Re: Greenpower racing in UK - now 2014

[bobc]

Oops - forgot to mention this - our team has been busy building a new car this year.
That's what it's all about - building the cars; that's when the kids work on hardware, get all the science explained to them, do projects on bits of theh cars, and get infected with the team spirit!
So the new car is carbon fibre/foam composite monocoque, we did a proper job optimising the aero - here's a nice picture

We ran the car in various states of completion in a few races & it was finally ready in September, when it won its first race. Unfortunately we very stupidly used a banned motor cooling system so that result didn't count, but it did show we were on the pace. Fortunately it had already qualified for the national final, which was in October. Although we were in the bottom half of the 80-odd car grid, we got through to the lead by the third lap & continued to lead the race until the very last lap when the empty batteries caused a very slow last lap, allowing last year's winners (a car called Rotary Racer) to pip us at the post.
Pyrogaz, on here, is in another team from the very north of mainland UK, and his car looks in very good shape now, coming third in the race.
In the other race on the day (formula F214+) Dougal came 3rd, it was the fastest car on the track but we again had a poor start position and opted to do a driver change pitstop. The race was so much faster than we expected that its speed was gearing limited - we were physically incapable of emptying the batteries in that race - a new experience for us! In this race we exceeded the previous lap record on 18 of the 25 laps we completed. This race was won with a race average of 40mph, a speed where some form of suspension is advisable!
For our old car "zebedee" this was its last race - it can't sensibly be made compliant to rule changes. It did OK in the F24+ & came around 20th in the main race. This is a car that was unbeatable in 2010 - there has been a great deal of progress!
Looking forward to next season now - new teachers at the school (who will hopefully make more use of the teaching opportunities arising from the racing), new brace of schoolgirls who don't know what an allen key is... new car to design (I figure we should ALWAYS be making the next car) and loads of tests to do trying new race strategies & systems on the car.

 

[bobc]

As per title, a school in Alabama is looking to run in the Greenpower race(s) next year
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Green-Power-Team-USA/266037566804285
That's quite a challenge, getting a school racing team over here (it's tough enough driving 300 miles to races...) so well done to them & I hope it goes well & they have fun.
We've had a team from silesian university in Poland for the last couple of years - They properly dominated the Corporate challenge last year (but our new car should give them a race next year) (fingers crossed). As a university team, they've done a professional job of all aspects of the racing, a great lesson to the rest of us in terms of teamwork and overall quality.
http://www.silesiangreenpower.polsl.pl/index.php?lang=en

 

[sk8norcal]

http://www.greenpower.co.uk/
https://www.facebook.com/GreenpowerRacing

[youtube]8rN0HgYcr-8[/youtube]

 

[bobc]

