Reef Invisitron - claims 11kg and 100km range

Keyde seems to be a new version of the Tongxin roller geared motor. They were quite fragile and Mine broke on 36 volts in 4.5 miles. Granted this was a long time ago. I did notice the 18:1 ratio on some of the rear Keyde's, and that would certainly provide a lot of torque, but not much top speed. The rollers keep them quiet, but newer gear motors , like the Xiongda, are also pretty quiet..
otherDoc
 
You're right it looks like 32 km/h which is not slow. How long have you been using this motor?
otherDoc
 
http://www.reefbikes.com.au/invisitron-m1-electric-bike-mountain-sports/?page_context=category&faceted_search=0
Somehow I have missed these Reef Invisitron bikes ?
11 kg for the carbon road race, and only 14 kg for the M1 mountain bike with in frame 11 Ahr Panasonic battery .
Really stealth , hard to tell it's an E bike at all
invisiTRONM1ReSize__66677.1405357655.1280.1280.jpg
 
Hillhater said:
http://www.reefbikes.com.au/invisitron-m1-electric-bike-mountain-sports/?page_context=category&faceted_search=0
Somehow I have missed these Reef Invisitron bikes ?
11 kg for the carbon road race, and only 14 kg for the M1 mountain bike with in frame 11 Ahr Panasonic battery .
Really stealth , hard to tell it's an E bike at all
invisiTRONM1ReSize__66677.1405357655.1280.1280.jpg
Click to expand...

Looks like your post was moved to this thread. I missed it too - and interesting read.

I gotta agree with the german guys, a ~250 watt sub 15kg bike can be a lot of fun if you like to pedal. That is what I have been riding for the last couple of years.

Some german magazine just had an article on a "race" between an ebike and a road bike. I was temped to buy the article just to see who won...
 
Somehow I missed this entire thread ?? :oops:
...which is double embarrassing as I live within walking distance of their building and regularly pass there.!
I have never seen one of these out on the street or in a bike shop ??
And they have been around for 10 years !
I guess their whole business is. "Stealth"
 
I'm trying to recall the deal here, but I recall that Annad make the bikes using a keyde drive.
http://annad.en.alibaba.com/product/1000625745-218567348/CE_EN15194_Keyde_battery_bicycle_road_electric_new_motor_bikes.html

Keyde kits are getting much cheaper on account of their shortcomings. But do suit a market need.
 
This drive is so stealth with the built in controller, I wish there was more info and feedback on that system.

It seems the Prodeco Scorpion also uses the same or similar motor as this Reef ebike.

This motor is tempting for a lightweight, stealth build. Can't find any bike shops selling the kit though... a bit worried about service issues.
 
There's loads about the motor system on the German Pedelecs forum. Use Google translate, which gives a fair idea of what they're saying.

http://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?search/1623828/&q=Keyde&o=date
 
Hi everyone,

I am an unsophisticated rider who wants a power-assisted road/race bike that looks and feels like a normal (non-power-assisted) bike. After years of discussion:

1. Has anybody been able to establish that beyond all the dodgy marketing practices, the Reef Invisitron is a fair bike? I am concerned that it's not stocked anywhere and is only available for purchase through the Reef Bikes website.

2. Is the Annad bike a pure imitation of the Invisitron (it's even got the same model number -- R1)? If so, what would be its limitations compared to the Invisitron?

3. I'm in Australia, and the only two power-assisted road/race bikes that seem to be available here are the Reef R1 and the BH Evo. Which would be the best choice?
 
Would diy be an option for you? Where do you live?

Have a look at Keplers weight weenie builds.
 
Hi Sam,

I was taken aback by the speed of your reply! I presume you're the same SamD who engaged Chris Rider on this thread. I would ideally go for a pre-made bike, because I know nothing about the subject. I'm located in Melbourne.

By Kepler's, do you mean this: https://www.electricbike.com/kepler-super-commuter/ ?

Would I need to approach him directly to make me a bike like that one or is it commercially available?
 
I have a question about the keyde motor offered by Chinese manufacturers on Alibaba. Apparently there's an option of 250W or 350W motor. I know that regulations in Australia don't allow more than 250W, but surely this can't be policed in any way, can it?
 
Its extremely problematic to measure such as small power level.
The keyde uses small rollers inside for friction transfer. There's been a minimal amount of failures.

Personally I'd grab a roadbike of your choosing with a 68mm bottom bracket and jam in a BBS01 with a discreet battery.
Cheers
 
Samd said:
Its extremely problematic to measure such as small power level.
The keyde uses small rollers inside for friction transfer. There's been a minimal amount of failures.
Click to expand...

What do you mean by "extremely problematic to measure such a small power level"? Does that relate to my question about policing the 250 W rule in Australia? And what do you mean "minimal amount of failures"? The keyde motor has failed a minimal amount of times?

Actually, I'm confused. I understand that a 250 W battery means that the maximum power it can produce is 250 W. But what does having a 250 W or 350 W motor mean? Does that relate to the maximum power it can "absorb" from the battery? Would having a 350 W motor with a 250 W battery make any sense?
 
There is no such thing as a 250W battery.
250 Whrs maybe, but that is very different to 250W.
How much power (Watts) a battery can supply is a function of its chemistry and construction etc.
Batteries are specified by voltage and capacity in Ahrs. (Volts x Ahrs = Whrs).
Motor ratings are particularly vague,
Generally they are "nominally" rated at a power level (Watts) that they can operate at continuously.
Some may also give a "peak" or max power rating which can be much greater than the continuous rating, ..but it won't be able to maintain that output without overheating etc.
Also a motor rated at 250 W on 36volts, may be able to produce more power if run on a higher voltage.
 
Sorry - I rushed my response.

If you take the Aussie post ebikes, they actually peak about 480 watts from memory, but based on an average number of mail runs they did IIRC then they came out a touch under a few hundred watts.

It's problematic to measure because I've heard of a few bikes being sent in to companies performing car dyno measurements. They didn't even manage to get the large steel roller turning.
 
Thank you guys for explaining.

A lot of information to assimilate for a newbie -- need to brush up on physics.

Another thing I'm trying to understand is this: if I am going fast on flat terrain or downhill, will a BBS mid drive motor assist me more that a keyde motor because the BBS motor is powering the chain wheel, whereas the keyde motor is powering the back wheel, which is already going faster than the motor's maximum speed. Or put another way: if I go downhill with motor at full throttle and switch into highest gear, will the BBS motor provide me with a comfortable cadence to add further speed, whereas with a keyde motor I would not be able to pedal fast enough to get any additional speed on top of the motor?

Or will both motors be roughly the same in this regard?
 
I have another question about the Invisitron. If I get one with Sora groupset and later want to change to 105, how much will it cost in parts and labour? Will I be able to sell a second-hand Sora groupset? Will changing from one to another be a straightforward process?
 
A Full 105 Groupset is around $550-$650 on ebay. http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.X105+groupset.TRS0&_nkw=105+groupset&_sacat=0

Be careful to read what you're getting. It's pissing me off that people can include 3 or 4 parts and call it a groupset. If there isn't a front and rear gearset and a full set of brakes and levers, it's not a groupset.

A full frame swap, which is the reverse of a full groupset exchange is $240. http://www.99bikes.com.au/workshop

I've never tried to sell 2nd hand low end bike gear, but it's also telling that I've never heard of anyone buying 2nd hand low end bike gear. My friends aren't exactly pro riders - just club and enthusiast riders, and nobody that I've known of has ever bought anything below Ultegra second hand. It's either brand new 105s, or second hand Ultegra/Dura-ace.
 
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