Using an Mean Well HLG for a charger

[Eclectic]

So I’ve got one of these (Mean Well CC/CV PS) coming:
HLG-320H-48A - http://pge.powergatellc.com/product_info.php/products_id/5150
And one of these:
Dual Display Voltmeter/Ammeter - http://www.ebay.com/itm/20A-DC10-90V-Dual-LED-Display-Power-Current-Voltage-AMP-Meter-Voltmeter-Ammeter-/261549532128

I will be using this as a second “Work” charger. My “Home” charger is a Thunder 1220 (w/ a Mean Well ps). My battery is 12S4P (20Ah) HK (hardcases) LiPo.

I am pretty sure I know what I am doing but I was hoping that the smart people here could help me with things like wiring and setup.

Just want to make sure this works when I plug it in and it doesn’t become one of those slap myself in the forehead – D’oh – expensive learning moments.

 

[teslanv]

That's the on-board PS I've been pining for. From what I can tell, it should allow for Current AND Voltage adjustment, so you should be able to dial everything right in with no mods necessary. And with the Watt/Ammeter, you will know how much you are putting into the battery. I look forward to your report.

 

[Eclectic]

Wow - What took you so long to respond? I was hoping you had already gotten one and could tell me how to set it up.

 

[teslanv]

Wow - What took you so long to respond? I was hoping you had already gotten one and could tell me how to set it up.

Basically like this:

Except, your power supply and watt meter will look a bit different, and you'll have to make up a 12S4P harness.

 

[Eclectic]

Something like this? Set the voltage to somewhere between 48.5 - 49.2?

 

[teslanv]

Yes, that's a very good way to connect the watt meter. The three wire connection method will keep the heat down, so even better than running through.

 

[Eclectic]

Do I set the voltage to the max I want to charge the pack to (I plan on leaving a little head room)? Like 48.5V-49.2V.

Do I leave the current set to max?

What happens if I leave the battery on the charger after the amps have dropped to zero?

Can I replace the battery in the diagram with an incandescent bulb to do some testing first?

 

[dnmun]

you should not be bulk charging lipo at work. i already told you this is how floont burned down his house and garage and yet you continue in total defiance of reason. you never ever explained that you understood what would happen if you bulk charged a lipo pack that had a dead cell drained to 0V by an internal short which is very much a possibility and has happened to others already.

 

[teslanv]

Do I set the voltage to the max I want to charge the pack to (I plan on leaving a little head room)? Like 48.5V-49.2V.

Yes, that will work. Full charge voltage would be 50.4V, so 49.2V leaves a decent amount of headroom for errant high cells

Do I leave the current set to max?

You can, but probably better to lower the amperage so as not to stress the power supply or batteries. I'd start at 75% of full current, and see how it goes.

What happens if I leave the battery on the charger after the amps have dropped to zero?

In theory, nothing. It would just keep the battery topped off at whatever termination voltage you have set. - However, you will want to keep a close eye on it and stop the charge once the current drops down to about 5% of the initial rate. (The battery is pretty much fully charged at that point.) Bulk charging with a Mean Well is not a "Set it and forget it" kind of solution. Bad things can and will happen eventually.

Can I replace the battery in the diagram with an incandescent bulb to do some testing first?

I don't see why not. Worst that would happen is you fry the light bulb. I can't imagine you would do any harm to the Mean Well. - It IS made to run LED lights...

 

[Eclectic]

So my new power supply arrived last night:



My first impression? It's heavy...3.75 lbs. I think that is about the weight of 10Ah of battery.

The next thing I noticed. I ordered a 48V and they sent me a 54V. Fortunately I was able to adjust it down to a minimum of 47.9V even though the spec says 49~57V. I didn't try to see how high it will go but maybe I could go as high as 14S voltages. The trim pots are on the board at the bottom of the charger. There is a tube that allows access from the top and is covered by a rubber plug to help keep it water-resistant.

