Sharper Image Electric Cruiser batteries craigslist

My input:

I have had the opportunity to service a couple of ebikes using these model packs. They were real good at $300 two years ago.

There are two types, a type one and a type two as they are labelled.. if no label its a type one. No big deal, any first year electicity student can figure how to configure the chargers.

Locally, pick them ALL UP, you will have 100v at 8 amps easy, with spares.

I taught NIMH, we will figure the charger out easily. I have had NIMH cells last 8 years with care.

This is well worth the risk and I will assist anyone taking the plunge

D
 
SCORE!!! :mrgreen:

5 packs with 5 really nice chargers (2.5a) for $125!

View attachment bats2.jpg

View attachment bats1.jpg

I know little to nothing about NiMH batterys, just what I read in the time I was waiting for the guy to call me to setup getting these, so I'll take all the help you want to give, deardancer. Should I charger them right away or wait? the one I test reads just under 20v. I'm assuming they have never been charged.

Many thanks to Zap for the heads up on this craigs list post.
 
Put them all on their chargers. but not overnight. You want to monitor the pack temperature.

there is a thermistor in the pack telling the charger that the pack is getting warm, which means stop charging.

If the glue got old and isnt holding the thermistor next to the cells, the pack will get too hot and over charge.

so charge, but not while you are not watching this first time. If pack temperature rises more than ~15degrees F, stop the charger.

charging voltage may get up to 29-30 volts. thats ok.

d
 
we need to shut this down, I just noticed we are in 'items for sale' and this is not its intended "purpoise".

Lets start a new thread under batteries.

d
 
Back to my battery questions.

1. What's the worse case charging problems with NiMH? I need to be able to charge them at work unattended, they aren't the type that will burn the building down are they?

2. Should I glue the thermisters down instead of the tape?

3. I'm not sure if I want to do 48v x 13 ah or what. I was thinking about doubling them up for 48v x 26ah, but I was reading you shouldn't parallel these cells?

4. If we are talking wH, does 48v x 26 ah (parallel packs) equal 96v x 13ah? I wouldn't go that high on the voltage but maybe 60v or 72v. Anything above 48v I would just be looking for addition range, not speed.
 
1-If the charger is set up for those cells and the thermistor is good, unattended is fine. These aren't known for catching fire. :)

2- If you want to glue them down then a glue on the outside of the thermistor is preferable so you don't interfere with heat transfer.

3. Parallel isn't the greatest... but I've done it :wink:

4. Yes... wH is V x ah. 48v x 26ah = 1248 wh 96v x 13ah = 1248 wh
 
Thanks again Zap, for the heads up on these.

The chargers look expensive and have indicators for full.

5. Do I need or want to have a bms for these or maybe just a lvc? What's typical? I don't want to over discharge past 1.0v right?

6. Do you monitor each cell or just the whole pack?

7. Regen ok with NiMH?

Instead of paralleling, I guess I could just wire 2 separate packs and when one goes low, just switch to the other. I'll have to see what kind of range I get before I worry about a second pack.
 
yopappamon said:
Thanks again Zap, for the heads up on these.

You bet... I hope they work out for you.

5. You're correct on 1.0v/cell... any lower and the risk of cell reversal grows.

6. All you really need is lvc... if the controller provides it that should be enough protection. I might have missed what it is you plan on using these on.

7. Regen would completely depend on what kind of power is being sent back to the pack and pack level. NiMH is a pretty stout chemistry.
Can you tell what brand the cells are?
 
Before jumping into configurations, suggest you load test the packs.

Things to consider are that these packs may or may not have high current capabilities left in them, and the less you ask of them current wise, the longer they could last. As the packs degrade, their internal resistance increases. This causes more heat which causes more internal resistance. You want to stay out of this cycle of degrading performance by --not asking more of the packs than they can do while not getting too warm. In addition, charging the packs makes them get warm-- dont use them till they cool off. its not a safety issue but rather a pack longevity issue.

Some how you want to discharge each fully charged pack with a reasonable load, looking for voltage sag and number of AH's in the pack. I would go for 8 amps per pack; check for holding above ~25v; hoping for above 22v ending at 8amp load for 10 AH or 1.25 hours at 8AH as the pass/fail test. give the packs several partial charge/recharge cycles before a final pass/fail test.


If any 24 pack fails, determine which 12v module was the weak one.

