Bafang BBS02 Buying Experience

[BikeSoupUSA]

Bearing a major disruptive new motor technology, I am all set to lay it down for the infamous Bafang BBS02 48V 750W mid-drive, with the 48V 20aH LiNMC battery, as offered by an Alibaba vendor. Attached is the price sheet they sent me. They better do me good, or else you guys are all gonna know about it.

I'll post my experiences from the buy and use, as my schedule allows. I am gonna install it on an Atomic Zombie tadpole trike, with a shell. http://www.atomiczombie.com/Tutorial%20-%20Building%20a%20VeloMobile%20-%20Page%201.aspx

There's not a lot of long, steep hills on my route. But, I will be rolling power tools and cargo for doing home repairs. I need 25-30 mile range, at approximately 15-20 mph.

Never hurts to learn from other's experiences either. Warnings, advisories, etc are all welcomed.

 

[BikeSoupUSA]

They better do me good, or else you guys are all gonna know about it.

Know what ? Which are your previews experiences with Mid-drive KIT ?
Are you blindly paying for extra watts and 48V battery?
Is you plan staying around the city?

An Mid-Drive at 250W equals with 500W gear-less hub motor, if the KIT is properly designed, and the driver is not a lazy one.

The price difference between 250W BBS01 and 750W BBS02 is minimal. The 48V LiNMC price is not much more than 36V LFP.

Yes, I am only interested in an urban on-pavement, car-replacement commuter, capable of towing a load of up to 400 lbs. The velomobile version of Juiced Rider.

I've only had experience with 48V 1kw hub motor, powered by 4 12V 10ah SLA batteries. The range was unreasonably short, less than 10 miles, with pedaling. I need a 48V 20aH to get better range, 30 miles. So, I figured I'd also get the best mid-drive, reasonably priced, and easily installed.

 

[tomjasz]

...and the driver is not a lazy one.

Oklahoma is USA! We all want more power and prefer to have the option of being lazy. :lol:

 

[tomjasz]

Bearing a major disruptive new motor technology, I am all set to lay it down for the infamous Bafang BBS02 48V 750W mid-drive, with the 48V 20aH LiNMC battery, as offered by an Alibaba vendor. Attached is the price sheet they sent me. They better do me good, or else you guys are all gonna know about it.

I'll post my experiences from the buy and use, as my schedule allows. I am gonna install it on an Atomic Zombie tadpole trike, with a shell. http://www.atomiczombie.com/Tutorial%20-%20Building%20a%20VeloMobile%20-%20Page%201.aspx

There's not a lot of long, steep hills on my route. But, I will be rolling power tools and cargo for doing home repairs. I need 25-30 mile range, at approximately 15-20 mph.

Never hurts to learn from other's experiences either. Warnings, advisories, etc are all welcomed.

What are the shipping costs to OK along with any bank fees? I would think given the lack of problems a vendor like EM3ev would be far less risk and how much more expensive? Not a criticism, just more of a curiosity on how far apart their prices really are once the product is landed..good luck, sounds like a nice ride!

 

[astmacca]

Had a look at the pdf you linked. The ratings of the batteries got me curious.

I have a 48V 11aH Samsung 29E cells from EM3ev. Have run it right down at least once to the BMS LVC to check capacity and it was just as advertised.

When i was discussing what to get and researching, the 48V 11aH 29E was considered good for 22Amps continuous. Good for the 500W kit that pulls 18Amps but maybe not appropriate for the 750 kit at 25 Amps. Yet your supplier is quoting 35 amps continuous??

Do you know what the cells are they are using? There seem to be a few different type of "Samsung" cells available of differing capacity and C rates.

May mean nothing but possible the specs on that sheet are a bit optimistic if you are considering a good number of battery cycles??

 

[tomjasz]

Yes, I am only interested in an urban on-pavement, car-replacement commuter, capable of towing a load of up to 400 lbs. The velomobile version of Juiced Rider.

All that I am going to say is that all (or about all) bicycle frames are designed to handle 270lb = 122kg ( with the rider and fully loaded).
E-bike is no car-replacement or motorcycle-replacement, is just you over a usual bicycle by having a motor pushing you a bit, instead of a friend, as we did when we was playing at the age of 12 years old with a bicycle.

