BatGroupCraft.com pressure contact battery box

[spinningmagnets]

The contacts use coil-springs that are separate from the contact strip. The bus is reported to be nickel-plated copper. They are trying to generate crowdfunding to start a company. The box appears to be 3D-printed. Maybe silicone bus insulation...

The thumbnail pic below shows a 6S / 8P pack. At the top/right of the box, you can see the "beehive" coil-springs. I like this system, it shows promise.



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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUD8Fivtn08

[youtube]TUD8Fivtn08[/youtube]

 

[SniperGaulois]

Hi, i was sleep deprived and tried to read the audio in a David Attenborough voice, here's an okay version, can you please change the URL to: https://youtu.be/TUD8Fivtn08 It's called BatGroup because i won a "batquiz" for children when I was 12 at the town hall with the young ornithologist's club and oxfordshire "bat" technically "group", so it's a happy nice memory for me, they gave me a mug, a very nice mug! i used to build bat boxes and bird boxes. I want a name like ThermalSpecialties. they have a kool name :/
A free box for you if you suggest a company name with diamond qualities, a fun name, and if many folk are told about the launch pages.

 

[spinningmagnets]

Link changed. The audio is better, and the script is better.

 

[MorbidlyObeseKoala]

Seems simple enough. Looks a little thin for their larger applications that they showed in the video (moped, motorcycle).

For something that doesn't get much movement in use, this looks great but introduce some road vibrations and I would be pretty concerned about rubbing and shorts. I suppose it is simple enough to pop it open and inspect but if it happens while you are cruising, not much you can do about it.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Looks deadly on a bike. Reminds me of the thread here using magnets which I’d trust a lot more

Trying to start a crowd funded business based on only a 3d design, and not a complicated one..they should post it on thingiverse and tell what bolts, copper, and springs needed and move on.. and hope no one uses it on anything moving.

 

[SniperGaulois]

Cheers Hummina for the point of view. Your claim is speculation stated as fact. Tell me How long would it take to fry an Anderson plug, if the plug was tied firmly to the bike frame and absorbing all the vibrations? Never? 1000 miles? any idea whatsoever?

If you don't know that, then the same is true of the battery contacts. no idea of any real world values

Can you say vaguely what is the speed of movement of a spring? What is the speed of movement of the vibrations expected of the box?

Are you imagining the contactors as single point connections or actual disks which lift up and down and that can pivot and tilt on the XY axes?

Please tell me how you think there can be air voids in the disks, so that the battery instantly explodes or something.

LiveForPhysics has stated that springs are good for this kind of technology, are you saying he is talking nonsense too?

It seems a bit unreasonable to me.

Looks deadly on a bike.

 

[spinningmagnets]

Every design is worthy of experimentation. Isn't that was ES is all about?

If there are issues, each issue can find its solution. Let the experiments begin!

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Cheers Hummina for the point of view. Your claim is speculation stated as fact. Tell me How long would it take to fry an Anderson plug, if the plug was tied firmly to the bike frame and absorbing all the vibrations? Never? 1000 miles? any idea whatsoever?

If you don't know that, then the same is true of the battery contacts. no idea of any real world values

Can you say vaguely what is the speed of movement of a spring? What is the speed of movement of the vibrations expected of the box?

Are you imagining the contactors as single point connections or actual disks which lift up and down and that can pivot and tilt on the XY axes?

Please tell me how you think there can be air voids in the disks, so that the battery instantly explodes or something.

LiveForPhysics has stated that springs are good for this kind of technology, are you saying he is talking nonsense too?

It seems a bit unreasonable to me.

Looks deadly on a bike.

I wasn’t talking about Anderson plugs.

I didn’t present anything as fact.

Saying springs are good for this kinda thing is a broad simplification.

I dont know what ur talking about air in the disks.

As u say it would depend on the real world values of force put on the pack. On a bike those values, which you don’t state either, can be high. And then give it enough time and I don’t trust the spacers between p groups in particular.


You bring up pivoting of the springs on the x and y axis. I imagine if cells are moving enough in there to need a pivoting contact theres going to be problems.



I see it’s ur project and I figured that’s why such a reaction.
Why would you need to crowdfund for this?





“Least durable part the springs”.. I’d think the 3d printed plastic and the spacers between cells in particular and if those break it will soon be in a giant flame. I bet there’s others who would also tell you the spacers between cells seem the weakest link. It’s not as if u can’t change the design in moments and it’s constructive criticism for your benefit. maybe I’m wrong. Just my opinion. I wouldn’t ride with the battery on its side for sure

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Telling it as I see it, and I could be wrong, with this design and others the springs are behind the copper contact strip and that copper strip being designed to flex, at some point fatigue will break the strip. It’s the steel that is the most durable part not least. I don’t know how thick it is and nothing I read or saw states how many amps this case can do but in the video they look pretty flexible and I’m guessing 1-2mm thick. ..would it be possible to have the springs as contacts so the repeatedly flexing parts are only steel and could do that without risk of fatigue? Maybe a copper coated spring?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper-clad_steel
I haven’t looked into this copper-steel at all and thought maybe someone here had experience.


https://mwswire.com/copper-clad-steel-wire/

I call mws and they say will “definitely work” as a spring. They always tell me everything will work though.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

https://www.meadmetals.com/blog/beryllium-copper-vs-regular-copper
Why chose beryllium copper?
Not near the conductivity of regular copper. Claims in the video are wrong or seem intentionally misleading.

