Folding Bikes: Full suspension + under 24"

[The Stig]

This can be a thread for listing FS folders that are electric or good for electrification.

Personally I'm looking for one that is lightweight, so that its easy to put on intercity buses, trains, or in the back of a car. A good amount of suspension travel would be nice.


The only cheapy I found with decent suspension travel is this one. Downtube 8FS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Full-Suspension-Folding-Bike-Downtube-8FS-8-speed-Aluminum-Frame-Bike-in-Blue-/231759651193?hash=item35f5f3a179:g:rnEAAOSwAYtWNi0f

 

[The Stig]

Airnimal "Rhino"

Another FS folder is this one. This ones actually a real, properly made bike! They use a 26" fork i think.

http://airnimal.eu/products/rhino/white/#.VmEiqL9lzm4

(X-post from the airnimal thread https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=36725#p1126413)

 

[The Stig]

There is of course the Junma, which was posted about in this thread, by me and others: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=43888&p=1040317#p1040317

It comes from a creepy, bad quality website of the chinese origin. http://www.ecbuyshop.com/electric-folding-bicycle-n-002z/
They do have a paypal but for years I've been spooked from buying from them.

 

[cwah]

Dahon jetstream

 

[The Stig]

Dahon jetstream

Don't like how little suspension travel it has + its expensive. The airnimal seems like a good deal if im going to drop a lot of cash.

 

[Chalo]

Moulton bikes are the original small wheel, full suspension bikes, and they're unsurpassed for light weight and high performance in that category. They don't fold per se, but they do take apart. They also cost like the exotic high quality equipment they are.

 

[cwah]

Dahon jetstream

Don't like how little suspension travel it has + its expensive. The airnimal seems like a good deal if im going to drop a lot of cash.

you can just replace suspensions:

and what's good is that it's easy to have access to second hand bike at knocked off price

 

[The Stig]

thx chalo, yeah that is exotic and nice

Dahon jetstream

Don't like how little suspension travel it has + its expensive. The airnimal seems like a good deal if im going to drop a lot of cash.

you can just replace suspensions:

and what's good is that it's easy to have access to second hand bike at knocked off price

True, I like the idea of just putting a better fork on a bike. What fork is that / where did you get it?

 

[cwah]

I just bought a cheap fork because I had an old model without disc brake:
http://www.tesco.com/direct/sr-suntour-xct-jr-20inch-suspension-fork-255mm-ahead-black/131-8410.prd?action=acknowledgement

I'm planning to potentially update it to a 100mm fork

 

[marty]

Moulton bikes are the original small wheel, full suspension bikes, and they're unsurpassed for light weight and high performance in that category. They don't fold per se, but they do take apart. They also cost like the exotic high quality equipment they are.

Look at this.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5313

 

[Ykick]

I worked with and rode a converted Jetstream for a while. Good bike, sturdy enough. Nice place with tapped threads to mount a 6FET size controller below the bottom bracket. Also more threaded lugs on the front of the steering tube.

It just never made me go “wow” like my Swift folder econversion still does.

Yeah, I know Swift’s not “suspension” that OP’s looking for but it’s a very “sturdy” frame and CST Cyclop tires running mild pressure on fat rims will significantly soothe ride quality.

And the practical application about all of this? It’s not that hard to merely slow down a few MPH and save yourself all of the headaches full suspension brings with it…. Especially folding bikes with 20”/16” wheels.

 

[Chalo]

Fledgling e-cyclists are just so hot to open the Pandora's Box of gizmos, and give away the actual virtues and joys of a good bike. Suspension despoils a bike. Folding despoils a bike. And, to be fair, electric power despoils a bike too. But just because you choose to accept the compromises of one of these things, does not mean you have to pile all of them on, along with hydraulic this and motorcycle that. When you do that, you don't just wind up with something ugly, heavy, and tasteless; you actually impair the bicycle's ability to do what it's supposed to do, which is to turn a small amount of energy into a large distance traversed.

Why ruin a bicycle? Just start with something that's already nasty, like a monkey bike or a moped. Some of those gross little monsters will drop right into the trunk of your car without even having to fold. Plus, they are improved by electrifying them.

 

[The Stig]

Ykick, thats a good idea, a folding fatbike. I google searched the forum for "ykick swift" and then found this ready made 20" fodling fatbike, only problem is ready made ebikes usually come with junk cells. Coincidentally I bought some good naked batteries/cells from ebikes.ca while they were on sale so I got that covered. 36v batts that are 184x74x19mm.

I like the look of this thing!
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=74507

Never used alibaba but there is also a listing there. here it is $1430 shipped http://www.bikecraze.com/SSR-Motorsports-Trail-Viper-Folding-Elec-p/trail.viper.htm?CartID=1


Chalo, I have not come across a moped that is lighter, hence easier to lift and put in the back of a car or in the bowels of an intercity bus.

I'm planning to potentially update it to a 100mm fork

Let me know where you find that 100mm fork cwah. Thats good travel. 40mm is a bit on the low end for travel.

