GoldenMotor Magic Pie.

[GoldenMotor]

*NOTE: the designs on the hub cover IS NOT A DAMN PAINTJOB! it is exterior embossed to radiate heat! as i have said we are a RnD company, we don't do silly paintjobs or graphic stickers for no reason. please do not underestimate our intelligence! thx


See MagicPie Kit in ACTION!!

It just has so many good features:

1. Built-in function-rich reliable cruise controller
2. Super thin body (60mm only) for most existing bike frames
3. Large diameter means higher climbing torque and smooth riding
4. Single motor can take multiple battery voltages: 24V, 36V, 48V to get desired power and speed, only need to add more batteries.
5. Plug-and-Run, use easy and professional connectors
6. Adaptable to disc-brake and 6-speed sproket (gear wheel)

It is designed for any existing bike frames, one for all.

 

[TPA]

I just cannot imagine that a controller integrated into the motor is a good idea.

Ebike components do wear out, break, malfunction, and mistakes happen. So if the windings go it all goes, and if the controller goes it all goes....too many eggs in one basket.

If I wanted to experiment with different controllers, it may not be possible.

If I wanted to use a different motor with the controller supplied with this motor...not possible.

This is a very dedicated setup. Little room to change things around.

.....Oh, and it was suggested that you rethink the "Magic Pie" name. You REALLY should have!

 

[Russell]

I just cannot imagine that a controller integrated into the motor is a good idea.

BionX integrates their controller into the motor. It's not a bad idea it's just one that caters to a market other than the experimenter. I'm sure someone here will eventually bypass the internals and run it on another brand controller.

.....Oh, and it was suggested that you rethink the "Magic Pie" name. You REALLY should have!

I don't care what they call it, we could refer to it simply as the "Magic" motor, but that silly paint job has got to go

-R

 

[Russell]

It just has so many good features:

1. Built-in function-rich reliable cruise controller
2. Super thin body (60mm only) for most existing bike frames
3. Large diameter means higher climbing torque and smooth riding
4. Single motor can take multiple battery voltages: 24V, 36V, 48V to get desired power and speed, only need to add more batteries.
5. Plug-and-Run, use easy and professional connectors
6. Adaptable to disc-brake and 6-speed sproket (gear wheel)

It is designed for any existing bike frames, one for all.

Is there some kind of command console like with the BionX system?

How is cruise activated, manually or automatically after holding the throttle steady for a period of time?

Does the motor contain hall sensors?

How many wires exit the motor?

What is the speed in a 26" rim at 24V, 36V, 48V?

How powerful is the motor and internal controller?

How much does it cost?


-R

 

[philf]

No pricing or apparent way to order one of these things on their site... Not that I'd want one, but I'm sure we're all curious to see how the price is set...

 

[Drunkskunk]

Large Diameter looks nice. Intagrated controller and 48V limit suck. I'd like to see a stand alone motor with that diameter run at 84 volts, wound for a max speed of about 30. That would make for some interesting hill climbs.

 

[dogman dan]

Not what we want, obviously, but for a lot of folks it could be perfect. The controller ought to stay pretty dry inside the motor housing.

But for me, I'd never mount the controller in a hot place. Where I live , inside the motor is allways hot. Where it's allways wet, the motor would stay pretty cool.

 

[Vim]

The motor looks intriguing, and obviously there was a lot of hard work that went into it. I look forward to seeing someone here do a full review of one.

The name could be worse.. Flying Cake? Spinning Pussy? Playful Puppy?
I always thought the names for the Chinese ICE bike motors were to 'cute' sounding too (China Girl, Happy Time). I guess the whole machismo name thing (Racer, Brute, Black Lightning, Puma...) doesn't translate well in Chinese culture.

 

[Russell]

From their catalog;


View attachment 1



From their forum;






-R

 

[grindz145]

Why not add to the rotating mass and make it less serviceable... The hub motor is convenience but I agree integrating the controller is a waste.

p.s. Magic Pie?! WTF?

Hey GoldenMotor, I'm pretty sure you could crowd-source your next motor name from these forums and get a better name

how about THE DOUBLE DEUCE! or FIREBALL OF DEATH. anything other than....magic pie... ughh

P.S.S. Continually "Improvising" their design? hahaha they're definitely making it up as they go along.

I am a fan of the GoldenMotors but come on...:-D

 

[TylerDurden]

So... spoke flanges are ~15mm?

