Australian Motored Bicyclist Charged and fined $1000...

[AussieJester]

OK so its a ICE assisted bike but the guy is arguing its 200watt haha now, i know for a fact the only 200watt
HT motors are available from an Australian dealer Rock Solid Engines and they don't cost the 200 bucks this guys has reported he paid for his, they are up near $AU425 and
come with certification in form of dyno printout i believe, they also max a bicycle out at under 30 clicks not the 40km/hr the fella has been caught doing or 47 clicks he admits its done, SO if he had one of these 200watt engines he would of already had the documentation, i think this guyz up shit creek without a paddle...



The status of this souped-up bicycle is central to a case being played out in Wollongong Local Court.

Velko Bozinovski, 40, of Cringila says it is a bike fitted with a 200-watt motor "to help get me up hills".

Police who stopped him in Flinders St, North Wollongong on March 10 after recording his speed at 40km/h say it is a motorbike.

They issued him with fines of $1000 for riding an unregistered and uninsured vehicle which he defended in court yesterday.

"I've been to the RTA and they say it's a power-assisted pedal cycle if the motor is 200 watts or less which means it doesn't have to be registered," he told the court.

He said he bought the engine kit from the internet and the company literature says the engine is 200 watts.

He told magistrate Michael Stoddart the fastest he'd ridden on the bike was 47km/h on the bike track at Cringila.

"Police said that a hair-dryer is 120 watts - and that there was no way it was 200 watts and then they gave me the fines," he said.

"If you were riding it at 47km/h you wouldn't need a hairdryer," Mr Stoddart said.

He adjourned the case until September 2 for Bozinovski to get written documentation that the engine was 200 watts.

Outside the court Bozinovski said he was a pensioner and used the bike to ride to Coniston to see his father in a nursing home.

"Most of the time I use the pedals but the engine is to get me up the hills," he said.

He said to fill his tank cost about $2 which took him 100km.

"The magistrate thought 47km/h was fast but I've had heaps of racing bikes pass me when I'm doing that.

"About five of my mates have got them and nobody has been fined except me."

As i see it the cheapest (lol..."semi-legal) way he can beat this is pay $425 for a new 200watt HT from rock solid...he will save near
600 bucks...just needs to change off the side cover for his original as the ones from Rock solid have a plate on the side
indicating 200watt, then take his documentation to court in Septemer

KiM

 

[Tiberius]

It doesn't say whether they have impounded the bike; that could be important.

Also interesting in that on the face of it, they have asked him to prove its less than 200 W, rather than the prosecution to prove its over. But presumably they are just asking for the paperwork, and then they'll decide who has to prove what.

Nick

 

[heathyoung]

Yep - guy in Newcastle NSW just pleaded guilty to the trifecta as well - Riding unlicensed, riding uninsured and riding unregistered - $900 + court costs.

 

[dingoEsride]

If he knew he was illegal then should of done the pedal hard look or if going flat out pedalless doing 47 is pretty suss,unless downhill, he looks like he could be a contender of the spooky tooth race or similar

 

[swbluto]

29 mph is definitely around 700 watts output on a normal bicycle. If he was aerodynamic, it might only be 400 watts. If he was aerodynamic and going down a unnoticeable 1% hill and pedaling his heart out, it might only be 200 watts. If he was aerodynamic and going down a unnoticeable 2% hill and not pedaling, then it might only be 200 watts.

 

[spinningmagnets]

If I lived where the police were like this, I'd have to add a pedelec torque sensor. Even if I had 2kW, it would only get power if i was pedaling (pretty much just spinning the pedals as an "on" switch). That would keep me from forgetting to pedal with the police hiding behind bushes.

These fines seem to have no relation to the potential damage to society if people were allowed to commit this "crime". I should think that $200 would be more realistic as a deterrent, but I suppose the Aus government simply cannot encourage anyone to start getting 100-mpg, and must nip this in the bud. How hard is it in that state to get a moped license and registration?

Time for a 63mm X 74mm RC motor on 72V LiPo (labeled 24V...but theres 3 of them), because, after all....how could a TINY motor like THAT possibly be over 200W? Also, use a BB-drive so the "tiny" motor can use the bicycle gears,...possibly a Nexus-8?

 

[swbluto]

IThese fines seem to have no relation to the potential damage to society if people were allowed to commit this "crime". I should think that $200 would be more realistic as a deterrent, but I suppose the Aus government simply cannot encourage anyone to start getting 100-mpg, and must nip this in the bud. How hard is it in that state to get a moped license and registration?