2013 racing season is now well under way in UK; we've been to a couple of races. The new car is performing well, the team are starting to get their collective act together & I'm looking forward to the next race at Rockingham Speedway on Monday. By the way, race results are available to view in real time on http://www.bbk-online.net/gpt/
Our cars are "Dougal" (new last year) and Brian (new 8 years and 5000 racing miles ago...)
Pyrogaz's cars are "Coyote" and "Mjolnir"
We went to the season opener in May & were beaten by another car called "Jet" which has been going very well, though Dougal was pretty well clear of the rest of the field. However we had a number of issues in that race so it actually looked to me as though we were pretty much on the pace. Since then Jet have had a couple of races which they won by a street. Meanwhile pyro went to the scottish heat at Alford near Aberdeen and was able to take home 1st and 2nd places (the Alford track is so tight & rough it's a bit of a lottery...)
Also Meanwhile, "team USA" from Huntsville Alabama attended our southern area heat & put in a VERY good performance for a first timer, practically certain to qualify on merit for the finals in October.
On Wednesday there was the first proper race for us, pyro was there too. 1st race was the F24+ formula for older kids which we were facing the fearsome "Jet" - but this was on a track with significant technical challenges (Croft circuit near Darlington) & we figured if we went out hard & fast we'd have a pretty good chance. So it turned out, we drove away from Jet in the opening few laps, knocking 20seconds off the lap record (really) then throttled back to coast home in 1st & 2nd places after Jet broke down - their car is excellent on the straights but couldn't live with ours on the bends.
2nd race was the longer F24 race for the younger kids & we set off way too fast (this time taking 23seconds off the lap record.....) but soon got the cars running at sustainable power levels. Brian was never going to keep ahead of Coyote but we thought we'd give it a go ;^) In the middle of the race, one of Dougal's tyres blew - the heroics in the first race had worn right through the left side tyres. We had to be recovered by the recovery vehicle & fix the fault, all of which took 23 minutes. Back out on track we turned up the wick as we were a few laps behind Coyote at this stage. However Coyote had a driveline issue and stopped for 14 minutes leaving us back in front again after we overtook our sister car Brian. So we got 1st and 3rd place with pyro's Coyote in 2nd. The 2 podiums mean we've automatically qualified both cars for the finals and picked up full points in the F24+ championship. So we're pretty much racing for fun for the rest of the season.
Best part for us was making a dent in Jet's unbeaten record. The Cullimores are lovely people, but it ain't half nice to put one over on them!
Next race is coming up on monday, & Jet will be there too, on a track that suits them to a tee. We're going to take the fight to them again and try to slug it out over the 90minutes. Given the forcast conditions I'm expecting to see average speed over 40mph and maybe peaks of 50. Last time we did that, Greenpower were obliged to change the rules to slow the field down - I wonder what will happen this time.... :^(

By the way - this competition is not about the racing, it's about building the cars & the teamwork. So we've started on Brian's replacement already & this will be Greenpower racing's first front wheel drive race car. Should be a giggle.....

 

[bobc]

Rockingham speedway race yesterday; hot weather, smooth track - we went for max speed/distance. We managed to lose race 1 (f24+ formula) by going too slow in the pit lane (really) & the winners went record distance (just 38s ahead of us at the end). We got the lap record by 5s or so. Our older car managed to get 4th place.
In the 2nd race (4hr endurance F24 formula) we hit a good steady speed from the outset & finished on a whopping 131 miles, a full 19 miles further than the car which came 2nd. This is 9 miles further than any previous f24 performance and the 2nd furthest 4hr result ever (including the older "big battery" cars and fully enclosed cars). So we're 19 miles clear at the top of the leader board for the national finals.
This might sound great but...... the warning signs are there in f24+ that, while we may be best at the moment, we won't be by the autumn, so we'll have to make some aerodynamic improvements over the summer; it would be nice to be able to translate this achievement into a win at the nationals..... Once again our older car came 4th in spite of an early collision putting it firmly in last place. 38 car grid in the 2nd race.

 

[bobc]

2nd half of season underway now. Yesterday was the Northwest heat at Aintree. The circuit there is inside part of the famous Grand National steeplechase & being close to the coast it's usually rather windy. Yesterday it was hot & still & in the 4hr race our primary car "Dougal" (pictured above) went 120miles, way further than anyone has ever gone at that track. Coyote was there and got a good 2nd place at 109 miles. Our other car Brian had "finger trouble" with new drivers & came in 8th.
In the shorter F24+ race we really wanted a win so we could catch up with championship leaders "Jet". We got it, a good 1-2 finish, made easier by "Jet" not being there (!) and Jaguar/Landrover having punctures. SO we will go into the final round next month on equal points & race on the day for the championship. Should be a good race, Jet maybe has marginally better aero than us and we have better handling, the final round course (Goodwood racetrack) has enough corners to make it interesting.......