A buddy in california uses a MONSTER NIMH pack and only charges at home at night, so the Pack is cool in the morning, has enough AH (24v 40ah I think) to go all day with no charging. Pack has lasted 7 years.

There are advantages and disadvantages to going either parallel or serial for total watt hours. controllers, top speed, isolation diodes and charging complexity are some of the issues to be addressed.

But first lets see how many packs at how may AH's you have.
 
yopappamon said:
The batteries are not getting warm when charging. Is that a good sign?

They only get warm at the end of the cycle.

The thermistor detects the temperature rise over time and once it goes up at a certain rate, stops charging; then the pack cools off slowly.

If the thermistors are loose, they take too long to detect cell heat, causing the charger to stay on too long, then the cells overcharge and overheat, decreasing life.

d
 
yopappamon said:
zap said:
Can you tell what brand the cells are?

I don't see any markings at all on the cells.

I think I'm going to have to parallel them. The f cells are 1c, right? So 13amps. To use with a 22amp controller I would have to parallel 2 packs.

I don't have any way to discharge them beyond the bike.

To discharge a 24v battery pack, many people hook two identical headlights in series, this gives about a 7 to 8 amp draw.

dick
 
Can these batteries be mounted in a sealed pack or do they require air flow around them? I'm thinking of different ideas for mounting. I might try sliding them into an 1.5" aluminum tube. I would obviously have to make sure they didn't contact the tube metal, but several lengths of tube would be easy to mount to the bike.
 
Hi,

I think Serial Strings in Parallel will work fine.

The following info on NiMH charging might help:
http://www.aminorjourney.com/velma-the-plug-in-prius/
NiMH batteries are a bit tough to charge; They continue to accept a charge even when they've reached full. This energy can't be stored and is turned into heat instead -Not good when you have a whole pack of them in the back of your car! To prevent fire in the original Prius, Toyota only charge the batteries to 80% of their total capacity, since it's this last 20% of charge which can lead to overheating (or thermal runaway as it is better known).

I'd been advised by Norm and other PHEV pioneers that a final charged voltage of 238V would be the safe limit that I could charge my pack to. I would need a charger which would cut power immediately when reaching 238V and not allow any kind of float charge as used with Lead Acid batteries.

That's easier said than done when most commercially available chargers are designed to be used with Lead Acid batteries. At least, that's the case when you're dealing with a pack which operates at 238V. A few years ago, companies who made and supplied electric vehicle chargers would not have entertained the idea of making a charger for NiMH batteries which could have been purchased off the shelf. Sure, NiMH chargers existed, but were generally very expensive and out of my price range. Or they were part of a factory-built EV, such as the RAV4EV. But recently charger manufacturers have started to reaslise that customers do want to use more advanced battery technologies in their vehicles.

My luck was in. I turned to Zivan, who make the NG range of chargers. Initially I hit a brick wall - the sales team did not know of an appropriate charger curve which could be used on NiMH batteries and said to try elsewhere. Giving up, I contacted Brusa, whose very expensive charger range came with computer software to manually adjust any parameter of the charging process on-the-fly. Brusa's head office told me that I should deal directly with the UK agent. Unfortunately the UK agent for Brusa was AmberJac - the same people who charge £12,000 for a plug in Prius and, quite possibly, the reason why there aren't more PHEV Prius in the UK.

Fortunately though, one of the sales team at Zivan had passed my original enquiry email onto one of the engineers who, as it happened, had just returned from a trip to Zivan's head office in Italy, where the company had been working hard on developing new charge algorithms for more advanced battery chemistry. NiMH was one of them!

I was asked if I'd like to order a charger and after a few weeks of correspondence back and forth between Zivan UK agents Electrofit-Zappi and various PHEV pioneers I was able to order a specially adjusted Zivan NG3 charger, with an SX charge curve, cut-off voltage of 238V and a maximum charge current of 4A.
 
yopappamon said:
Can these batteries be mounted in a sealed pack or do they require air flow around them? I'm thinking of different ideas for mounting. I might try sliding them into an 1.5" aluminum tube. I would obviously have to make sure they didn't contact the tube metal, but several lengths of tube would be easy to mount to the bike.

You can do that but, the chargers you have will use a rise in pack temperature for charge termination. Then you want the pack to cool down before using. Using them when too warm decreases perfomance and shortens life.

I always ran lots of ventilation on my NiMH packs. A few folks have put the cells in an oversize white pastic tube and put a fan on the end, worked ok.

d
 
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