Yamaha YZ450F

[j bjork]

More welding:

When I took the battery halves apart the end piece on the other half got bent, and several of the thin weld squares got ripped off.
So I thought the best thing was to just rip it off and solder on 0.2mm copper.
I then put on small squares of ss to help with the welding. It seemed hard to get an even contact this way, and some welds didn't go as planned
The other way with just two plain sheets, one copper and one ss is probably a better approach.

Oh, and I got this one too:

10mm 7075 alu, I think this will do the trick

 

[amberwolf]

Sounds like it's time to get the heavy duty stick welder out and have done with it. :lol:

(too bad the cells wouldn't survive it).

 

[j bjork]

Sounds like it's time to get the heavy duty stick welder out and have done with it. :lol:

(too bad the cells wouldn't survive it).

Ahh, I have this tig and stick welder:

It is more likely that you black out the whole neighborhood than weld battery cells without damage
I ran some tests on the cells after assembly, it seems decent.
It seems like I didn't get any pictures of the assembly, but I have started fitting the shell:

It is like the cooking programs, it was already prepared and in the oven

I also got the motor housing back from some machining.
A test setup in the press:

Then I put the stator in the freezer and the housing in the oven at almost 200 degrees C.
It slide right in, I didn't need the press. Well, I did then to get it in the right position.
I should have had a stop, so I could just slide it in and it would settle in the right position.

The plate to housing has 4 guide pins so it is held perfectly in position.

Glued on, I hope it wont leak now..

 

[j bjork]

I thought it was a good idea to wrap the rotor in paper when I pushed it through the stator,
but I am not sure now:

I got it out eventually
And got the motor back together:

Getting things back on the bike. I decided to splice the cables instead of having a junction box now, when I had to cut off the cable lugs to take the motor apart:

I saw that the skidplate had already been used:

There was an evening practice so I tried to finish the other battery, but had to give up.
But I at least mounted a front light:

And took the helmet that I mounted lights on earlier:

The battery did pretty good I think, not too bad spread close to empty:

 

[j bjork]

Nothing new really, but some data from last weekends ride:

Power use on the first lap. I think it looks like I held back a little.
Not very strange in that case as it was dark and the first time I rode that bake on that track.
A bit funny though that it looks like I more or less hit full throttle right at the beginning

This was nice to see, the motor temp from that lap.
Maybe I did hold back a little, and it is getting cold.
But I also managed to get some heat transfer goo on the stator when I mounted it, so I imagine that might have made a difference

The last lap, it was on a shorter and faster part.
So a little higher average power and speed.

Still, ok motor temp.
Some statistics from those two laps:

 

[j bjork]

I finally got the display working again:

As in showing something on the screen, not showing any data..
I asked trampas support, and they told me to turn off rt data and just have wi fi or bluetooth active when installing the package.
I turned off both, and connected the computer with usb directly to the display. It still didnt work.
But then I disconnected the display from the bike and just had it connected to the computer with usb and installed the package, and it worked
Well, I still cant use it because it is on 6.06 and I cant update the controller..



I have been working on the second battery, I tried to get pictures but it seems I wasn't that successful.
Here are some at least:

Getting the top finished.

Not sure what this was about, but I think it is that I have to bend the wires from the charge connector quite sharply.
You can also see what pins the small red and black connects to.
I had to take a chance on the yellow and green. I had a picture where I could see how they are connected on the other battery, but then I looked at the wiring's I have:

Why? It is not the first it has happened to me that you have two of the same wiring's, but the wires are in different positions.

Well, now it is glued together and will get tested on the next ride I suppose.
I planned to wait and try it before I glue it, but it is often wet this time of year.
I was on a wet ride last weekend, that I was hoping to finish the battery to.

Not as wet as ggn this year though:

This is from "gotland grand national 2025" or ggn 2025" there are plenty of film clips and pictures out there.
I want to go there some time, but I think it a good thing it didn't happen this year

 

[SlowCo]

Maybe build build a 'fat tire' conversion kit for your bike so you stay 'afloat' on the mud...:Big wheel kit

 

[bananu7]

I want to go there some time, but I think it a good thing it didn't happen this year

I was wondering if you went, would be cool to ride there some day as well. If I get my CRF waterproof and get a better battery I could put it on a ferry to Sweden... kanske någon dag.

