Greyp eBikes

[Drunkskunk]

I mean , mount a hub motor on a bike, fix it with some nifty visual and charge 7900$,you're good to go.

Emaayan, you would be right if you had picked 99% of the pre-built ebikes out there as an example, but you picked the Greyp. A bike designed by our own HAL, who brought us the Cromotor and the Greyborg bike frames. Its not just some bike with a motor slapped in it.
Have you checked the specs on it yet? http://greyp-bikes.com/ Among other points, it's running 12,000 watts peak, with a 1300 watt battery, and a dual disk front brake system.

While its true the single swing arm suspension is a dated design, when you're trying to build a bike for both on and offroad riding, a long arm single link suspension will do both jobs very well. You'll notice most motorcycles use this kind of suspension.

 

[emaayan]

HAL? didn't Dave shut him down 12 years ago ?

see, here's the thing, ok, that's impressive, but where do you exactly fit that in? what market does that appeal? if your'e looking into a commuter or an actual transportation,why not go for an actual motrocycle at this investment? unless it appeals to a market of rich folks who hold jet planes for sports. my point is that i LIKE the "regular ebike" concept (i just don't like them being touted as something else with a high price) ,this is because they promote re-use of existing knowledge AND most important ,parts. here, what if i wanted to change the stem, the fork, the handle bar, maybe get a different seat post, all are valid options for just a bike, if you want to change your sitting position. and with regards to the electrical system, although more rare, what if you wanted to change either the controller or battery, you're kinda stuck.
if this thing is designed from the ground up, just as a whole package, you're kind tied to the company who made it, (and i'm thinking about better-place scenario here).

and naturally, i can't even start to think about trying to import to israel or any other country which doesn't allow anything else other then 250 watt hub motor without throttle and limit to 25kph speed.

and it being made from steel doesn't that mean it would draw surface rust?

 

[maramusa]

I for one think this is a beautiful designed bike, at last a design that maximizes the battery space.
As far as the looks go, any good graphic designer could make those big side covers look good to anyone
That's a decent range

But, of course in Australia with a 250W regulations, it would be hard to put on the road unless it was a registered as a scooter, which obviously is out of the question.
I'm a commuter, not an off roader, I just love the big battery area and clean lines. Would be interesting if they had option for 48V with smaller motor, that way it could still be a bicycle, great range, and a few more gears would be nice.

It is what it is, and for its target audience, awesome

 

[Mad]

http://www.gizmag.com/rimac-greyp-electric-bicycle/29069/

 

[emaayan]

so what is the point of designing something from scratch that can reach 60 kph, and give it PEDALS?

 

[Alan B]

If it was an electric motorcycle it would be subject to all the motorcycle rules, insurance, etc.

As a bicycle, with pedals, and limited to the local ebike power limit (1kw here in California), it can be a bicycle, and use bicycle paths, etc. This is a huge advantage over an e-motorcycle here as the motorcycles are stuck in the traffic while the bike lane is nearly empty.

Then off-road it can do more.

Like many other ebikes: Stealth, Stromer, etc, it has a dual personality. AND it costs less than many of them.

 

[emaayan]

ooooooh, so the pedals are just a costume then... nudge nudge, wink wink

 

[Chalo]

In this case as in many others, the point of having pedals is to dodge the legal responsibilities of motorcycle ownership, while blighting real cyclists and peds as a side benefit.

Regulators wake up slowly, but they come in with a heavy hand that's likely to smack down cheater e-motorcycles and real electric bicycles alike. If what you have is in fact an e-moped or an e-motorcycle, you are doing everyone a favor to man up and fulfill your obligations the same way a stinking gas biker does.

 

[zombiess]

Oh no! something we don't recognize as a car or motorcycle or moped or bicycle. We must ban it because people should be allowed to be mobile on anything but what is considered normal! Just like Segways.

 

[Chalo]

No, "we" recognize it very well to be a motorcycle. It just doesn't have plates or tags or liability insurance.

