markz
100 TW
Thats what the 18fet 4110 is 72V 65A, unless its modded for lower voltage.
Leaf / leafmotor / leafbike high efficiency 1500w motor
- Thread starter neptronix
- Start date
mchlpeel
100 W
An 18 fet can be used with 48v too. No mods required
Em3ev has an 18fet. It's all explained in the link.
The only advantage of 3077 is that there is less internal resistance on the fets therefore can run more current as there's less heat generated. But 18fets is greater than 3077 as there are 6 more fets to share the load. Also 3077 is limited to 63v. not seen an 18 fet 3077. Would be good for this motor though.
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=38&product_id=83
Em3ev has an 18fet. It's all explained in the link.
The only advantage of 3077 is that there is less internal resistance on the fets therefore can run more current as there's less heat generated. But 18fets is greater than 3077 as there are 6 more fets to share the load. Also 3077 is limited to 63v. not seen an 18 fet 3077. Would be good for this motor though.
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=38&product_id=83
The voltage limit for 3077 FETs is actually 75v. up to 17S Lipo is totally safe.
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/irfb3077pbf.pdf
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/irfb3077pbf.pdf
FluxShifter
10 mW
If your not going to run 18s or higher I would go with the 12 fet 3077 for efficiency. Before I fryed my leaf bike controller I was using less watt hours than with my 12 fet 4110 with the same 48v 15ah Calibike battery. Not sure what 12 fets are in the leaf controller but they don't like shorted phase wires. I'll crack it open and look when I get home. The leaf controller does have 63v caps. This controller is Not programmable in any way.
SprocketLocket
100 W
More to controller voltage handling than just the FETs though.neptronix said:
And I noticed you said 17S, which would be a very unusual cell count, so we're talking theoretical max here. 1 more cell, 18S, that would be interesting: 3 x 6S (72V nominal). Is there a 3077 controller that can safely handle 18S? If so, I'd be very interested...
SprocketLocket
100 W
Do you think the Leaf controller was limiting you in some way, therefore making you more 'efficient'? Kind of like some people get worse fuel economy with a more powerful motor, not because of the motor, but because of their enjoyment of the extra power? Do you feel a difference in power with how you have the 4110 programmed?FluxShifter said:
EDIT - Wait, how did you fry your Leaf controller?! Did I miss you writing about that?
FluxShifter
10 mW
The Leaf controller is limiting. You can't adjust battery current, phase current or any other parameters at the controller itself. The only adjustment you do have is the 0-5 levels of assist on the display that comes with the kit. You do get a little more acceleration from level 1 to level 5 while using the throttle. With the 12 fet 4110 I adjusted the battery current to 40a and phase current to 60a to try and mimic the efficiency of the Leaf controller. The 4110 still accels harder contributing to more Wh usage but I could always adjust my throttle ramp a bit to lower this effect, nah. What I did notice was cruising at WOT 32 mph I'm using 1100 watts. With the Leaf controller I was using 900 watts. That's why I said the Leaf controller was more efficient than the 4110. Could I be going faster with the 4110 and the CA wheel speedo VS the leaf using the hall speedo? could be. I am maxing out my Calibike 48v 15ah battery with the 4110 as it sags hard and this could also be a factor. I would have to run test with my 16ah multistars to really see the difference but the Leaf controller is dead. I did notice my Calibike battery did not like 120% throttle and would oscillate at WOT. I tried taming this effect with the CA's different throttle settings but no dice. I was quite happy with the performance of the 1500w Leaf motor, Leaf controller(kit) and Calibike battery and I think they all paired together well. This is the combo I use to build clients bikes as it's user friendly and plug and play.
Yes I killed my Leaf controller. I was testing the motor on my clients bike with my controller and the motor had ring connectors. I put the bullet connectors through the ring connectors and spread them as far apart as I could with no problem. As I was spinning up his motor I put my fingers on the spokes and it jerked upwards. This pulled the phase wires together and zap. Now all the motor would do was move a quarter turn and shut off. Frock I was pissed. But in the end I get a more powerful setup.
Here are some pics of the inside of the Leaf controller. It is strange that they use 2 different style fets. Not sure what either are.
