New Crystalyte Motor series (HT35 / HS35 and HT24 / HS24)

[electricwheels.de]

Jeeez... looks like Crystalyte is taking the easy road to get those sensors fitted...

Only guess that they are running the sensor cables around the outside of the windings. Saves a lot of work... and some material as well (that of the stator steel leaves) :wink: .

It's quite a fiddly job to get these wires fitted through the winding loops, converted to hours it'll take a while. But hey, spec 44 AWG 28 does a neat job. Maybe I should sell a 'conversion set' consisting of wires and Sensors, including a 'how to' set of written instructions.

But then again, it's 3 hours of your precious time, more if you do it the first time and impossible if you've got 2 left hands or can't handle a soldering iron the way it's meant to be... So much easier just to buy a modified HT-X or HR-X... :wink:

 

[Bazaki]

It sure is a lot of work, luckily I like doing these kind of improvements.

How exactly did you make the shaft cable tunnel wider ?

 

[hochdorf]

Can i use controller from radio-controlled models with this motor?

 

[methods]

So is anyone else aware that the sensored motors are now going to be reduced to 32mm ?
In my last email from Kenny he lists sensorless Hx35s but the sensored motors only have 32mm stators.
Why is it so hard to fit halls to the 35mm stator ????

I have not been back to this thread in months - so I am 100's of posts behind and I dont really know where the discussion has gone. I can tell you that we negotiated with Kenny and certain online vendors have shipments of 35mm stators WITH hall sensors. What Kenny has done since those were assembled is unknown to me - what I can say is that guy is swamped right now like I have never seen him before. Totally underwater in orders.... so he may be looking for any way he can to improve throughput - which is understandable.

Rest assured that when the 35mm sensored motors (that I know about) land I will be here to tell you who has them.

-methods

 

[methods]

Ok - I just went back and skimmed 20 pages of thread

BigMoose - For 24" rims I drill out the holes in inserts of the rim a little to allow the 14g spokes to run more true. I do a 1 cross. 0 cross is suitable only for 20" wheels in my opinion.... but then you are not running as much torque as I am. I suppose it also depends on what quality spokes you are running.


As far as this "noise" you guys are talking about.... I suspect that there may be several things going on. It is NOT a matter of a sensored motor being louder than a sensorless.... they are about the same noise wise. BUT - it could be that in fitting the hall cable through the axle additional pressure is put on the phase wires causing micro-abrasions which short multiple phase wires to the axle. This might not be apparent when cool (freewheel testing) but once things start to heat up and expand it could be that phases are shorting through the axle. This would/could cause the motor to run "loud" and would very likely end bad.

I have had several motor short at the axle (Including the 5305 where I spun the stator off the axle) and the motor runs loud right before it dies. To simulate this simply take the bike up to 30mph and short two of the phase leads Its the cogging of a crowbar brake.


-methods

 

[Bazaki]

On the left hand sensor goes the blue wire, on the centre sensor the yellow wire and the sensor to your right gets the green wire.

Are you sure electricwheels ? I did some motors with left hand blue centre green right hand yellow. I did not run all of them, but at least one of them is running 100% perfect.

 

[deVries]

Can i use controller from radio-controlled models with this motor?

This would not be advisable. Only if you're willing to pedal first & go a few mph/kph by leg-power BEFORE applying any power to the ESC, AND, even then, you have to ramp it up probably slower than you might want to. It's not a stop to start solution.

Usually, most people blow their ESC controllers BEFORE they work-out the bugs to do this, and so they stop attempting to do it anymore. You would need a very $$$ high Amp ESC too.

 

[mr.electric]

Has anyone had luck running sensorless? If so what controller and how many volts and how much current can you pull before you need to switched to a sensored set up?

 

[bigmoose]

Thanks methods! I was successful with 13 gauge, 142mm spoke length in 1 cross on my 24 inch wheel. My spokes were from johnrobholmes and they were perfect. I changed my fronts on the KMX to 20 inch and have everything trued up to +-0.003 in. I am going to widen the KMX 5 or 6 inches and lengthen it 6 to 8 inches. With the big front tires my hands are getting forced into the tires when I pedal. For reference I'm 6' 6'' or 198 cm tall.

 

[methods]

..... My spokes were from johnrobholmes and they were perfect. I changed my fronts on the KMX to 20 inch and have everything trued up to +-0.003 in. ......