You can't drive your unlicensed motocross bike on the street legally either. That's basically what this is, which is OK as long as it stays off the street.

 

[100volts+]

I will ride my hopped up ebike whenever and wherever I please and as fast as I want. Be Damned fascist American govt. My father wasted his time fighting in WW2.

 

[Alan B]

I've ridden a couple of electric motorcycles. 300+ pounds, 80+ mph, no pedals. Heavy, wide, cannot be lifted by the owner. You would not want to push it far or up a hill, or ride it on a bike/ped path.

This is nothing like an e-motorcycle. You can pedal it, lift it, and walk along pushing it when you need to.

The pedals work, I can add 500 watts during acceleration or hill climbs (sprint, then rest). Its easy to measure that in steady state conditions.

A mountain bike with a big hubmotor is pretty similar, it just looks different, gets flat tires more often, is less reliable and rides less comfortably.

Some put function above form.

Some hate for looks.

Pretty sad.

 

[Arlo1]

No, "we" recognize it very well to be a motorcycle. It just doesn't have plates or tags or liability insurance.

You can't drive your unlicensed motocross bike on the street legally either. That's basically what this is, which is OK as long as it stays off the street.

My motocross bike does not have peddles and weighs ~220 lbs it makes a lot of noise and will top out at 120 km/h as well as getting there in ~ 8 seconds. I don't understand how this mountain bike that goes slower then a fit person on a normal peddle powered road bicycle can compare to that...
32km/h is absurdly dangerous for a "ebike" I know some think everything on the road should be insured and taxed and pay fees fees fees. But I'm sorry that's not me we need free to use fun realistic ebikes that can be used at normal in town speeds to stay out of the way of cars and make things safer!

 

[remf]

No, "we" recognize it very well to be a motorcycle. It just doesn't have plates or tags or liability insurance.

You can't drive your unlicensed motocross bike on the street legally either. That's basically what this is, which is OK as long as it stays off the street.

Have you ever seen a motorcycle that weighs 108 lbs & has a top speed of 40 mph? I would also say that nobody's going to jail riding this bike in 250W mode at 15 mph.

When you say "we" I think you mean "me". Also tags & insurance??? You're on the wrong forum.

 

[friendly1uk]

No, "we" recognize it very well to be a motorcycle. It just doesn't have plates or tags or liability insurance.

You can't drive your unlicensed motocross bike on the street legally either. That's basically what this is, which is OK as long as it stays off the street.

Have you ever seen a motorcycle that weighs 108 lbs & has a top speed of 40 mph? I would also say that nobody's going to jail riding this bike in 250W mode at 15 mph.

When you say "we" I think you mean "me". Also tags & insurance??? You're on the wrong forum.

A basic license allows 30mph and the first pedal and pop I looked up was 70kg. Getting hit by either is just as bad, but it's more likely going to be the faster machine. So I have to say most mopeds are about that dangerous, Your question only strengthens Chalo's case.


There are roads for vehicles, and if you can't manage 20mph you wear amber flashing lights.
There are pavements (sidewalks) for pedestrians.
Between the two sit bicycles with there special needs. For some reason there not on the pavement/sidewalk. For some reason there not on the streets. Is this reason perhaps speed?
When you look at the available classifications you can clearly see this machine belongs on the road. Even sports cyclists take to the road because cycle lanes are for doddering around on.

It can't comply with eu regs because it is to heavy. You wouldn't be able to reach a cycle lanes design speed. It is not maneuverable enough. If you want to do road speeds, get on the road.

Can you imagine being hit by 50kg at 40mph? You could well be dead. Cycle lanes are meant to be safe for children. The difference between 15kg hitting you at 20mph and 50kg at 40mph is huge. It really could kill you, so you really must be insured and on the street with the other capable vehicles.

 

[zombiess]

All this talk about weight and injury just means that we should ban anyone over 90kg weight from riding any kind of bicycle because the risks are just too great. Think about the children!