I did a no load spin up on my clients bike with the same 5t motor. 510 rpm at 50v
Yes I killed my Leaf controller. I was testing the motor on my clients bike with my controller and the motor had ring connectors. I put the bullet connectors through the ring connectors and spread them as far apart as I could with no problem. As I was spinning up his motor I put my fingers on the spokes and it jerked upwards. This pulled the phase wires together and zap. Now all the motor would do was move a quarter turn and shut off. Frock I was pissed. But in the end I get a more powerful setup.
Here are some pics of the inside of the Leaf controller. It is strange that they use 2 different style fets. Not sure what either are.
I did a no load spin up on my clients bike with the same 5t motor. 510 rpm at 50v
John in CR
100 TW
Those who dance close to the voltage limit of the components in their controller are playing with fire. Any experience EE will tell you to allow a healthy margin, say 10% typically, and since that 4 turn is a more difficult to drive motor as noted by hot controllers then allow even more.
Also, those who feel the need to speed settings higher than 10% with common square wave controllers are running too low a voltage. Why pay extra for a more efficient motor just to turn around and give some of that efficiency advantage away for no reason?
Also, those who feel the need to speed settings higher than 10% with common square wave controllers are running too low a voltage. Why pay extra for a more efficient motor just to turn around and give some of that efficiency advantage away for no reason?
markz
100 TW
So an ideal Leaf 1500w motor would be the 5T, with Sine Wave Controller.
That controller :lol: I've opened up one of those and was apalled by the construction.
MXUS sold that as a sine wave controller to customers a while back. Shittiest controller i have ever seen in my life. They filled out the solder traces about 25% of what they should been on this 60A controller. It looked like it would comfortably flow maybe 20 amps continuous, tops. The wiring also indicated that it was more like a 20A controller at most, yet it had 12 fets..
I saw another "40A" version of this from the same company and it was designed equally weak.
Infineon/infineon clones FTW..
MXUS sold that as a sine wave controller to customers a while back. Shittiest controller i have ever seen in my life. They filled out the solder traces about 25% of what they should been on this 60A controller. It looked like it would comfortably flow maybe 20 amps continuous, tops. The wiring also indicated that it was more like a 20A controller at most, yet it had 12 fets..
I saw another "40A" version of this from the same company and it was designed equally weak.
Infineon/infineon clones FTW..
FluxShifter
10 mW
markz
100 TW
Whats prefered? Gobs and hills of solder for more amps?
SprocketLocket
100 W
Oh, you were using 2 separate speedos. Still interesting, and sorry for your lossFluxShifter said:
. FWIW, and I'm not saying anything you don't know, but what I do is rubber-band a car GPS running on internal battery power for a short run. A good way to get an objective readout. And you don't have to spend time rigging up a proper speedo on someone else's bike. I even use GPS speedo in cars, as it's more accurate than the car's speedo. I just use a thick rubber band folded over twice. Yeah it blocks the screen a bit, but it's only to watch the speed, with the 'top' of the GPS receiver laying on top of the brake/shifter cables for more support. It works short-term <shrug>. Want to see if I can find a cheap handlebar GPS mount out there. Some smartphone mounts I'd imagine would probably work too. Getting the units to not go into 'computer mode' when connected to an external USB power source is the bigger challenge for me.mchlpeel
100 W
neptronix said:If the 24" 4T wheel doesn't work out for ya, maybe i'll buy it. Only if you special order a 24mm internal width rim though instead of the crappy 20mm wide rim they normally hand out.
I have found a site selling Maxxis Hookworms 24 x 2.5
Is a 24mm internal width wide wnough for this tire?
I checked Sheldon Browns website but couldnt find anything useful
..really? you found the holy grail? better share it 
24mm wide on a 2.5 tire is a little balooney but not too bad.
Use a 20mm rim and the tire could very well slip off the rim, lol.
24mm wide on a 2.5 tire is a little balooney but not too bad.
Use a 20mm rim and the tire could very well slip off the rim, lol.
mchlpeel said:neptronix said:If the 24" 4T wheel doesn't work out for ya, maybe i'll buy it. Only if you special order a 24mm internal width rim though instead of the crappy 20mm wide rim they normally hand out.
I have found a site selling Maxxis Hookworms 24 x 2.5
Is a 24mm internal width wide wnough for this tire?