The 48V solution will add unwanted weight, one regular motor of 250W will expand your range over a bicycle.
Anything less hungry in watts: Uses less energy, requires a lightweight battery, recharging time is sorter too.

I am an industrial electrician, I am not selling anything. :wink:

Those Headways are pretty heavy. 100's of us are doing just fine with the BBS01-2 and 36-48V battery packs. I understand you are very happy with your BEWO build, but to say that we shouldn't be or should have elected to follow your lead, is , well, just plain silly. Enjoy your ride. 48V is working very well for those the want or think they need the power. Being an electrical engineer, and from reading a damn talented one, doesn't suddenly grant you the inside line on bicycle engineering. Your other complaint, the nylon/plastic gear used by Bafang hasn't been the problem you anticipate either. That's coming from 3 large resellers who have been extremely honest in their dealing with customers. Please enjoy your ride let others enjoy theirs. We're not all 100kg riders. :lol:

 

[BikeSoupUSA]

Had a look at the pdf you linked. The ratings of the batteries got me curious.

I have a 48V 11aH Samsung 29E cells from EM3ev. Have run it right down at least once to the BMS LVC to check capacity and it was just as advertised.

When i was discussing what to get and researching, the 48V 11aH 29E was considered good for 22Amps continuous. Good for the 500W kit that pulls 18Amps but maybe not appropriate for the 750 kit at 25 Amps. Yet your supplier is quoting 35 amps continuous??

Do you know what the cells are they are using? There seem to be a few different type of "Samsung" cells available of differing capacity and C rates.

May mean nothing but possible the specs on that sheet are a bit optimistic if you are considering a good number of battery cycles??

I can't tell if EM3ev offers LFP or NMC. So, I'm assuming LFP. I am a bit curious to splurge on NMC for the power/range, in exchange for life cycle. With fast moving technology, changing every six months, long life cycle maybe irrelevant?

Being new to the whole EV landscape, it seems to me by the time I get the e-velomobile built, it may be time for a completely overhauled rethinking of the transmission/motor. :? Totally dazed and confused, I am gonna keep a completely open mind.

Also, I'm half-heartedly hedging bets with an undercover motor that MIGHT blow the whole Bafang setup out of the water. "Might" is the watch word, if I can get the genius off his creative rut and actually do a prototype. If he don't come through, I'm going with Bafang.

158 pages and counting! http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50104&hilit=bafang

http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=35
http://endless-sphere.com/w/index.php/Lithium_Nickel_Manganese_Cobalt_(LiNMC)

Anyway, this is the quote I got from Changzhou Leili Vehicle Parts Co.,ltd
Tel:86-0519-85256335
Fax:86-0519-85256335
Mob:86-18932399201

The unit price of your 48V 750W 8fun middle motor kit is USD720.00

PS:And the product list of your ebike kit as below:
1)8fun 750w mid motor ,controller inside-------------------------------------------------------1 set
2)C961 LCD display-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------1 set
3)Thumb throttle --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------1 set
4)Chain wheel and chain cover---------------------------------------------------------------------1 Pair
5)Speed sensor and magent-------------------------------------------------------------------------1 PC
6)Nuts,waterproof cables----------------------------------------------------------------------------1 set
7)User manual with ties also win ding pipe------------------------------------------------------1 set
8)48v 20ah LiNCM battery+charger----------------------------------------------------------------1 set
9)good Package can be delivered to customer directly----------------------------------------1 PC


And the shipping cost for your one set of 48v 750w 8fun middle motor kit to United State is USD283.35(we ship your battery by UPS,and ship your kit by fedex/dhl.)
So the total cost is USD1003.35

 

[scfoster]

You're saving close to $300 over my order from em3ev.com. The difference in price for the BBS02 kit is $120 or 20%. For me, when we're getting down to around $100, I'm now looking more at the supplier vs price. Paul at em3ev.com has a history on this board of taking care of people, so he wins my business. I'm already saving a bundle over buying here in the USA.