 

[j bjork]

Maybe build build a 'fat tire' conversion kit for your bike so you stay 'afloat' on the mud...:Big wheel kit

Cool, I wonder how something like that is to drive.. Wouldn't do to well on narrow tracks I suppose, but probably a killer in deep mud

I was wondering if you went, would be cool to ride there some day as well. If I get my CRF waterproof and get a better battery I could put it on a ferry to Sweden... kanske någon dag.

It is a 3hour race and a lap is supposed to be 25km, so it will take a lot of battery.. My plan is to do it with 3 batterys and change every lap. Start charging the first battery at the first battery change, then start charging the second at the 3:d change.
That way I would be sure to have 5 fully charged batteries for the race.
Doing it with 2 batteries is probably possible, but it would be tight to finish charging between the changes.

 

[j bjork]

I used to run lead acids in the trailer for the heater and the cooler for water and the lights, but they are loosing capacity fast:

I have thought about installing a 12s li ion module I have for a long time.
But it seemed it would be complicated to get the charging from the car while driving and discharge from the module otherwise to work.
Until I realized it was simple. Just split it in two circuits, one from the car to a 12-48v converter. That way the car will only charge the battery and not the other way around.
Then a 48-12v converter to a separate 12v system on the trailer:

Here are the 2 converters, the one with the fan is the 12-48v. I cant control how much it charges. It is a 3A unit, but seems to charge about 4A if it gets a strong 13-14v input. Without the fan it gets rather hot. I have tested it like that for more than an hour, and it seems very stable and keep cool.

And the module, 6,85kwh
With a bms where I can turn off the discharge with a switch, but it will still charge.
A big difference from 1,2kwh lead, that delivered more like 200wh in the end..

Alright, enough ot.
Back to the bike, last week's run was on a miserable wet rock and root track:

As usual it doesn't really look like much in a picture.
This kind of tracks are a lot funnier on this bike than the other though, it is so much nimbler.

This looks a little concerning, I have had knobs falling off before. But I think it is the first time they have taken all the rubber down to the cord with them

I have more or less given up on getting any help from 3shul to update my controller in the near future, so I can use the trampa display. So I bought a flipsky for now.

 

[j bjork]

The display mounted:

There are 2 pages where you see data:

I don't really like the layout, I think it is hard to see the data you are looking for.

When I installed the display I took the opportunity to change the reverse button to the kill button on the light switch.
I had this on the other side before, and realized I couldn't reach the horn button without releasing the throttle.
Problem was I had 12v to the horn button, and the kill button is wired internally to have the same.
So I put in an extra relay for that function, and it worked very well.

Well, that was until I changed settings in vesc to get data to the display. When doing so I lost reverse
I am not sure which I would rather have, the display or reverse..

I don't really like the orientation of the display either, I want it to be horizontally.
It seems rather fragile, and like this it sticks up and down pretty much.

I actually broke the bracket on todays ride:

There was one more, slightly different included that I will try instead before I make a more rigid mount.
I still think the display itself will brake sooner or later though.

I think my rear tire is done:

It is the tires and tubes the bike came with new, and I can see the tube in several places..
Amazing that I haven't had a flat (and still don't) on this bike, probably thin standard tubes

 

[j bjork]

I put together a new charger:

I wanted something easier to adjust, the other ones I have I need to upload a new settings file on to change the current.
I also wanted something waterproof and preferably fan-less, or at least only using fan when it is run hard.
Well, I didn't get any of that

I bought one of these modified huawei R4875, where I can set current and voltage on the screen.
But it also has this cool app:

Not sure what the 2 stage charging is
Anyway, nice to have some data to check out, and some more advanced settings like an shutdown current.
I don't think it will be used often though, it seems like I have to scan a qr code every time I want to connect.

It looks very professional with the connectors in the rear and all, but I am a little concerned about all the components they remove from the pcb to make room for them
Also, xt90 seems to take 6mm2 wire, not nearly enough to run 50A. I ran a piece of 6mm2 that I spliced with 16mm2.

There will be a display for bms data too on the charger.

 

[j bjork]

Oil change position:

The oil seems to get very grey fast. It is very wet now, and I think water gets in to the transmission:

This was the ventilation:

I was skeptic all along, but decided to try.
Now I have this instead:

A banjo with a blue plastic hose that I heated and pushed on with some sealant between, not enough room for a rubber hose.

What it looks like with the battery bracket on.
It goes up under the seat, then back down on the other side:

And ends up over the top chain roller:

I think it would be hard for any water to get all the way to the transmission now

 

[dominik h]

Not sure what the 2 stage charging is
I don't think it will be used often though, it seems like I have to scan a qr code every time I want to connect.