Wow... I think my wheels are true to more like +/-3mm

-methods

 

[bigmoose]

Patrick, I used the Bridgeport for a wheel truing stand... what can I say? The dial indicator was sitting right there, and was so easy to use. I started playing with the truing, and then it became a game if I could get it +-0.000 After about an hour, I realized I was kraZy and quit with the wheels +-0.002 to 0.003 in. I am sure they are off after my first mile!

BTW, good to see you back posting! Don't work so hard in the future.

 

[deVries]

Has anyone had luck running sensorless? If so what controller and how many volts and how much current can you pull before you need to switched to a sensored set up?

Maxwell & ilia have these motors for sale w/sensorless xlyte controllers. Both have stated good results, so you would have to use the voltage & amp ratings within spec on those sensorless controllers to get those same results. See the For Sale section for specs & comments.

Going above the xlyte controller rating in volts or amps is where there are likely problems, & this should be avoided for failure or damage reasons. If you're a high speed "freak" or love incredible acceleration with that torque feel off the line, then going sensored (vs sensorless) is the path to take for high performance.

 

[Planky]

Has anyone had luck running sensorless? If so what controller and how many volts and how much current can you pull before you need to switched to a sensored set up?

Hi I am running sensorless. I have a HS3540 on the rear of my KMX X-Class.
I am using a 12FET controller from Lyen at 44.4V and 35A. The Watt meter gives me a maximum of 1800 Watts so far.
I have not tried increasing the amps yet, the batteries will easily supply it but I am happy with the acceleration that 35A gives me.
I am after reliability as this is my commute vehicle!

The motor and controller are great, you can pull away from standstill but I prefer to give a push on the peddles first.
My top speed so far measured with a GPS is 30mph which is scary down the cycle path that I commute on.

The motor is so quiet that I always have to let people know I am there so the let me pass, they never hear me.

 

[nonlineartom]

http://www.crystalyte-europe.com/product.php?productid=16445&cat=0&page=1


I've been looking at the HT motor forbuilding a rock hopper / electric scrambler bike, also looking at the 36V 25A crystalyte controller to go with it. I've heard these motors can pull a heavy current, will this kill my A123 LiPo4 pack? I've pulled over 60A peak on it but I think it's only designed to take 30A. Good idea / bad idea?

I'm not looking to build a speed machine just something that can handle some tight rocky trails at the weekends.

Thanks!

 

[Arlo1]

Patrick, I used the Bridgeport for a wheel truing stand... what can I say? The dial indicator was sitting right there, and was so easy to use. I started playing with the truing, and then it became a game if I could get it +-0.000 After about an hour, I realized I was kraZy and quit with the wheels +-0.002 to 0.003 in. I am sure they are off after my first mile!

BTW, good to see you back posting! Don't work so hard in the future.

I once had a motorcycle rim at <.001 both lateral and radial but it doesn't happen often because of the seam in the rim. And It real just isn't worth it lol.
I really do aim for perfect with cranks I rebuild my last 2 stroke was at the perfect 0 I could not believe it that doesn't happen often either but I do always get them better then the factory.
But I like your enthusiasm

 

[deVries]

I've heard these motors can pull a heavy current, will this kill my A123 LiPo4 pack? I've pulled over 60A peak on it but I think it's only designed to take 30A. Good idea / bad idea?

I'm not looking to build a speed machine just something that can handle some tight rocky trails at the weekends.

With A123 you should be fine. Just make sure not to drain the pack-cells below a reasonable cut-off voltage or LVC before recharge. It's always good to design your battery pack with some extra capacity, so you don't always have to push the batteries to the bottom end of LVC every time... this should extend the lifespan of your battery pack too (assuming you "storage charge" when not using for long periods).

The motor is so quiet that I always have to let people know I am there so the let me pass, they never hear me.

Thanks for the feedback. This is an especially interesting trend of comments I think I've been seeing with the sensorless controller... That the motor is very quiet. I wonder if that will be just as true with a sensored controller??? Maybe for a stealth mode of silent running you will need the matched sensorless controller vs sensored?

Does anyone have some RL experience with a noise comparison between sensored vs sensorless with these new motors?

 

[Bazaki]

Zero difference, 12 fet sensorless vs 18 fet sensored

 

[nieles]

hi,

can someone tell me how long it took Crystalyt Europe to ship a hub motor?

i ordered on may 31, but i have not heard from them since. no email, nothing
i also heard they do not respond to emails very well, does someone know if they are in the dutch or french part of begium?

i hope someone can help me out.