 

[spinningmagnets]

Be patient Hummida Shadeeba. Let's test it, shall we?

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

Be patient Hummida Shadeeba. Let's test it, shall we?

Worth knowing it could do maybe 4x less amps than claimed before they even test it.


Looking at the how thin and flexible these alloy series connections are on this and to me it’s a bomb.

The self promotion with such huge inaccuracy and misleading statements..and wants to crowd fund? (Or is that typical). I don’t even understand why crowd fund and the explanation presented is a word salad of elitist jargon. This thing needs a 3d printer, some standard hardware, and NOT beryllium copper and instead some regular copper pressed to shape if that’s even needed using a 3d printed press.

And what exactly is the contact material and how is it held to the copper alloy?! Seems another bottleneck. Why?

This pack may be great for a lot of uses but high power Ebike isn’t one as I see it.

 

[SniperGaulois]

Sorry i didn't say Shukran Jazilan (thanks in Arabic) at the end of the video, I said it in all my other recordings intended for the video because I rehearsed to say it, it's difficult to remember that many words. My dad is an arabic language teacher in oxford Arabic and ecology. he even translated an arabic book that won the nobel prize. Why do you think i'll do bad work?

Don't worry about the longevity of performance alloys and physics, I'm not going to use any brittle metals in flexing zones. Performance equipment can have a choice of materials which maximizes longevity and performance, and i expect to use the best material for every purpose. The product will go through expert EE consultants prior to production because it has to go through a collaborative solidworks CAD study involving 3-4 EE experts to refine the design in microns, it will be fine.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

You asked a question but answered none. To answer your question: your dad isn’t doing this you are.

 

[99t4]

Why chose beryllium copper?

We don't know, but hope they are taking appropriate precautions when machining the material, as the dust can have pretty toxic effects.

 

[SniperGaulois]

You asked a question but answered none. To answer your question: your dad isn’t doing this you are.

You said: copper beryllium alloys don't conduct electricity well. That's like saying paper isn't flat. They are 98% as conductive as copper because they contain 97-98% copper. and 4.3 times more conductive than nickel. What are talking about man! https://www.azom.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=6300

 

[SniperGaulois]

Why chose beryllium copper?

We don't know, but hope they are taking appropriate precautions when machining the material, as the dust can have pretty toxic effects.

Yes 994t, good point indeed. Weldless tech represents a very broad study of materials, there's 8 central components all of a different alloys/polymers, from a selection of 100ds of metal alloys and plastics. I think that copper beryllium is used in nearly all wall plugs and performance flexible contactsm through a metal pressing machine.... I haven't studied the alloys that well! Ideally we'd have 100m*8mm rolls of whichever copper alloy is best, bonding light nickel plated studs to them (perhaps a weldable aluminium alloy that is nickel plated, but that Alu doesnt weld, it's just light and very conductive, pure nickel is probably 1st choice) so it's all going to be reviewed by an EE contacts expert. If it's a CuBe alloy, it would the ribbon roll would be precision cut over a ventilation collector.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

You asked a question but answered none. To answer your question: your dad isn’t doing this you are.

You said: copper beryllium alloys don't conduct electricity well. That's like saying paper isn't flat. They are 98% as conductive as copper because they contain 97-98% copper. and 4.3 times more conductive than nickel. What are talking about man! https://www.azom.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=6300

Paper doesn’t stay flat after crumpling. An alloy won’t have a conductivity based on the percentage of its ingredients
https://www.thoughtco.com/physical-properties-of-beryllium-copper-2340165


How can you both be claiming your box is sure safe yet you haven’t finished designing it and waiting to pay 4 people to do it! How bout forget the crowd fund and just get it designed first?

 

[SniperGaulois]

I did thermal power tests. I emptied 54 Panasonic 18650s through the box at 1300W, more than 20W per cell for 15 minutes, it was way beyond the maximum limitation of the panasonic, which got too warm.

Hey!!! AWesome information there Huminna! I made a wrong presumption. indeed it's only 20% copper conductivity.

For the panasonic tests, i was using pure copper. It's a very broad study of alloys, I've got a professional on the field on the other line telling me it's pretty good and worth and big RnD lab's time and he wants to thrash it about a bit.

 

[Hummina Shadeeba]

I know a lot of people, myself included, would want a box that could do a lot more power and think a compression box using springs could do it no problem with the right ingredients.
I think u can figure it out without anyone else.
And the beryllium copper need not be as poor a conductor as I originally said/thought and could get the 38% IACS version which was treated for conductivity. I’m thinking the beryllium copper may be ideal in working as a spring without fatigue vs regular copper.