 

[Russell]

Remember it's a very tall motor so as you get closer to the rim the spacing narrows. I get around 17mm c-c when I blow the drawing way up.

-R

 

[amberwolf]

Well, if it was vaporware and they called it the "Magic Cake" instead, then we could all say "The cake is a lie".

I've a feeling one reason they integrated the controller was to not have to have a bigger ID on the axle to run higher gauge wires thru it, since at lower voltages a motor like that at higher loads is probably going to suck some current, which would not work as well on the thinner wires they'd be using in a small ID axle, especially since we already know they're probably not going to use wire with insulation that won't melt at higher temperatures when pressed together as it typically is in the axle or entering/exiting it. If the controller's inside, then only the battery wires going into it have to be bigger, and then there's only two of them, instead of three, so can be bigger with "cheaper" wire/insulation. (yeah, I know we're talking incredibly tiny amounts of wire and money here, but apparently those amounts are significant to the companies making these things, given what I have read about and seen on these forums and elsewhere, and seen in person).

Another reason might be specifically to discourage the casual experimenter from messing with the controller or using a different one. Only dedicated people like us are going to take their *wheel* apart to play with things.

Lack of tinkering might save them potential warranty issues (although I think the extra heat in there is going to kill a lot of controllers, at least at first, till they realize they'll have to use higher-grade components than they probably are going to at first).

I suppose we can be lucky they didn't also integrate the *batteries* into the motor, too.

 

[Russell]

I don't think heat is going to be a big problem with the standard installations. The controller is apparently limited to 20A so with a 48V battery that's a maximum of a little over 1000W (which I found to be plenty with my 9C). The big pie plates for side covers also provide a lot of surface area to radiate heat.

-R

 

[amberwolf]

Here in Phoenix, AZ, it's also a great big black surface to absorb heat from the road, direct sunlight, etc. In the daytime in summer, it's going to *start* at well over 100F, and could get to 120-150F before even powering it up, depending on the amount of sun striking it, since there is often no breeze to carry away any of the heat.

I don't doubt that they can also radiate a lot of heat out, plus convection as the wheel turns (perhaps the light-colored shapes on there are embossed or engraved, preventing laminar airflow and creating better heat transfer/convection).

But do they have any better *conduction* inside the motor? Remember that the external case can't be a direct heatsink for the controller or motor, because neither can be mounted directly to it, since it has to spin independently of them.

Other than by convection and radiation, the only other heat transfer mechanism is a small amount of conduction thru the (presumably steel) axle into the bike frame's dropouts, as well as thru this chain:
--into the inner steel bearing races then
--into lubrication then
--into the steel bearings then
--into more lubrication then
--into the outer steel bearing races then
--into the casing (aluminum?)

Since steel doesn't conduct heat very well or fast, the axle won't transmit that much heat out of the motor, and it will get hot inside. Even if you don't feel it on the outside (actually, *especially* if you don't feel it on the outside), after running under heavier loads or at faster speeds for longer times, the heat buildup in there is going to affect the electrolytic capacitors badly, eventually, even if it doesn't hurt any other component (which it will, over time, especially the MOSFETs).

Outside the motor, the controller might never have even gotten warm to the touch, but mounted inside with no ventilation and little conduction it's going to get pretty toasty.

Exactly how this will affect it can't be determined without having at least one to test to destruction, of course.

I *like* the idea of it all being in one place for a beginner kit, or for a simple setup, more stealthy, etc (well, stealthy is relative given the size of that thing. :lol: ), but I definitely have concerns about how it will hold up given what I know about *any* company and the more-than-tendency all of them have to use the cheapest parts that will make the design operate (not make it last).

 

[John in CR]

Man, you guys are a tough crowd, but most of you probably bow down to Xlytes, which may be powerful, but are built like crap for the absurd prices they bring. At least GM is trying to introduce new stuff.

It looks like the paint job is an attempt to make it look like a disk rotor for some stealth. I don't really like the idea of a controller inside either, but if it proves durable then great. I definitely like the larger diameter for areas with hills. How about a price?