Thanks

 

[Bazaki]

another dutch crystalyte rider, No worries, I'm sure they will ship it soon.

 

[mr.electric]

Has anyone had luck running sensorless? If so what controller and how many volts and how much current can you pull before you need to switched to a sensored set up?

Hi I am running sensorless. I have a HS3540 on the rear of my KMX X-Class.
I am using a 12FET controller from Lyen at 44.4V and 35A. The Watt meter gives me a maximum of 1800 Watts so far.
I have not tried increasing the amps yet, the batteries will easily supply it but I am happy with the acceleration that 35A gives me.
I am after reliability as this is my commute vehicle!

The motor and controller are great, you can pull away from standstill but I prefer to give a push on the peddles first.

Do you mind reading the serial number on the Lyen bar code sticker, there are so many versions it is hard to sort through. I tried one 12 fet Lyen sensorless with an HS35 and got major sync issues. Also did you set it to 35 amps using the software cable or did it come that way?
I am trying to decide whether to get another Lyen controller or go with the Crystalye sensorless controller which is know to work and only available in two versions 36-48v and 48-72v so little confusion about what version works with which motor at what settings.

 

[snellemin]

The sensorless controller that I got from Lyen didn't have a label on it. The one I got is meant for high speed and my motor runs quiet. With the CA, I lowered the Amp setting to 50A to 45A. I peaked at 39A with 90V.

 

[wojtek]

do call them please!

it seems the only way that works. And the only way that prompts them to do anything!

I returned the PAS controllers like over a month ago. Since that time i called them few times and they kept saying that there is a delay in receiving them from Kenny. Last time i called 2 weeks ago and they said they would have them in a week. So i was hoping to get them last week but nothing untill yesterday.
I called them yesterday and they said that they have them in stock and will ship the day after. [today]

If i didnt call , i would wait another month or two.

Regarding motors however, they will receive them next week. But make sure you call them and remind about your order.

hi,

can someone tell me how long it took Crystalyt Europe to ship a hub motor?

i ordered on may 31, but i have not heard from them since. no email, nothing
i also heard they do not respond to emails very well, does someone know if they are in the dutch or french part of begium?

i hope someone can help me out.

Thanks

 

[Planky]

Do you mind reading the serial number on the Lyen bar code sticker, there are so many versions it is hard to sort through. I tried one 12 fet Lyen sensorless with an HS35 and got major sync issues. Also did you set it to 35 amps using the software cable or did it come that way?
I am trying to decide whether to get another Lyen controller or go with the Crystalye sensorless controller which is know to work and only available in two versions 36-48v and 48-72v so little confusion about what version works with which motor at what settings.

The serial number on the bar code sticker ends 110B005, the first part has a scratch on it it could be 0-something-110B005.

I asked Edward to set it up for 12S LiPo for me, but have purchased the cable so that I can modify the settings myself should the need for more speed arise.

The inflexibility with regard to the voltages and the high price are the reasons I decided not to get a Crystalyte controller, after a quick chat with Edward I decided to try one of his controllers.

 

[mr.electric]

The serial number on the bar code sticker ends 110B005, the first part has a scratch on it it could be 0-something-110B005.

I asked Edward to set it up for 12S LiPo for me, but have purchased the cable so that I can modify the settings myself should the need for more speed arise.

The inflexibility with regard to the voltages and the high price are the reasons I decided not to get a Crystalyte controller, after a quick chat with Edward I decided to try one of his controllers.

Thanks planky. Now I have a known good compatible Lyen controller as a viable option. I'm planning to run 14s and around 40 amps so very similar to your set up.

 

[Spacey]

I did a paypal charge back thing...got their arse in gear pretty quick.

Terrible service for a European company, I mean really terrible.

do call them please!

it seems the only way that works. And the only way that prompts them to do anything!

I returned the PAS controllers like over a month ago. Since that time i called them few times and they kept saying that there is a delay in receiving them from Kenny. Last time i called 2 weeks ago and they said they would have them in a week. So i was hoping to get them last week but nothing untill yesterday.
I called them yesterday and they said that they have them in stock and will ship the day after. [today]

If i didnt call , i would wait another month or two.

Regarding motors however, they will receive them next week. But make sure you call them and remind about your order.

hi,

can someone tell me how long it took Crystalyt Europe to ship a hub motor?

i ordered on may 31, but i have not heard from them since. no email, nothing
i also heard they do not respond to emails very well, does someone know if they are in the dutch or french part of begium?

i hope someone can help me out.

Thanks