Holmes' #6 Le Toy II (vids page 11)

[johnrobholmes]

I have this old street frame that I haven't ridden since about 2004. It hasn't even been built fully since sometime around 2005 when I yanked the front wheel for another bike.

Parts list-

9c rear hub
single speed freewheel
HV110 or Shenzen controller depending on batteries used
Magura throttle
MPI throttle tester if HV110 is used
Zippy lipo or A123, depending on final details.


I have everything here, I just gotta decide what wheelsize I will lace this up into. I may try a 16" rim to keep it constant with my Bafang build, for best comparison. 20" would keep the BB high enough to actually pedal though, so I will probably throw on a Rhyno Lite Xl rim with a radial lace as I already have the spokes here. Single cross would need 97mm spokes, radial uses 81mm which is the same as a Bafang laced into a 16" rim.


Decisions decisions. Too many options :lol:

 

[gogo]

You could make it into a DIY longtail and angle the rear triangle attachment down to get the ground clearance for the BB when using a 16" wheel. You could then even add suspension if you wished.

 

[johnrobholmes]

Nah, I have a suspension in the works already and have no need for a longtail. I want to try and keep the offroad capabilities anyway, this guy won't be a workhorse at all. Good suggestions though, makes me think outside my box.

 

[Reid Welch]

It's going to be a screamin' fun bike for rough riding. Come to the sunken park with me some day.
Let's race. You'll win, but I'll have just as much fun. The bumps are tremendous!

(picture of the park needs to be made tomorrow so you all can see what urban off road riding can be like)

Best of results with your smart build. Standing by for action,

r.

 

[johnrobholmes]

This has been my favorite build so far by a long shot. Ok, so maybe it is my first bike that is comfy and powerful. The Bafang just didn't cut it for me on 26" rims, but this 9C has some scoot in a 26" on 12s lipo! I can pull wheelies if I lean back a touch, and when sitting and pedaling it will certainly make the front end skip around. Plus I can jump curbs and ride like a hooligan on it. It is my most used vehicle now, just gotta get some better fenders.


Gotta find my battery charger for the camera so I can take pics. It is pretty sweet with all black and chrome cranks.


Parts list
12s2p Zippy 15C 10ah total
Castle HV110
MPI throttle box
Magura throttle
9C wheel from Ebikekit.com
lots of anderson Power Pole connectors


I have been messing with polypropylene trying to make a battery box. No dice so far, I cant get my welds to hold right. I need more heat or different filler material. I am much better at welding metal.

 

[johnrobholmes]

I have put about 100 miles on the build so far, and it is taking a nice beating. The Ebikekit hub lace job has loosened up (normal) but I don't think I will be able to tension it and adjust it properly because of the spoke angles and nipple seat (eyelet) angles. I will just relace the wheel into a radial lace, and probably use a fatter rim since this one is too narrow for my frame. I may lace it into a 24" rim, but only if I can find a decent controller for 18s lipo use.


Work to do-

Weld mount tabs for a frame located pack
weld battery box that looks cool
relace rear rim
Rear rack or trailer for storage space
Mount box for motor controller and 5v DC-DC converter
ride some more


I get right at 18 to 20 miles of riding HARD on the 12s 10ah pack, with near zero pedaling. I spend most of my time wide open throttle. Pack mounts in the small space right above the cranks.

 

[johnrobholmes]

I was just doing some calculations, and I have ridden closer to 250 miles. I need a speedo and ODO on my bikes. :lol:

 

[johnrobholmes]

Got a speedo installed today. Max speed down hill was 33mph. Average over a 4 mile ride with lots of hills, 22.8mph. Slowest speed up a pretty steep hill was 20mph. Flat ground rate was 26mph.

Stock 9C motor from ebike kit, on 12s 10ah lipoly. CC HV110 controller.


FAster than I expected, almost a perfect missouri moped I may need to recalc my rollout for the computer too, I used a generic setting.

 

[johnrobholmes]

Just did some mock work with Matt's e-tranny and it won't work properly on this bike :| The way my cranks and frame are situated I cannot get the chainline to be straight and also clear the cranks. That solves my dilemma of what to put his drive unit on!

I may do some head scratching to see what can be done. I may be able to figure out an unconventional mounting for this frame.


I also have a PUMA motor on the way that I might throw into this bike for awhile.

 

[johnrobholmes]

I laced a 17" motorcycle rim into a Marzocchi 20mm front hub with 10ga stainless motorcycle spokes. Tire is a Shinko 17x2.5 DOT rated dual sport. I think I may do the same for the rear if I convert this to a divorced drivetrain instead of hub motor. I also have some slick street tires that are a good bit lighter. This particular wheel is earmarked for another build, but I figure I can test it out on this guy for a while.

Strange stance right now, I will ride it tonight and see how it handles. I have to replace the connectors on my battery and motor controller as well, as the little caps in the DC-DC converter have slowly eaten them up. I will use the larger 75a Power Poles this time.

 

[johnrobholmes]

I went for a 10 mile ride tonight around downtown, and have decided that the rear wheel is getting the same treatment. It was so solid! I was jumping 8 stair sets like I was a kid again.