You can reduce or raise the second voltage, on your Screenshot 52V and you can set a second current limit also.
Yes you have to connect always with the QR Code. You can also make a picture from it and Scanner the picture, so you have not to press on the Hauwei every time.
Mine Looks a little different, but you can have a look inside as I opened it.
Huawei pics

Why did you not order one with the nececary voltage?
Does the power limitation work?
I have the same App, but the power limitation does not work. I know the Huawei has adjustable input current limit.

 

[j bjork]

You can reduce or raise the second voltage, on your Screenshot 52V and you can set a second current limit also.
Yes you have to connect always with the QR Code. You can also make a picture from it and Scanner the picture, so you have not to press on the Hauwei every time.
Mine Looks a little different, but you can have a look inside as I opened it.
Huawei pics

Why did you not order one with the nececary voltage?
Does the power limitation work?
I have the same App, but the power limitation does not work. I know the Huawei has adjustable input current limit.

Yes, I see the second voltage and current. I just don't know what it is for. Thanks for the tip to take a photo of the qr code, it is a little easier to connect that way at least.
You can buy a kit with the controller and some parts to convert your own:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/100...1e51d1!12000046075971673!ct!SE!139590896!!1!0
I don't have any spares that work, so I haven't bothered.

The ones I have seen with the right voltage are low current, I think they have been 120-180V 0-17A.
I want something that I can use for fast charging if I want to.
It doesn't look very good with other style psu under though, I guess I should have got another huawei..
I don't know if the power limitation work, I will try next week

 

[dominik h]

The ones I have seen with the right voltage are low current, I think they have been 120-180V 0-17A.

That is a modified R4830 and has only 2kw.
They also offer 4kW modified up to 180V in quite a lot of different Voltage steps.

I have ordered the Kit for modifying my own rectifier. But I managed to brake off the connector for the screen
I did not realize that there is a small lever to open the connector, thought it is only a plug in type. Applied a little bit of force and snapped the connector off the pcb

 

[j bjork]

The flipsky display doesn't seem to work as it should any more:

It seems I cant get it to record any riding time any longer, and it doesn't log any data either.
It did at first when I was testing it, but stopped.
I erased all the small, meaningless logs I got when setting it up.
Then I didn't get any new ones.

I have tried "total time" and "ride time" in Ride time mode"
And both "on" and "off" in "gps speed"
Click in to the menus and not, nothing seems to help.

It was rather slippery last weekend, so I thought it was time for studded tires:

I have bought these very old "Trelleborg" tires. They are small, but I thought it would be ok with worn mousses.
But I really struggled to get them on, they are rather stiff now..
I guess time will tell if it turned out alright.

I also think my helmet light was a bit weak. These are China lights.. The bigger ones are supposed to be 60W, not sure if it should be each or both. I don't remember what the small ones are supposed to be, 20-30W each? Anyway, they all are about 10W each, so 40W total.

This is 40W each, so 80W total. Too heavy though, at least 350g each. Maybe closer to 400g.
Probably too much spread also, more working light than high beam

 

[amberwolf]

The flipsky display doesn't seem to work as it should any more:

It seems I cant get it to record any riding time any longer, and it doesn't log any data either.
It did at first when I was testing it, but stopped.
I erased all the small, meaningless logs I got when setting it up.
Then I didn't get any new ones.

Is it possible that it requires the log file to already exist in order to log data to it? Instead of creating it's own each time?

 

[j bjork]

There were several when I deleted them, it seemed like there was a new one every time I clicked around the menus. But it seems like it stopped when I deleted them, so who knows

 

[amberwolf]

Maybe one is a template (or it uses the last one as a template)?
You could try adding a blank file with the right name...

 

[j bjork]

I don't think I can add files, but it doesn't matter it was user error.
I thought when I pressed the middle button so it enters the riding mode it was on.
But I also had to double click the - button for it to start logging and timing.
It seems to work now

I can report that the power limitation on the huawei doesn't work:

I set it to 1000W and it would still charge almost 3000w.
It would have been nice to have, but not very important.

My Li-ion and converters setup in the trailer have worked very well, except for one thing.
Radio interference
First I thought it had to be the 12-48V converter as it is the only one that has contact with the car.
But then I remembered that they are both common ground, so I suppose it can very well come that way.

I decided to try ferrite around the 12v wires from the car and see if that does anything.
I'm thinking a capacitor on the 12v might help also?