 

[bobc]

Absolutely superb F24+ race at Castle Coombe yesterday, our car Dougal just edged it by 20s (after 90 minutes racing) with race batteries flattened so much that the telemetry stopped! There was just us and Jet in it again (all the others streets behind) and the race speed was just unprecedented - we took the lap record up to 43mph for the venue. It's clearly down entirely to luck, which of us or Jet wins & the championship will be decided in the final round at Goodwood next month.
In the F24 race we had a good steady race & won it with 122 miles - pretty good for Castle Coombe. Worthy of note in both races was the improvement in one of our closest competitors, Rotary Racer.
Note all the race results are here http://www.bbk-online.net/gpt/

 

[bobc]

BUMP - national finals this Sunday, races start 10:30 and 1 pm UK time. Teams from Poland (Silesian uni) and USA (huntsville - car named ARES). Live race progress data on
http://www.bbk-online.net/gpt/
Watch out for us with Dougal, "team USA" with Ares and Pyrogaz with Coyote. We should be near the sharp end of a couple of properly exciting races this time round.
There are a lot more good competitive cars around this year - race average speeds now generally over 40mph in F24+ formula (us, battling with a car called Jet in many races this year, taking fastest lap average speeds up to 45mph) and over 30mph for the F24 formula for the younger kids.

 

[bobc]

Races for the year over; Dougal got 2nd place in both races & is therefore runner up in both championships. In the first race we went out too fast for the continuously rainy conditions & spun at about 46mph at woodcote. We stayed on the tarmac & got going again (now down in 3rd place) but got black flagged (stop go). The idiot marshal actually ran in front of our car with the flag & our driver barely managed to miss him & spun off again, this time going over the grass & hitting the tyre wall. Fortunately the car was not damaged but the poor girl driving was properly freaked out by now & did well to get back to 2nd place.
In the 4hr race we went well & on schedule until about 2/3rds distance, then the rain stopped the electronics working in both cars. Dougal was about 8.5 minutes in the lead at this time but it took us over 1/2hr to get it going again (now with all the electronics bypassed). Amazingly our last driver, without even a speedo, put in a series of lap record laps & got us back from 8th place to 2nd in the last 40 minutes - she was doing 30s a lap faster than the next fastest car! Absolutely blinding performance Emma!
So in the end the result was exactly the same as last year (same teams/ cars in the top 2 spots) - All teams had to work hard to finish in the conditions - pyrogaz's car "coyote" came 3rd behind the winner "rotary Racer" - I imagine that they had an epic too....
The Huntsville Alabama team finished well in 10th place in the first race but seemed to be well off the pace in the 2nd. From what they said I don't think they had properly got to grips with charging & managing the batteries - the car was beautifully made but a bit bulky.
Our 2nd car "Brian" really struggled in the wet, using loads of power & going slow.

 

[Thud]

Congrats on another successful season.
I've enjoyed following along on your teams exploits.

 

[bobc]

Thanks Thud - I do wonder sometimes if anyone reads this stuff! Funny day, yesterday; we actually did brilliantly well, but it's hard to escape the feeling that we somehow let the car down!! it was significantly better than the rest & if we'd done things differently or better we might have managed a win. If it hadn't rained continuously we would almost certainly have cruised it. But that's racing - you need good kit and you need to be lucky; Dougal IS good kit, but has been unlucky at the national finals for 2 years now.
Also weird how the cars get faster as they "run in" and you tweak them and get better at running them; Dougal's at least 10% faster now than it was a year ago - equivalent to a 25 - 30% power hike.
This was its first properly wet race & that has thrown up 2 issues - 1) it's an oversteerer ( I'd prefer to give our young drivers understeer) and 2) we had neglected to consider the braking properly - just sticking a couple of cable disc brakes on the front wheels. Looking back at the data logs, with it's slightly rearward weight distribution and the wet conditions, emergency braking yeilded disappointing retardation. I'm not satisfied with it at all & will work on a 4 wheel brakes system over winter.
Next race in April/May next year so this thread is going to go quiet again now ;^)
Oh yeah - new rules are rumoured to be coming (because some of us are going too fast...) so we can't start any new car design or work until they are published.

 

[bobc]

Aaaaand the new season has begun already.
As expected; a raft of rule changes came through; the important one for us was an outright ban on boost converters (which we have used for the last 8 years). It often feels like the rule changes are pushed through by competitors who don't like competition rather than any common sense but ... moving on.... Also they removed battery changes from all races and (as expected) reduced power budgets across the board to slow us all down. So we've been making new controls over the winter instead of building the next car (which is when the whole setup really pays educational dividends). I might put some interesting innovations we're in the process of trying on to here if we can make them work....
So, yesterday was the "season opener" at Rockingham Speedway. We came 2nd on the day, pretty good result: the winning car was "Jet" again (they have been able to concentrate on improving their car, unlike us who have been trying to limit damage....) and they properly hammered us, their distance was 50 miles compared to our 42.
So plenty of work to do!