My meter hasn't arrived so I haven't played with the constant current yet. If the meter shows up maybe I'll get a chance to work on it this weekend.

For those who want to interpret the model number: HLG is Mean Well's high end LED power supply series. 320 is the number of watts. 54 is the stated DC voltage (although the consent voltage is adjustable). The "A" at the end means that it is adjustable using the trim pots. If it has no suffix or any suffix other than "A", it won't be adjustable via the trim pots.

 

[spinningmagnets]

Thanks for posting this, looks good!

Is there a safe procedure for adjusting the voltage, (plus pics please?)

 

[Eclectic]

No new picture but... If you expand the picture of the PS, you can clearly see the 2 black dots on lower right of the PS. Those are the covers for the trim pots. Just pop out the rubber plug, use a long skinny screwdriver to adjust the trim pot and put the plug back in. Easy...that was part of the attraction of this power supply...no modding. It's adjustable CC/CV, water-resistant, fully potted (vibration-resistant?), made to run long periods at constant voltage/current and Mean Well quality.

You do pay a price for it. It's expensive ($119 + tax & shipping ~ $145) and heavy. The 240W version is a little better $/W (~$85) but they were out of those when I ordered. This was right in the ballpark of a second Thunder 1220 ($95) and PS ($40-$60). It was painful but cost effective compared to possibly missing days at work or renting a car.

http://www.powergatellc.com/mean-well-hlg-320h-power-supply.html

 

[teslanv]

That looks like it could be a GREAT on-board "Opportunity Charger"
Heavy is OK, as long as it's compact. Ebikes are not svelte machines...

 

[Eclectic]

According to the spec sheet (I believe these are in mm):

L = 252 (including the mounting tabs, 225.2 for just the case)
W = 90
H = 43.8

If these are mm then that would make it 9.92126 x 3.54331 x 1.724409 inches.

A little big for using the water bottle mounts but it might work.

 

[kudos]

I feel like a total noob asking this question specially seeing as I've been charging my LiPo for 3 years now with my iChargers but.....

How you would actually use this in practice?

(Obviously once you'd set your Voltage and Current to what ever you want)

Would you have to keep an eye on it to see when the battery has reached the correct voltage/mAh in?

Or would it automatically stop charging the battery when it's reached the set voltage?

I suppose I want to know if it could be used as a charge and forget kind of thing or whether you would have to monitor it.

Edit: I see teslanv has answered my questions really, it's a not a set and forget thing, must be monitored.

Cheers,
Kudos

 

[dnmun]

does the power supply have current limiting built in? 12S lipo is 50.4V charged.

if one of the lipo cells is shorted to zero volts, what is the average voltage on the other 11 cells when it is charged up by a power supply with no cell level HVC for protection?




4.582V

 

[Eclectic]

It is a consent current/ consent voltage power supply. As the voltage reaches the set limit, the current slowly goes to zero. It does not technically shut off, the current just goes to zero. Might not be good for the battery if you leave it on forever. Bulk charging a LiPo pack does require a healthy balanced battery. If a cell gets too far out, it could go poof.

I bulk charge to 4.1V/cell (49.2V) and discharge to 3.8V/cell (45.6V). I also charge outside and 5-6 feet from other vehicles...just in case. I check cell voltages every 5-10 charges just to be sure none of the cells are more than 0.01V different. I am currently finishing up the cabling so I can occasionally balance charge the full 12s pack on a Thunder 1220 (since I started commuting I don't like breaking up the battery to charge).

I know that dnmun seems to be an opponent of bulk charging LiPo and there are some good logical reasons for his apparent opposition. When I look at the risks, I don't think it's anymore dangerous then say - siphoning gasoline for your car. If you take appropriate precautions, I believe it can be done safely; as many on this forum have demonstrated.

When I get more time I will update this thread with more info but currently I like this as a charging system.