 

[andrebandre]

I worked with and rode a converted Jetstream for a while. Good bike, sturdy enough. Nice place with tapped threads to mount a 6FET size controller below the bottom bracket. Also more threaded lugs on the front of the steering tube.

It just never made me go “wow” like my Swift folder econversion still does.

Yeah, I know Swift’s not “suspension” that OP’s looking for but it’s a very “sturdy” frame and CST Cyclop tires running mild pressure on fat rims will significantly soothe ride quality.

And the practical application about all of this? It’s not that hard to merely slow down a few MPH and save yourself all of the headaches full suspension brings with it…. Especially folding bikes with 20”/16” wheels.

To each his own.

I would argue that good shocks carefully tuned even on a one pivot rear triangle can make a difference in the quality of the ride without the need to sacrifice speed.

Fat tires can help but there is a penalty in energy expanded and possibly weight.

I suppose there is always a compromise to be made and depending on what one's ultimate goal is, go for one or the other.

 

[andrebandre]

@ Stig:

My take on most of the above options based on personal riding experience with the Moulton, Airnimal Black Rhino and Jetstream EX. None of them budget bikes.

Moulton is a fast racing bike, handles admirably just like a full size 700cc. It is not exactly a full suspension bike as in travel, but it does absorb some road imperfections at high speed better than rigid frames and feels smoother than a carbon

frame full size race bike.

Doesn't really fold but rather is taken apart for transport. But it is the lightest of the bunch by far. And easily the fastest.

Airnimal is probably the best all around full suspension 20" wheel as far as handling in various terrain but as the Moulton it is not a folder per se.

The stock front fork has 80mm travel (can be replaced with 100mm travel forks with the same axle to crown distance) which is plenty enough for cross country. I believe the rear shock is 150mm eye to eye/31mm travel but it can be increased to

165mm/35mm travel without upsetting too much the all around geometry.

Dahon is a true folder with the same realtively short suspension travel. I believe it has similar front and rear travel as the Airnimal. The only addage i would

make is that for road or mild XC use, the German A-Kilo fork design beats anything else in weight and handling.

The single pivot rear and short chainstays won't give you much chance for travel enhancement or smoothness for either bike.

If you are looking for a mtb class suspension capability in a 20" wheel that can fold, it isn't there. Yet. And i supose it won't be cheap if ever comes available.

 

[Hillhater]

.Just to add to the data bank.....
I realise you limited your choices to <24" wheel frames, but I assume you noticed the 26" FS electric folder on that Chinese Junma site http://www.ecbuyshop.com/electric-mountain-bike/
And on the smaller wheel front there is the Airnimal JOEY , a 24" quality folder, ..highly regarded, but sadly lacking any suspension !

 

[Jonathan in Hiram]

This thread has many, many exotic small wheel bikes with some of them folders.

http://www.bikeforums.net/folding-bikes/897915-bikes-we-like.html

For instance from page 2 there is this..

 

[The Stig]

@ Stig:

My take on most of the above options based on personal riding experience with the Moulton, Airnimal Black Rhino and Jetstream EX. None of them budget bikes....

Airnimal is probably the best all around full suspension 20" wheel as far as handling in various terrain...

The stock front fork has 80mm travel (can be replaced with 100mm travel forks with the same axle to crown distance) which is plenty enough for cross country. I believe the rear shock is 150mm eye to eye/31mm travel but it can be increased to

165mm/35mm travel without upsetting too much the all around geometry.

Dahon ... for road or mild XC use, the German A-Kilo fork design beats anything else in weight and handling.

If you are looking for a mtb class suspension capability in a 20" wheel that can fold, it isn't there. Yet. And i supose it won't be cheap if ever comes available.

Thanks for sharing your experiences+ !

The airnimal rhino is def the best choice. I'm just have trouble trying to justify the choice. the 100mm travel fork sounds nice, its a great deal if it doesn't change the height. + 165mm shock - a must.
I just don't know how serious I could be about a e-mtb thats Folding... Its hard to justify the cost. A fresh idea is to think of the joy of being able to take my favorite ebike anywhere, travelling etc.

So the A-kilo fork design is what we see on the newer jetstreams?

Your probably right that an FS 20" folder cant be that good. The airnimal rhino would be the best. was it not that good?

 

[The Stig]

.Just to add to the data bank.....
I realise you limited your choices to <24" wheel frames, but I assume you noticed the 26" FS electric folder on that Chinese Junma site http://www.ecbuyshop.com/electric-mountain-bike/
And on the smaller wheel front there is the Airnimal JOEY , a 24" quality folder, ..highly regarded, but sadly lacking any suspension !

You bring up an interesting point about FS 26" folders, or why I'm ok with owning just 1 of them. Its that they are more difficult to handle when folded, not only because they are heavier, but also because they are larger. All this puts a multiplier on how difficult it is to put in a car or a bus. When I'm trying to load it sideways it becomes like a longer cantilever(than a 20" bike) and I can only grab it further away from the center of gravity.

my 26" FS folder. heres a pretty bad photo of it. its also an outdated photo. It now has a larger battery + a second battery(frog battery case) on the seatpost.