I checked Sheldon Browns website but couldnt find anything useful
SprocketLocket
100 W
FWIW I saw ebikes.ca sells three different 24-inch rims.
They also have the hard-to-find 65mm 26-inch Weinmann fatbike rim. Prices do not include shipping from Canada, but otherwise seem good.
http://www.ebikes.ca/shop/ebike-parts/rims.html
They also have the hard-to-find 65mm 26-inch Weinmann fatbike rim. Prices do not include shipping from Canada, but otherwise seem good.
http://www.ebikes.ca/shop/ebike-parts/rims.html
markz
100 TW
http://www.ebikes.ca/shop/ebike-parts/rims/rim26-fat65.html
I bought their 26" 31mm Wide Downhill Crysatlyte Rim.
The only thing I dislike about it, is the sticker on the rim doesnt stick properly. Meaning the edges were loose.
Otherwise its a good rim, although its out of line now and I broke a spoke, which is why I have 2 spares.
For a few days there awhile ago, I was running it hard and fast. Ran flat for quite some time, ruining my Maxxis tire.
I bought their 26" 31mm Wide Downhill Crysatlyte Rim.
The only thing I dislike about it, is the sticker on the rim doesnt stick properly. Meaning the edges were loose.
Otherwise its a good rim, although its out of line now and I broke a spoke, which is why I have 2 spares.
For a few days there awhile ago, I was running it hard and fast. Ran flat for quite some time, ruining my Maxxis tire.
Kodin
1 kW
drewjet said:
...Have a machinist cut you a wider replacement shaft out of something appropriate for axles and get it heat-treated? Might cost $60 or so in labor, but it'd be a killer setup...
Kodin
1 kW
...And this is why I ordered a Sabvoton for my 5T. I'm rebuilding my wheel again as I need to add washers to the neck of each spoke, and the only brass washers that are appropriate don't fit right; instead I'm going to cut 36 custom-formed spacers out of brass rod. Yes it's overkill. Yes I'll post pictures when I start.neptronix said:
mchlpeel
100 W
Unfortunately Leafbike don't stock 32mm 24" rims
For others they stock the following internal rim widths for 24"
18mm,24mm,70mm,95mm
Im by no means an expert but i assume i should immediatly discount the 70mm rim for a 2.5" tire?
Regarding maxxis hookworms. The website is UK based I will be glad to share when I have secured mine later in the week
For others they stock the following internal rim widths for 24"
18mm,24mm,70mm,95mm
Im by no means an expert but i assume i should immediatly discount the 70mm rim for a 2.5" tire?
Regarding maxxis hookworms. The website is UK based I will be glad to share when I have secured mine later in the week
SprocketLocket
100 W
Are we talking about ebikes.ca here? I see very different rim sizes on the link I posted above.17, 23, 31.mchlpeel said:
(91mm 24-inch rim?!)
Also, looks like the fat 65mm 26-inch Weinmann is sold out.
I'm no expert either, but my understanding is that it's best to have the rim be at least a little narrower than the tire. Sometimes people push it to have both about equal. I think of people who might think to put a 4-inch fat tire on a 100mm rim (100mm work out to very close to 4 inches). I've seen Neptronix discuss and post photos of putting fairly narrow mountain bike tires on fairly wide rims, calling it an "eraser head" effect. The tire tread spreads out, it becomes kind of flat, and there is not much or any tread on the sidewalls. 2.5 inches works out to 63.5mm, but of course the 'inch' rating is nominal. And normally IMO tires are a little narrower than they say, and of course their rating depends upon an assumed rim size, too. So, I don't think you'll find anyone say here that it's cool to put a 63mm tire on a 70mm rim, unfortunately.
70mm and 95mm 24-inch rims. Wow, unusual to say the least, but cool. I wonder wherever you're getting that from, if those are exterior rim measurements.
markz
100 TW
Graph near bottom of the page.
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html
mchlpeel
100 W
The information came from leafbike in an email
Those measurements were stated as internal rim widths.
I thought it was strange to have such a huge gap. I edited my post above to remove confusion
Those measurements were stated as internal rim widths.
I thought it was strange to have such a huge gap. I edited my post above to remove confusion
