Capturing and Storing the Energy of Lightning

[paultrafalgar]

Just been reading "Demographics" and I noticed frodus's entry. I've been thinking about whether it would be possible to capture/store/harness the power of lightning. Frodus appears to be in this line of business, so I hope he will see this and maybe respond (I'll pm him with this link).
Would it be feasible to capture the power of lightning in a giant bank of ultracapacitors and then feed the power produced into the grid? Straight away you have the problem of where to site your capture machine so that it gets hit by the lightning. Assuming there are locations that are so prone to lightning strikes that the project would be worthwhile, how would you proceed to do that? I would have thought that the energies involved would make the project worthwhile since we must be talking about millions if not billions of watts.

 

[Malcolm]

Never mind feeding it back into the grid – how about capturing it while on an ebike? All you need is a long copper rod and a couple of home-made Leyden jars in side panniers. Which of us lives in the most lightning-dense corner of the world?

 

[paultrafalgar]

You've been "Back to the Future", Malcolm!
No billion volt lightning conductors on my bike, thanks.

 

[amberwolf]

Well, I'm not sure even ultracaps could deal with lightning. That's some massive instantaneous power there.

FWIW, I recall someone from Tucson AZ that's on the DIY Electric Car forums that has something to do with high power grid systems....

 

[spinningmagnets]

You will never...I repeat...NEVER get permission to hook up an enormous ultracap device to the grid. Nor will you receive funding to perform the R & D to show lightning capture is possible.

Everything you need to know is in the book "Draw the lightning down" about the early history of electrical research. I have pondered the possibility of making a pond that is a very large Leyden jar (capacitor), then bleeding off the charge to fill a conventional battery pack. But bear in mind, during Benjamin Franklins heyday (mid 1700's) it became a novelty to kill a chicken with a leyden jar shock, and then to revive it with a smaller LJ. One the size of a basketball would certainly kill a human adult.

http://www.amazon.com/Draw-Lightning-Down-Electrical-Enlightenment/dp/0520238028

It became known that even if there was not quite enough energy to form a lightning bolt, there was often still a great deal of energy "buzzing" around in the air. Franklins experiments concerning the development of lightning rods are particularly interesting. Later, Franklin realized how close he had come to being killed during his "kite in a lightning storm" experiment. In fact, another prominent scientist died re-creating it.

He did not hope lightning would strike the kite, he wanted to prove you could charge an LJ from the energy buzzing around in the air (at the edge of a storm), which he hoped to prove that IF you could give that ethereal energy an easy path (pointed lightning rod attached to ground) there would not be enough energy left over to form lightning.

Ships and buildings have been destroyed by lightning, so this was of serious concern across the world. A military gunpowder storage facility was exploded by a lightning strike, and it destroyed the entire port city.

Public outcry over scientists "playing God" by bringing the dead back to life quickly halted public demonstrations of killing and re-animating chickens and dogs. It was in this social mood that Mary Shelly wrote "Frankenstein", but the creature (as she put it) was not a large monster, but a normal sized man re-animated by science gone awry. Although, we have to wonder about the missed possibility of re-starting heart-attack victims much sooner in history than when it finally became common.

 

[317537]

Two poles and a single discharge, how ever avoid the discharge and milk the charge before hand.

Sky to gorund, many massive diodes, resistors, yes hundreds of stove elements, that new stuff eestor's working on and the grid as you need a place for energy to sink into.

You might be onto something, lightning? that stuff scrares me.. Shocking!,

 

[frodus]

the light harvesting that I do at Leviton has more to do with saving the energy to begin with.... rather than using the excess to generate power to feed to the grid.

It all boils down to intelligent lighting control.

Several products we do measure the light level with a photocell, if its above a certain level, it'l dim fluorescent ballasts so they're using less energy. If there is an occupancy sensor inside the room, and it doesn't detect someone for a given time, it'l power down the lights. There is also timeclock control, so the relay systems/dimming systems go off at certain times of day and come on at other times.

its more efficient to save the energy to begin with than it is to use excess (which has its own losses) to generate power (which has losses) to store in caps/batteries (which has losses) and then to get the energy out/convert it again and feed into the grid.

 

[paultrafalgar]

Whoops! , frodus, sorry, I miss-read your Demographics entry: instead of lighting I read lightning! Sorry,

 

[frodus]

oh, haha.... totally understand

 

[dnmun]

there is a picture somewhere that i have seen, of nichola tesla standing in front of the huge lightning collector apparatus he built on top of pikes peak.

a friend of mine has a portrait print of tesla mounted on the wall in his bathroom, don't ask me why.

 

[Lock]

Lightning is totally unreliable.
I have been 20 miles offshore (fresh water) under a 40ft aluminum mast and stainless rigging w/lightning strikes all around and a crazed Skipper fastening car jumper cables to the shrouds to drag in the water (under our "safety cone") desparate to avoid another strike as he has experienced once before, with nary a hit... More recently, had two deaths in my `hood where the strikes came through "blue skies" from the actual "storm" some 20km/miles away...

Maybe if ya had a tethered balloon (see Franklins kite et al) and could bleed the potential off/store it "gently"... Otherwise, lightning is just a "loose cannon"
tks
Lock

 

[John in CR]

... Otherwise, lightning is just a "loose cannon"...

A big ass loose cannon at that, and I want nothing to do with it except maybe watch some of its more beautiful forms from a distance.

John

 

[317537]

More recently, had two deaths in my `hood where the strikes came through "blue skies" from the actual "storm" some 20km/miles away...

A friend of mine has a portrait print of tesla mounted on the wall in his bathroom, don't ask me why.

What did I tells ya, dat lightning is scary shit.

I’m never going out in it now.

I was coming home and just got in the gate, in my push pedals days. And I felt it. Yep like about 5 seconds before it hit the bloody roof of my home. My hairs stood on my arms and head and I felt awfully strange as I ran for my dear life. CRACK, the ground shook, I tell you honestly, all most made me fall over.

 

[northernmike]

Hasn't anyone heard the rumor that the "northeast blackout" of a few years ago (2003) was caused by Military ops experimenting with super-high-power low-density atmospheric transmission techniques?

 

[317537]

Hasn't anyone heard the rumor that the "northeast blackout" of a few years ago (2003) was caused by Military ops experimenting with super-high-power low-density atmospheric transmission techniques?

Wasn’t H.A.R.P High Altitude Research Project involved in some stuff like that?

My wife is a walking experiment with atmospheric high discharges. She wears more rings than the word ring is stated in lord of the rings, chains and all things. She scared of the stuff too. I make her take her jewellery off when my hairs stand on my head. I can feel when danger is about.