 

[The Stig]

This thread has many, many exotic small wheel bikes with some of them folders.

http://www.bikeforums.net/folding-bikes/897915-bikes-we-like.html

For instance from page 2 there is this..http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/hasirin/imgs/b/6/b67e5fca.jpg

I looked through several pages of that thread, there are a few folders scattered in there, and fs bikes

Thats crazy bike. very fancy! is that a rear suspension spring?

 

[Chalo]

For instance from page 2 there is this..http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/hasirin/imgs/b/6/b67e5fca.jpg

Thats crazy bike. very fancy! is that a rear suspension spring?

It looks like an elastomer stack to me. So yes, it's a spring, but a rubber one.

 

[USAEBIKECO]

Here is a 48 volt folder we build.

 

[andrebandre]

Thanks for sharing your experiences+ !

The airnimal rhino is def the best choice. I'm just have trouble trying to justify the choice. the 100mm travel fork sounds nice, its a great deal if it doesn't change the height. + 165mm shock - a must.
I just don't know how serious I could be about a e-mtb thats Folding... Its hard to justify the cost. A fresh idea is to think of the joy of being able to take my favorite ebike anywhere, travelling etc.

So the A-kilo fork design is what we see on the newer jetstreams?

Your probably right that an FS 20" folder cant be that good. The airnimal rhino would be the best. was it not that good?

It is my opinion that the Rhino is best suited for rough terrain handling due to the way its frame joints are designed around a pivot to withstand well vertical forces but it doesn't really fold except for rear triangle, but breaks apart to a small size

with some tools and time.

If my memory serves me right i remember finding a classic suspension fork that had the same axle to crown distance in 100mm travel vs the stock 80mm Manitou.

I doubt it makes that much of a difference though. I think all the Airnimal bikes were designed very thoroughly for specific tasks and the best compromise was chosen between handling and performance.

I do believe the German A in the pic above is a 90mm travel and with the proper coil rating will work a treat for most terrain better then anything else. It is that paralleogram linkage that deflects the force of the impact and allows the fork to

change angle as it trasvels upwords unlike a standard up/down suspension fork that relies on the head angle only to receieve the impact, meaning it can only take bumps at a fixed angle wich usually limits its usefulness to a certain intended

purpose. More or less, if you are a picky rider.

Damn i'm using the word angle a lot.

For a 20" wheel bike, the suspension is even more imortant since the bike wont roll as willingly over bumps as larger diameter wheels would.

The Jetsream EX model has been discontinued in 2011 (i believe) and later models, P8 and the latest D8, use some similar trapezoidal linkage fork but i'm not sure how well it works.

If you are on a tight budget i guess the bike in the first pic you posted might be good enough. The main problem with most traditional side folders is the hinge. Especially budget bikes. It is the Achilles tendon and wont last if you go off road, and

will creak all the time from torsional stress as you pedal. Maybe not as much with an e-bike though.

It is my exerience that it is better to rather try and get a good frame only and than get as good as your pocket will allow components.

Usually complete bikes are a compromise in quality, even the top of the line models and most of the time unreasonably expensive.

 

[The Stig]

The airnimal rhino is def the best choice. ....

So the A-kilo fork design is what we see on the newer jetstreams?

Your probably right that an FS 20" folder cant be that good. The airnimal rhino would be the best. was it not that good?

It is my opinion that the Rhino is best .... it doesn't really fold except for rear triangle, but breaks apart to a small size
...
For a 20" wheel bike, the suspension is even more imortant since the bike wont roll as willingly over bumps as larger diameter wheels would.
...
If you are on a tight budget i guess the bike in the first pic you posted might be good enough. The main problem with most traditional side folders is the hinge. Especially budget bikes. It is the Achilles tendon and wont last if you go off road, and

will creak all the time from torsional stress as you pedal. Maybe not as much with an e-bike though.

It is my exerience that it is better to rather try and get a good frame only and than get as good as your pocket will allow components.

Usually complete bikes are a compromise in quality, even the top of the line models and most of the time unreasonably expensive.

Thats a good point about the airnimal not folding, i didnt notice because I was so dazzled by how higher quality it is than all the other options here. Non-folding rules it out for me.

The downtube 8fs has this type of folding hinge and non-brand suspension fork... Makes me suspicious of its reliability and toughness.

I'm glad I'm starting to realize there probably just isnt anything out there for me. as you and Chalo say. The reason I thought there would be something is that my FS 26" folder is pretty good and has a nice hinge design. Apparently the taking an FS folder from 26" down to 20" is too niche.

I'll make twist and go for the folding 20" fatty. TBH half the reason i want FS it is for winter riding. I'll try and get a front fork on it too. haters be damned. The bike looks cool and its got some squish.

 

[andrebandre]

Damn trying to edit quotes. Sorry for taking the space but i can't seem to be able to delete my posts altogether.