 

[bobc]

There have been a couple of heats now and the winning distance in F24 looks like around 45 miles; so we need to improve on the 42 we got at the season opener (the car that went 50miles is not in the F24 class). We have some innovations to try and improve by a few miles, mostly in the realms of control strategy and transmission. We've put 4 wheel brakes on Dougal, and may improve these further before too long by paralleling both brakes on both brake levers, but Dougal's brakes are now very good and will remain so when the track is wet. In the end I "floated" the rear disc and that got rid of all the drag - this worked so well we're looking to see if we can do it at the front as well....
Extensive looking at data logs and race simulation reveals that our previous race control strategy only worked when you had a boost converter and is counter- productive when voltage is limited to battery voltage, but we have a new "grand design" to try out.
I hope the new system (the "magic sprocket") works; the teacher who used to run the club (now mostly retired) has been pretty outspoken and unpleasant about all the 'improvements' we've made to the car, it would be nice to shut the old bugger up (ahh... the thanks you get for delivering designs which have been far and away the best in the country for 4 of the last 6 years...) But realistically, any new system is going to throw up bugs & frankly, might not actually work well enough to race successfully. We get to do some track testing on Tuesday night: fingers crossed!

 

[bobc]

COuple of races before the summer break, we had one yesterday at Croft circuit in the North East of the country. We had the new transmission working but did not have enough choice of motor sprockets or ANY split links..... hey ho. Practice, everything went well. Race 1 - Dougal was slow & sounded like a bag of spanners - the link from the servo to the chain tensioner (how we change gear) had snapped leaving us with bottom gear and a loose chain. But we managed to win anyway, with Brian, geared low for the demanding Croft circuit cruising round for 4th place. In the 1/2 hour breaK between races we had to remove the gearbox (Damn - no split links...)& re engineer as a singlespeed: naturally we were late & had to start from the pit lane a lap or so behind the others. The car from Jaguar Land Rover kept going nicely to beat us in that race (we came 2nd). OK - final race of the day - we were all set up now & got onto the grid after a simple motor sprocket change in time to start. And we were cruising it 'til we got a puncture at 2/3 distance. Back out on track, the leaders had been slightly too ambitious with their gearing & slowed to a crawl with 10 minutes to go, so we beat them by 8 minutes in the end. Good results - both cars should have reached qualifying distance for the final - this was one of those races we left with black oily fingers; just occasionally you can leave a race with clean hands.
To be honest that was a great result considering the amount of "under test" major components in the cars - we could very easily have broken down after 2 laps. In performance terms we ran well against the other cars, including a few really good ones, so if the magic sprocket gives us a bit of an edge we might get back to the front of the pack. We'll try again next race on Monday at Rockingham

 

[bobc]

2nd race over, we remade the servo link with a yoke (instead of a bent spoke) and after a single false start in practice, all 3 races ran without a hitch. In the first race we were able to control the race from the front. 2nd race we were up against the fearsome "jet" & they trounced us again (we got 2nd place, beating the Jag fairly comfortably). The 3rd race was mostly memorable for the girls on the startline chatting away and not noticing the race had started. Really! We were on something like 11th choice set of batteries by this time & we practically had to slow to a crawl in order to finish so we came in 5th. (10% down on Ah & we went 10% less far...)
Good news, the magic sprocket kept working all day & controlled the motor current beautifully. We went 3 miles further with it than we had without at the same venue a month ago on fixed gearing. And our mileage was sufficient to get us 3rd in the grid, (and we beat the very car that's in pole by 2 miles or more). There are no more high mileage venues before the final so we should keep that slot & we seem to be competitive with the best of the rest.
I'm doing some battery charging tests now on the AGM SLAs - maybe we'll be able to turn up for the final with a few more amp hours.... fingers crossed!