Indeed. There's other costs that society impose not related to physical societal damage risks, non-conformity being one of them. Somehow, if you're not inside a 2000 pound box transporting 200 lbs. worth of cargo and not giving at least $200 to Saudi Arabia on a yearly basis, you're at least slightly criminal.

 

[dogman dan]

Ya gotta get that 200 watt law changed someday, to a 1200 watt limit. That's about what a 9c on 48v pulls. Nazi cops, nothing better to do than hassle a bicycle doing 25 mph? Sheesh, bad as Florida. The law is obviously aimed at the guy riding his home made motorcycle with a 30 horse VW engine. A thou for a fast bike? There needs to be officer discretion, but then how much you wanna bet they know this guy and are out to hound him.

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

The state I live in (QLD) totally banned any bicycle with any kind of petrol, diesel or LPG assist motor on, about 3 years ago now. I had been riding those type of bikes as a commuter since 2001.
Thats when I decided to go electric, never looked back.
Much more fun.

Got pulled over by the cops down at tweed heads the other day...
They said "we reckon you were doing about 50kph when we first saw you" (which was true).
But they alway's give you the "attitude test" first.
I said "gday guys beautiful day, It's actually just an "assist" motor and I was pedaling hard with this fairly strong wind at my back.
They looked at the bike and said "it's electric then, is it".
"Sure is, I put this one together as a hobby"

"Ok seeya".

Too Easy.

 

[hydro-one]

Yeah these 200w law is pure garbage. The oil campanies know as long as they have that law there , ebikes will be POWERLESS as a REAL option. And guess what. The harder WE work, the more ebikes will be noticed . and the more WE will be noticed as ILLEGAL EBIKERS. So WE end up cutting our own throats, and end up being outlawed, and fined out of existence. because most of us arnet rich folk, and really, that is the heart of the matter isnt it? To keep the poor poor, to tax the poor unfairly, and to squash any kind of viable options to the car and the oil .

FREE THE EBIKE CAMPAIGN!!!!!!

SIGN the worldwide petition to end the silly power restrictions that have been put upon ELECTRIC BICYCLES. These bicycles should instead be classified under a new STATUTE FOR ELECTRIC HUMAN ASSIST HYBRID VEHICLES......with wieght and speed restricitons based on common sense of the ev community, not the oil money soaked puplic officials that ushered in these RIDICULOUS laws that are in place today.

I for one would like the weight restriciton to be such that most of these cheap chinese plastic scooter crap, stays out of it . because i want sidewalks , TOO.

So whos onboard, I would of course be the president , of this endeavor , so i guess we can start with a mission statment. which will start a new thread i guess.....


Mission. to establish a worldwide standard for ebicycle, a sensible definition of what an ebicycle is, and how it compares to both bicycles and pedestrians. A new definition to help increase sensible eco-firendly mobility worldwide.

what u think


oh and i agree with the friendly cops, and the fact that gas bikes are crap , pure crap. id rather get run over by a car than drive a two stroke, bicycle....

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

Wow Hydro, You sure are passionate about this.

Personally, I'm kinda enjoying our "under the radar" status at the mo.

But I do agree that I hate to share the path with that "cheap chinese plastic scooter crap"
Those things bring down the image of 2 wheeled EV's to some degree.

(FREE THE EBIKE CAMPAIGN!!!!!!)
I didn't know they were so supressed !!
Thanks for the tip .... :wink:

 

[veloman]

I think the only reason normal bikes are allowed to go up to the speed limit, is because if you can pedal 25, 30, 35mph.... (most likely a road racing type cyclist), then they will give you that freedom. The second you do such a speed without putting in the leg power, you are just a motorcyclist.

If you think about it that way, then it makes sense.


However, there is no reason ebikes shouldn't be allowed to go 25mph. Maybe there needs to be a small registration fee, and corresponding rider test. I wouldn't be against that.

Gov't does need to allow more options for travel than just the car. That also means designing roads for those who don't want to be part of the problem (pushing 3000lbs at 40+mph and the associated environmental, societal, safely, oil-industry problem).

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

I don't mind paying a small registration fee ...
But in return I want the same KW limits as cars and motorbikes.
The freedom to ride on motorways.
And allocated parking spaces.
Cheers.

 

[dogman dan]

Watt limits make no sense to me. But a simple speed limit does.

