above shows quite a bit more than 0.5 inch between tire and fender. On the other hand, I prefer fatter tires, and only MTB or 650B tires will get you that.

 

[Warren]

Running fenders with little tire clearance can be dangerous. We were once on an organized ride with a guy running fenders with perhaps a quarter inch clearance. On a fast descent, he picked up a leafy twig on his front tire. It jammed between the tire and fender, causing an instant face plant. He left in an ambulance, in bad shape.

Many of the newer fender sets have breakaway mounts to help with this problem. Those old Schwinns did not.

 

[tomjasz]

BTW the nicest Lawyers Lips are the Grin frm Canada. Not those punched out Chinese. Prolly makes no difference but Zgrin stuuf sure is nice... im amazed by the difference in torque arms.