 

[dnmun]

actually i think bulk charging is the most effective and reliable. i just do not use the little balancing chargers to do it.

i am just making sure that people recognize that when you use a balancing charger and then discharge the pack so low that one of the cells goes down to 0V or close to it and ends up shorted out then there is a big risk that the pack will recharge the remaining cells to a higher than safe voltage. but my understanding of how the icharger works when used in the fast charge or bulk charge mode allows the icharger to monitor the cell level voltages through the sense wires so that it will turn off if any cell climbs out of range. but i do not know the voltage limits. but the sense wires have to be plugged in for this. maybe someone knows different since i have only used the icharger a few times.

i use a BMS at all times to protect from such events. the only times i have damaged a battery by over discharging or over charging, or melted wires on the output was when i bypassed the BMS, so i have learned my lesson already.

 

[Ykick]

It doesn't need to be balance mode and as long as the balance wires are connected to balance port iCharger will terminate any function if a cell is too high or low. IIRC 4.2-2.8V but it's been a while.

 

[teslanv]

I don't think Eclectic is using a balance charger on every charge, correct?
With the Mean Well HLG series, "A" model power supplies, you can adjust voltage AND Current with the 2 built-in pots. This is one of the great features this particular model has (in addition to being fanless and IP65-rated) most other Mean Well power supplies will only allow you to adjust voltage, and the current will always run at maximum, and often overheat the PS and/or stress the battery with too high of a charge current.

 

[Ykick]

actually i think bulk charging is the most effective and reliable. i just do not use the little balancing chargers to do it.

i am just making sure that people recognize that when you use a balancing charger and then discharge the pack so low that one of the cells goes down to 0V or close to it and ends up shorted out then there is a big risk that the pack will recharge the remaining cells to a higher than safe voltage. but my understanding of how the icharger works when used in the fast charge or bulk charge mode allows the icharger to monitor the cell level voltages through the sense wires so that it will turn off if any cell climbs out of range. but i do not know the voltage limits. but the sense wires have to be plugged in for this. maybe someone knows different since i have only used the icharger a few times.

i use a BMS at all times to protect from such events. the only times i have damaged a battery by over discharging or over charging, or melted wires on the output was when i bypassed the BMS, so i have learned my lesson already.

teslanv - large bolded is what I was replying about....

 

[Eclectic]

My impressions (after using it for a couple of months):

I like it. So I give it a thumbs up.

I have not attached the charger to my bike yet. It weighs about as much as 5Ah of battery and I haven’t found a good spot to mount it yet (I’m sure I could find a place if I worked at it) so I just leave it at work. I throw it in the “trunk” (a toolbox on the rear rack) if I think I will need to charge someplace else. I have no concern about the durability of the unit.

I have it set for 49.2V & ~6A. Since I use 7-7.3Ah on my commute, the battery is pretty much charged in ~1.5+ hours (42.9V) but I normally leave it on the charger for about 3 hours until the amps drop to near zero.

Because it has no fan (it’s not an air breather), it does run a little warm. At 6A it seems to be about 15-20F above ambient temperature so I wouldn’t keep it enclosed.



It has no HVC although the consent current does drop the current to near zero eventually. I do not use a BMS so I do check on it every so often. I CHARGE OUTSIDE WITH 5-6 FEET OF CLEARENCE FROM ANYTHING FLAMMABLE OF SIGNIFICANT VALUE (well…other than my bike)...just in case.

I have a 12s4p Lipo battery pack (20c HK hard cases). Once or twice a month I split my battery pack into 12s 5Ah module (no paralleled cells) and balance charge them. So far none has been off more than 0.015+-.

It's durable and easy to set up and use. I do recommend putting a meter on it because it helps when setting the trim pots and it tells you things like volts, amps, Ah and time on charge.

 

[fechter]

I use the same meter on my Meanwell. I like it. I used double-sided tape to stick it to one end of the supply which holds it nicely. Having an Ahr display for the charger is a great feature.