I think New Mexico in the US has it just about right almost. 25 mph speed limit for any kind of unlicenced motorized bicycle. Not ridiculously slow, but not so dangerous as 35 mph would be. Where they got it wrong though, is they call it a moped, which in this state means you need a drivers licence. They don't want drunks who lost thier licence to even have an ebike or moped I guess. Fortunately that part of the law is pretty much ignored by all cops state wide, provided you aren't weaving down the road wasted. As long as I don't exceed a roads posted speed limit, cops ignore me. I'm building a 40 mph bike, but it will not be ridden around for transportation. It's for the race track, and practice with it will happen on private property.

 

[dingoEsride]

So well said Dogman, it's not about power but speed limit, so go fast when it is safe to do so or on private land around the city on built up streets makes great sense, but sometimes here i'm sure its more about revenue not so much safety

 

[Evoforce]

I could see a 35 mph speed limit. And those of you that are too afraid to go 35 mph on your e-bike, you don't have to go any faster than what you feel comfortable. I read threads on here all the time, and most posters are not going under 20 mph. Meaning that, e-biking as viable and necessary transport out on the streets, is not generally complying with the laws as written. This means the law needs to be changed. Among us e-bikers, we would argue what that speed is, but the majority should rule. Or we need to come to a consensus somehow and start addressing these and other issues, amongst ourselves, so we can present a united front, and lobby for our rights, against these money hungry entities that are already entrenched in government. Oh here comes the argument of protecting us against ourselves. PLEASE... If I were able to be a lycra pedaling cyclist,(not berating them at all) I could go much faster than that as long as I didn't go over the posted speed limit, and it is not fair or just, to limit me to under 20 mph, like it is in my state. And no it is not right to tax, require license or insurance. Governments have alot of people brainwashed into just complying or they will come down on you. People will just not stand up for each other anymore. Too much hassle and besides we must work all the time to pay the bills. Who has time to help make policy or stand up for what we believe? Well believe me when I say, Those that see a profit from us will continue to make policy to make money from us at every turn. So flying under the radar eventually will only will only lead to the inevitable crashing into the ground yourself. They will pick us off one by one and everyone will just sit around and watch it happen. Sad it has become a me society and not a we society. We all have become much weaker people. I fall into the same trap as the rest of you. I just want to live in peace, take care of my family, honor my obligations, enjoy life, and be left alone. Is that possible? No! We have to fight for peace, fight for my family, and fight to honor my obligations, fight to have time and money to enjoy life, and fight for my freedom against a ever more intruding government that only appears to care about what money they can get out of me. Government is like a kid that gets what it wants all the time and thinks its entitled. If you don't stand up and say "no" when you should, eventually you will lose all control over it. After all, we the people are supposed to be in control of the government and not the other way around. We have to stand up for our rights...Oh man I forgot... we only have privilages now, and that can easily be taken away, anytime they want...

 

[swbluto]

but the majority should rule.

Just like how cars should rule the streets (And the associated laws) ?

 

[Evoforce]

I am also a car person, and a boat person, and a motorcycle person, and a airplane person, and etc. And I have stood up and voted on issues (when we were allowed to vote) on each of those issues too. Example: For motorcycles, we have a no helmet law here. The vote happened to go the way I wanted. People die from head injury sometimes when involved in accidents. I used to wear a helmet when I was younger, but now I don't. But when I ride my e-bike amongst heavy traffic, I wear a helmet because people have not seen me too many times, or haven't accurately judged my speed and distance. And sometimes they just haven't cared because they didn't want to share the road with me as the Federal law allows. Quite often tho, the local law doesn't support bicycles sharing the road, and there has been some epic battles in court over this.

 

[hydro-one]

your so right "flying under the radar eventually will only will only lead to the inevitable crashing into the ground yourself. They will pick us off one by one " that is what im worried about. creating a viable form of transport, and its ALREADY ILLEGAL!!!! they are just so ahead of OUR game , its sick. (oilman).

We need to band together for strength. We need an association of riders , compiled and organized separately from this forum (spies on here im sure). We will change this UNJUST LAW!!!!!

mike

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

..yes.

I am secretly Stephen Conroy (fedral communications minister)
I'm here to read all your posts Hydro.

 

[Gordo]

Common sense is a wonderful attribute.
I'm still putting around on my scooter, using the bike paths and bike lanes, all over town. Just go slower than the traffic and everyone will know you are "riding one of those useless electric things."