John

 

[julesa]

She's my magic pie
Cool drink of water such a sweet surprise
Taste so good make a grown man cry
Sweet magic pie, yeah

Woaw

Well, swingin' on the front porch, swingin' on the lawn
Swingin' where we want 'cause there ain't nobody home
Swingin' to the left and swingin' to the right
I think about baseball, swing all night, yeah
Yeah, yeah

Huh, swingin' in the livin' room, swingin' in the kitchen
Most folks don't 'cause they're too busy bitchin'
Swingin' in there 'cause she wanted me to feed her
So I mixed up the batter and she licked the beater

I scream, you scream we all scream for her
Don't even try 'cause you can't ignore her

She's my magic pie
Cool drink of water such a sweet surprise
Tastes so good make a grown man cry
Sweet magic pie, oh yeah

She's my magic pie
Put a smile on your face ten miles wide
Looks so good bring a tear to your eye
Sweet magic pie, yeah

Swingin' to the drums, swingin' to guitar
Swingin' to the bass in the back of my car
Ain't got money, ain't got no gas
But we'll get where we're goin' if we swing real fast

I scream, you scream we all scream for her
Don't even try 'cause you can't ignore her

She's my magic pie
Cool drink of water such a sweet surprise
Tastes so good make a grown man cry
Sweet magic pie, oh yeah

She's my magic pie
Put a smile on your face ten miles wide
Looks so good bring a tear to your eye
Sweet magic pie, yeah
Pie, yeah
Swing it
All night long
Swing it
(Aow)

I'm a trained professional
Swingin' in the bathroom, swingin' on the floor
Swingin' so hard forgot to lock the door
In walk her daddy standin' six foot four
Said, "You ain't gonna swing with my daughter no more"

She's my magic pie
Cool drink of water such a sweet surprise
Tastes so good make a grown man cry
Sweet magic pie, oh yeah

Huh, swing it


(kind of embarrassed to post Warrant lyrics but... oh well)

 

[dogman dan]

Yup, we're a tough crowd with the vendors all right. We tried on a previous thread to get em to call it something else in North America.

Seriously, in many climates the integrated controller will be a plus, but not here in the southwestern desert. So they lose us, who account for one millionth of thier market. I can see how this idea will keep coming up, especially for wet climates and places where a controller would get taken off a bike.

 

[John in CR]

Yup, we're a tough crowd with the vendors all right. We tried on a previous thread to get em to call it something else in North America.

Seriously, in many climates the integrated controller will be a plus, but not here in the southwestern desert. So they lose us, who account for one millionth of thier market. I can see how this idea will keep coming up, especially for wet climates and places where a controller would get taken off a bike.

I could care less what the name is, unless it's stamped big on the motor. Regarding the heat, it very likely has more surface area than many motors + exterior controllers combined. Plus with that surface area spinning, it will cool better than a typical controller placement. If it's a good and low heat generating controller, then inside the motor is a good place for it, except for those of us wanting to try different controllers. IOW you may very well be better off with it than a little geared hub + exterior controller. Be careful with those knee-jerk reactions, when we won't really know till people get them and beat the hell out of them long-term.

John

 

[317537]

Sorry for the post farming but the other threads on this makes it difficult to get my centiment accross.

Rather than just bag the work I try to offer an example of something better.

Well I'm not trying to get any prizes here as this is just a quick job to show what could be done and working with original pictures and materials would be worth spending some more time and thought into the designs format.

Id work with catch phrases and names leading to a model genre. I try to stay away from sausages bagels cheese cake and pies and look at what the product does.

 

[GoldenMotor]

It is NOT a paint job, it is exterior embossed to radiate heat, plus the silver colour REFLECTS heat.
FYI: MAGIC PIE CAN DO 80NM with 800W, other motors can only do that at 1500W!

 

[Russell]

It is NOT a paint job, it is exterior embossed to radiate heat, plus the silver colour REFLECTS heat. thank you very much! intelligent people.

Whatever, just offer an ALL BLACK motor for people who wish to be more discreet.

-R

 

[GoldenMotor]

It is NOT a paint job, it is exterior embossed to radiate heat, plus the silver colour REFLECTS heat. thank you very much! intelligent people.

Whatever, just offer an ALL BLACK motor for people who wish to be more discreet.

-R

so that when the motor overheats you can try to get a new motor from us free of charge?

 

[Russell]

It is NOT a paint job, it is exterior embossed to radiate heat, plus the silver colour REFLECTS heat. thank you very much! intelligent people.

Whatever, just offer an ALL BLACK motor for people who wish to be more discreet.

-R

so that when the motor overheats you can try to get a new motor from us free of charge?

So you're saying if you made the silver area black it would overheat? Have you tested it black and silver and got a significant difference in heat retention with it all black? Did you try it black anodized?

-R

 

[GoldenMotor]

why don't you write me a full list of suggestions, with precise details and i will consider making it black anodized if people need it that bad.