Ordered two chargers with the Samsung battery and one had a bad indicator light. Paul refunded the whole purchase price on the charger (which I wasn't expecting). I had asked for a small credit against a future purchase. You can also specify some changes in the programming of your unit (removing the speed limitation) and have a battery properly matched to your needs.

 

[tomjasz]

No paypal, bank, or money transfer fees? I got hit with PP and credit card fees that added nearly $100. I tried using a USA dealer, that was a waste of $$ over Paul and EM3ev. I just can't wrap my head around a vendor that may or may not support me if I have a problem. I read far to many bad stories but realize for every horror story there are likely many many more successes. Once I learn to build battery packs I'll be more willing to risk on buying motors at a discount and take the risk. But then if I have the cash and can afford to I'd always try to be loyal to the guy that treated me the best, Paul at EM3ev. My LBS doesn't have a single E Bike but is more than fair at pricing work. during winter months.

 

[BikeSoupUSA]

No paypal, bank, or money transfer fees? I got hit with PP and credit card fees that added nearly $100. I tried using a USA dealer, that was a waste of $$ over Paul and EM3ev. I just can't wrap my head around a vendor that may or may not support me if I have a problem. I read far to many bad stories but realize for every horror story there are likely many many more successes. Once I learn to build battery packs I'll be more willing to risk on buying motors at a discount and take the risk. But then if I have the cash and can afford to I'd always try to be loyal to the guy that treated me the best, Paul at EM3ev. My LBS doesn't have a single E Bike but is more than fair at pricing work. during winter months.

They want Western Union. If bank transfer, add $35.

 

[tomjasz]

great deal, best wishesfor a successful closing on a great motor and battery. I love mine!

 

[USAEBIKECO]

How much better is bafang compared to wilderness energy motors?

 

[tomjasz]

How much better is bafang compared to wilderness energy motors?

You're asking about Bafang hub motors? This thread is on Bafang mid drives.

 

[astmacca]

I can't tell if EM3ev offers LFP or NMC.

http://www.dampfakkus.de/akkutest.php?id=353

Has info on the Samsung 29E Cells.

NCO??

And this article seems to say the 29E is NCA??

And i found a samsung PDF here:

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCUQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownload.21dianyuan.com%2Fdownload.php%3Fid%3D238880&ei=Q4idVLfFOIm9Ufyfg6AL&usg=AFQjCNHzsjbNDYf6PY4RMCjVX6Mv0ALtgA&sig2=qJLPAb9xb0ipP23ARfOsyA&bvm=bv.82001339,d.d24

Confusing.

That said, the pack i have works a treat whatever the exact specs.

 

[PRayB]

I bought a bafang bbs02 500 watt drive from Legrande Crews at Lectriccycles.com. The experience was excellent. I did pay more, I know,but I test drove several bikes at his shop and he was a pleasure to deal with. At about 600 miles, the battery went bad and he replaced it without question after a brief capacity test. I'm now at 1600 miles and very pleased with it. It is not exciting but is reliable for a daily 20 mile work commute.

 

[jmw]

I bought a Bafang kit from EM3ev a couple of weeks ago. 48v 750w BBS02 and 12.? Ah triangular battery in Cordura pack for mounting in the frame triangle. Installed in a city bike (Land Cruiser) that is unusually tall with 26" wheels and pretty skinny slick tires. Rear hub is Shimano 7-speed. Self-made chain idler. It has been a very positive experience. The kit was delivered about 10 days after I sent the funds (via PayPal). Paul has been helpful about the very poor manual, responding promptly to emails. The bike is working very well. It's quiet and seems very efficient. It can go faster than I want to go. I recommend EM3ev.com

 

[nioko]

I bought my BBS02 from elifebike. As posted in the huge BBS thread, I'm not happy with elifebike, and I would not recommend buying from him. He does not do the most basic testing before sending the units, and did not replace a free replacement of the faulty Nylon gear, that my unit had.
So I've had to buy a replacement gear for a new unit - not how I expected this to work out.

Also it took him two weeks to ship the unit.