A few years ago a banned cage driver took to the bike paths with a 90cc Wizzer bicycle. He was OK until he went on the roads and demonstrated his 60 mph speed. They staked out his route from work to home one night, with the entire local force and actually tackled him on a bike trail. Because of 3 injured horsemen, he received 6 months of free room and board.
If you are caught fair and square, give up. Find another solution. A stealthy one with pedals is in my future.

 

[Gow864]

Where I live on the mid north coast of NSW Aus, about a year ago there were guys who had been banned from driving (presumably DUI) using these 2 stroke powered bikes to get around. It was just a red rag to the cops. They busted them for whatever they could as quick as possible. I actually rode past a cop who had stopped one of these bikes. I was at WOT going uphill at about 35km/h not pedalling, I don't think the cop even heard me go by, but the look on the guy who'd been stopped face was priceless.

I don't see these bikes around any more.

Gow.

PS: The bike I was riding at the time was WELL OVER the Aus limit.

 

[John in CR]

Just get your bike properly registered as the proper vehicle that it is in the chain of vehicle types. Do you really want 10-13 year olds able to get a bike like yours and ride freely on the roads? Do you want the DUI drivers to have such a great out to their transportation dilemma? Do you want illegal aliens who don't have the proper paperwork to obtain a license to have access to such transportation?

If the issue is that obtaining proper registration is difficult, or our powerful ebikes have no appropriate classification, then those are the issues to attack and do something about. Sure out of convenience for ourselves we want unlimited power and posted speed limits and other road rules to apply, but that view simply isn't realistic or reasonable when applied to a large segment of the population that we all want to have riding ebikes.

I'm very lucky that electrics fall outside of the rules here, so I can legally have unlimited power and only posted speed limits apply. I can even get on the highways, which are posted that bikes aren't allowed, since I have a moto-bici (motorized bike) that is capable of the 40kph minimum required for being on the highway. I'm not naive enough to think that this legal loophole will last, and when changes are discussed in the legislature I will be proactive in trying to ensure that resulting laws make sense.

Power limits are absurd. No other vehicles are regulated in such a way, so why should electrics be targeted in such a manner. A 200W limit going up a significant hill or even into a stiff headwind is a laughable and even dangerous amount of assist. Such a low limit had to come from the cyclist lobby. Do we want the pedal only guys coming up with our rules?...Of course not! The only limiting regulation that makes any sense is one of speed, and if you want access on pedestrian pathways then a weight limit might make sense too. I'm sorry but anyone who wants the same legal status as pedal bikes has to expect the same kind of speed limit that is possible by a reasonably fit cyclist, so what if ours can do that same speed up a fairly steep hill or into the wind, those speeds make us safer in traffic. It only makes sense that anyone wanting a more capable vehicle should expect licensing, lighting, and registration requirements.

John

 

[Evoforce]

We already have laws in the U.S. against 13 year olds from operating e-bikes yet in most states they can pilot boats and most any tractor or farm implement (both might I add can exceed 20 mph). The problem is not necessarily (that) age group of people operating equipment, it is the education of the people to operate the equipment safely and with respect to others. Just like we need to educate all of the population to bicycles (and motorcycles) on the road and what the laws are as to sharing the road and how easy it is to injure those not surrounded by a steel cage. Not to mention the penalty of manslaughter through accident. Next... I would like to see the road issue related more like using a lake (for example) where you have many types of craft sharing the same space. All of them having to tolerate each other even though they are enjoying the water differently and using many different modes of transport on the water. I could list many different attitudes and feelings that exist on a lake, depending on the view of what they went there to do. Again put yourself in someone elses shoes and try to understand their point of view. You might not ever see it the same way, but maybe you will be inclined to give them a little more tolerance. That being said, everyone must tolerate each other in this area, like it or not, so it is best not to let it get your goat, unless it is really an egregious and blatent disregard for you and your safety. Now if we think of the streets in this way, or other places we go, maybe we can co-exist with all of the different attitudes out there, but each respecting each others decision to have many choices, while following our own lifes path.

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

Just get your bike properly registered as the proper vehicle that it is in the chain of vehicle types.

Unfortunately John, that is just impossible at the moment in Oz.

Do you really want 10-13 year olds able to get a bike like yours and ride freely on the roads?

I reckon 10 to 13 YO's don't really have the resources or patience or money to actually build the type of bike's we are talking about, generally.

I do agree on the other points though.