Of course this means my black RC drive unit will be fitted into the frame, and a new rear wheel laced up. 9c gets to move to bigger and better places.

 

[Grinhill]

I don't think I've seen anyone else using an RC ESC with a hubmotor, John.

Does this work well?

 

[johnrobholmes]

It works very well actually. The 9c is extremely well behaved with the Castle controller.


I just laced up a PUMA motor for the build and it is studdering a bit with the HV110, but I have a suspicion that the long thin wire and high power is causing the problem. I will swap out the motor wires or shorten them greatly and see what happens. Everything was getting pretty toasty on 12s lipo.


Otherwise the PUMA motor rides great. It feels to have very similar power to the 9c, same speed, maybe a touch faster acceleration, and much quieter operation since it doesn't resonate. It is very nice to drop about 6 pounds from the rear too.

 

[etard]

That bike looks great John!

So the HV110 is plug n play with no mods at all to the hub motor?
If so I may have to try this, just to cobble something together for meow. Also I see you have adapters coming, will this be sold on your website?

 

[johnrobholmes]

The Castle is plug and play for most motors. It isn't liking the PUMA however. I need to shorten wires and see if this can fix the issue.

To run the Castle ESC you need a voltage regulator, servo tester, and pot throttle. Recumbence made a thread about it.

What adapters are you referring to?

 

[johnrobholmes]

An update to the Castle firmware made it sync with the PUMA much better. Very hard acceleration.


I put a Shenzen 72v sensored controller on today. Old version, 12fet, hard start, 45a limit. 18s turnigy lipo, 10ah worth. It has some scoot!! Top speed was not recorded officially, but I would guess about 35 or 36mph. My eyes were tearing, I needed glasses.

The acceleration was not as hard with the Shenzen, and the low speed control is very bad compared to the HV110. I used a hall effect thumb throttle, although my Magura throttle worked fine. I was surprised at the noise level. I expected more noise, but the motor was very quiet. Overall, very rideable, but not relaxing. The touchy touchy throttle makes for more white knuckle riding at low speed.


Once I get back home I will report on watt/hour mile at this voltage.

 

[johnrobholmes]

So even though my top speed has gone up, my range seems to be EXTENDED!

Gererally I would use 5ah on 18s to get to school and back. It took 4ah to do it on 18s. So the watt/hours increased from 222 to 266 for the round trip. OK, not exactly better mileage. But I do get further while going faster :lol: The extra 444 watt/hours of batteries help I reckon 8) I figured that I would not be able to get the normal range because of the increased speed, even with the extra packs.

 

[grwsaltspring]

Hi J;

What does the bike look like now?

Greg

 

[johnrobholmes]

Same as last pic, just a different hub. Everything is crammed in the frame for now.

Just broke the PUMA motor. Hit a bump going about 40, according the the motorcycle riding next to me. I was on power when I rolled up the back side of the pothole and it broke the gears. Now I gotta pedal this 60lb bike home, or get a ride. :x


Serves me right for doubling the voltage. I will put the 9c motor back in for short term, of course keeping the high voltage.

 

[grwsaltspring]

I really like the look of the Motorcycle tires and rim.

Just reread your posts and realized that you were going to try the same set up on your rear wheel "if you did a non-hub build"...

Missed that the first time round.

Greg

 

[johnrobholmes]

Yeah, that is the plan. It would be slow if I laced up a smaller rim and tire with a hub motor, but I could change the geardown with a divorced driveline. This frame and fork just beg for a rediculous solid wheel setup.


More work before I ride to school tomorrow. I would rather ride the bike than drive though. I haven't kept track of my miles lately, and have been charging twice many days of the week.

 

[Paul.............D]

Hi John that front wheel looks dogs ollocks nice build what is the rim off?


Paul

 

[johnrobholmes]

It is a 17" motorcycle rim, dirtbike. Pro wheels brand I think? I got custom spokes cut for the wheel, 10 gauge stainless. I had to drill out both hub and rim for it to work, but it laced very easily once I was started.

Tire is DOT rated Shinko 244, 17x2.5"

 

[johnrobholmes]

rode the 9c wheel on 72volts today. Acceleration seems a lot slower than the Puma, but top speed feels the same. Acceleration at first is much more pokey, but when I get above half throttle it really wakes up.

 

[johnrobholmes]

I rode home from class today IN the flow of traffic. For a safe commuter bike in 30 to 35mph traffic, the 9c on 72v seems to be the ticket. It blends in with traffic like a 50cc scooter would. I did not measure much appreciable motor heat at the end of the ride. I weigh 160lbs.


I do not like thumb throttles. It is unnatural for my grip and tiring for the thumb. I cannot hold the bars tight while keeping modulation on the throttle. The thumb throttle would be better suited for relaxed style riding.

I tend to ride very hard, jumping with the undulations in the road and cornering with enough speed to slide a bit. The profile of the Shinko motorcycle tire is proving very predictable, I have almost washed out the front a few times. The key word is almost, as I have been able to save the skid as it happens.