 

[bobc]

Summer holidays over & the greenpower season is approaching the finals. We had our local heat at Aintree (Liverpool, grand national racecourse). Good meet for us, we won the 2 F24 races but had a DNF in F24+ when a wire came off; the races are so short now there's no chance to get back on track and make up some time. Pity because this was our best chance of a win in F24+ before the final & probably means we'll be out of the running for the championship. The team is actually starting to gel now, with some girls really taking an active interest in the designs & "theory" - sort of makes it all worthwhile!
Anyway, the next race is at castle coombe on Sunday; we won there last year in an epic battle with "Jet" but they're a street ahead of us this year & a corporate team has suddenly arrived on the scene, "Renishaw", who look as though they'll give "Jet" a run for their money. The other widcards are "Silesian greenpower" from a polish university who will also be racing on Sunday - it looked as though we might have them yesterday (before we broke down) but they might get their gearing right at the next race (Aintree is a tough track to race on & they chose a gear that was too ambitious....).
So - next report probably Monday, remember, if you want to watch the race unfold live timing data is available on
http://www.bbk-online.net/gpt/
TTFN
Bob

 

[bobc]

Castle Combe race on Sunday - we had a bit of a nightmare; not a good start when the car towing the racecars 200miles to the circuit broke down after 15 or so, while it was still dark....
First race our batteries were way too hot. Way too hot. Something clearly amiss with our thermostatically controlled boxes - they have been so good that we had stopped checking. So we couldn't start the 1st race until it was nearly over. 2nd race, the motor sprocket grubscrew had gone tight on something other than the motor shaft, so it spun, threw the chain - goodbye race 2. Race 3 we put a stupid size sprocket on the motor (such that the lowest gear was way too high). It never got out of 1st gear, accelerated really slowly and made a terrible noise. Amazingly, it kept ahead of most & came 2nd!
Lets hope that's all the stupidity out of the way & we get a clean run at the finals..... Somehow I don't hold out too much hope...
International finals on 12th oct - yes there are teams from America, Poland, Ireland, South Africa & maybe others. For the last 2 years we should have walked it & have been unlucky (esp. last year). This year we're one of 3 or 4 who could take it & the team who have won the last 3 years are looking strongest (Rotary Racer). But maybe karma will come to our aid & we'll get a bit of luck this year...

 

[liveforphysics]

Are hubmotors banned in this series Bob? It seems like a no-brainer here for maximum efficiency and reliability.

 

[bobc]

Hi Luke - yeah the rules of the formula are "you will use this motor and these batteries that you get from us" along with some size and safety related rules. Means it's the same for everybody & limits the scope for chequebook engineering The motor is a dodgy old permanent magnet commutator motor, but it's the same for everyone. Boost converters are banned this year - that had given us a bit of a winning edge, we're having to learn the game afresh this year!

 

[bobc]

National finals at the weekend - we had a good time & picked up some minor awards but didn't trouble the trophy engravers.....
1st race ran like clockwork & we came 6th. We could have organised our pitstops better but it would not have altered the result.
2nd race was the F24+ class: we turned the car up a bit, but we weren't in the championship so our major concern was to not damage our chances in the last race.....
3rd race we improved our pitstop strategy to a MUCH better system but on our last pitstop the pit crew dropped a real clanger by sending the car out with no battery connection. It took the driver over 5 minutes to sort out. Also at this point it started raining heavily and quite a few cars spun at woodcote. (when we did that last year we were black flagged, but it seems that was a rule specially made up for us, nobody else has been before or since ) After 3/4 of an hour of carnage they finished the race 5 minutes early, with us in 11th place. So I'm guessing we were about 8th overall.
Pyrogaz's new car "minion" did very well, beating us. The team that has won last 3 years came 2nd (rotary racer) and another school that's not won for 8 years or so (Weald school) ran very strongly, coming 1st and 3rd.
The girls seem to "get" that we went as far as we could & that to get a better result we need to build a better car, and they are all keen to get started! We have a design ready that should give us well over 15% extra distance, so look forward to more shenanigans next year! This might look a bit like the design (nobody has seen this before - pyro, keep it under your hat!)