 

[j bjork]

Trying to do vesc stuff..
What I want:
1: reverse
2: 3 speed switch (or similar) that I can operate while riding.
3: The bike needs to move about 1m to find the motor position after turning on.
I would like to get rid of that too.

I have put some time in to reading about lisp, and realize that I am not any closer now then I was before I started to actually be able to program any functions. So for now I am trying to do what I can with what I have.

I saw this in a video from Benjamin Vedder, where he was setting up his bike. He could access this "smart reverse" that is supposed to reverse if you brake when stationary. I cant get to it when I have activated ADC (throttle and brake) and UART (communication with the display) on the computer. But it seems I can on the phone app. I cant get it to work though

Then I found this, alright
I suppose that is why my reverse stop working when I activate UART, it moves to PPM.
The PPM is connected to the motor encoder though, I will get back to that later.
Anyway, it should just be a matter of grounding the PPM to get reverse, but no. Nothing happens

About PPM and encoder, it should be used to not need this "one mechanical revelation to find the index position"
But I suppose it is not used, as I need this to get it working. Probably needs an extra package or something.

 

[j bjork]

The idea with this post and the one before is mostly to get help from those with vesc knowledge, so feel free to comment

I have a script for a 3 speed switch connected to the sin/cos inputs.
The problem is just that it doesn't work..
Here it is as text:

(def cosv)
(def sinv)
(def pmod 0)
(def new_pmod 0)
(def time 0)
(icu-start 1000000 1)
(sleep 1);
(set-encoder (/ (* 360.0 (icu-width))(icu-period)))
(defun set-param (param value)
{

(conf-set param value)


}
)



(loopwhile t
(progn
(setvar 'sinv (get-adc 4))
(setvar 'cosv (get-adc 5))

; mode1
(if (>= sinv 1.0)
(setvar 'new_pmod 0)
)

; mode3
(if (>= cosv 1.0)
(setvar 'new_pmod 2)
)

; eco

(if (and (<= sinv 1.0) (<= cosv 1.0))
(setvar 'new_pmod 1))


(if (not (= new_pmod pmod))
(progn
(setvar 'pmod new_pmod)
(if (= pmod 2)
(progn
(set-param 'l-current-max 1100.0)
(set-param 'l-in-current-max 600.0)
(set-param 'l-max-erpm 50000.0))); mode3
(if (= pmod 1)
(progn
(set-param 'l-current-max 900.0)
(set-param 'l-in-current-max 600.0)
(set-param 'l-max-erpm 40000.0))) ; mode2
(if (= pmod 0)
(progn
(set-param 'l-current-max 700.0)
(set-param 'l-in-current-max 600.0)
(set-param 'l-max-erpm 30000.0)
)))) ; mode1

(sleep 0.2)
))

I don't know if it is written for me, or if it is tested and supposed to be working.
I can change the values in mode 2 and see that they change in the settings.
But nothing happens when I connect 5v to the sin or cos inputs.
I don't know anything about code, but I cant see anything that says they should be pulled high to activate?

 

[amberwolf]

I don't know the VESC specifically, but a SIN/COS encoder uses two sinewaves phase shifted 90 degrees from each other to feed to a controller that can use this kind of position sensing. This allows very exact position data about where the rotor is, once the system is calibrated during setup.

So...if you're just putting a static 5v signal to the SIN or COS input, it isn't going to do anything, assumign the VESC also works this way.

You'd ahve to ahve a ring magnet on the rotor that is magnetized in a sine pattern, and then two analog hall sensors monitoring it, 90 degrees apart from each other.

If it has more than one "wavelength" magnetized into the ring, then the sensors can be 90 magnetic degrees apart, rather than 90 physical degrees apart.

Powerchair Direct Drive Brushless Motor (High-Torque)

A friend dropped by tonight with an interesting motor. It is from a powerchair, and the wheel bolts directly to it. Normally it would run at less than 200RPM, on 24V SLA, for a few MPH on a small-diameter wheel, but the manufacturers have apparently tested it up to 65MPH on the same size...

endless-sphere.com

 

[j bjork]

Yes, I know. But this script is supposed to change the use of these inputs.
Instead they now should be 0 when low and 1 when high as I understand it, even though I cant see where it says so in the script. I think it has been done before, but I haven't really seen anyone say that they are successfully using this function.
But it is discussed on facebook, but as usual no real conclusion. Just some questions about how to wire it and what fw to use. (It is said you need 6.05 as I have)
I got the script from hackey at 3shul. But when I had checked some things, ending with that I had 5v on the inputs when activated and it still didn't work, he stopped answering.