Just remember heavy bicycles don't hurt people, heavy riders do. Cargo bikes need to be banned most of all due to them being able to carry such heavy loads. Just imagine if a loaded one was going down a hill towards sweet innocent elementary school children playing out side and its inferior rim brakes overheated and failed because the owner refused to convert to superior disc brakes.

Oh the huge manatee! Anyone have New York mayor Bloombergs phone number?

:lol:

 

[jansevr]

lol what a joke. whoever is against this bike shouldn't be a member of this forum. as it has already been said, Hal is one of the great innovators of this whole e bike revolution with such great works as the greyborg frame and the cro motor. for those people still convinced that e bikes are more dangerous because of the weight or the speed or that this is just a loophole to avoid having the bikes registered and recognized as mopeds or motorcycles (when they are clearly neither) - why are you even here and especially why are you still making these bull sh*t accusations. it sure as hell seems as if some of you would want all ebikes to be illegal unless registered. and even then, how is that necessarily more safe? and for those of you that believe they should be registered, are your ebikes registered? maybe instead of worrying about what other people may or may not do or how they choose to ride their bikes you should worry about yourself and keep your pointless comments to yourselves. if someone chooses to go 40 or 50 or however fast on an ebike it will be their problem to deal with when any misfortune ensues (be it passing a cop or some sort of accident). weight and speed have nothing to do with ebikes specifically - as zombiess has pointed out. and if kids are playing in the bike lane that's still technically the street and could be just as likely to be hit by a car. based on some peoples rational, it would then be the driver's fault if a kid jumped in front of their car? or maybe we should ban cars in areas where there are pedestrians because they are so heavy they could easily kill a pedestrian. can you imagine being hit by a car going 10 mph? the difference between a car hitting you at 10 mph and a bike hitting you at 20 or even 30 is huge.

 

[Chalo]

There is no "against this bike" here, only pointing out the blatant bullshit of a bike that exceeds the stipulated performance limitations of mopeds, yet trying to pass as a bicycle. It's hogwash and it's the sort of thing that will cause a backlash against all e-bikes.

It's a motorcycle ACCORDING TO THE LAW, so it needs plates, tags, endorsement, and insurance as required by its jurisdiction.

 

[Arlo1]

There is no "against this bike" here, only pointing out the blatant bullshit of a bike that exceeds the stipulated performance limitations of mopeds, yet trying to pass as a bicycle.

Wrong mopeds limits are 70km/h
http://www.icbc.com/registration-licensing/offroad-other/low-powered/motor-assisted#different_rules

I don't see how this bike is even close to a motorcycle. You really are on the wrong forum and you NEED TO QUIT TROLLING!

 

[Chalo]

In most jurisdictions, mopeds are limited to not more than 30mph, which is less than 50km/h. Bully for you if your place has a higher limit.

This is not a matter of taste-- mine, yours, or anybody else's. It's just the law. There is no place anywhere with a legal definition for electric bicycles that will allow that definition to be applied to a 60km/h e-motorcycle.

Outlaw bikers with hardtail Harleys may like to go without plates too, but when they do, they are in violation just like this Greyp bike is if you ride it on the street without registering it.

Personally, I hope that folks who ride this kind of bike on the street without credentials get ticketed and their bikes impounded, because that would indicate law enforcement is bothering to tell the difference and won't necessarily be cracking down one day on all e-bikes regardless of compliance.

 

[zombiess]

There is no "against this bike" here, only pointing out the blatant bullshit of a bike that exceeds the stipulated performance limitations of mopeds, yet trying to pass as a bicycle. It's hogwash and it's the sort of thing that will cause a backlash against all e-bikes.

It's a motorcycle ACCORDING TO THE LAW, so it needs plates, tags, endorsement, and insurance as required by its jurisdiction.

Not everyone on this forum is in the USA, might want to keep that in mind. I know it's hard for many of us "Americans" but there are a lot of other people out there in the world and all sorts of different laws.

BTW, I saw a guy riding a Stealth Bomber here in Ventura, CA. It took me several seconds to even realize that he was going faster than normal and the only reason it really stuck out to me was because I recognized his bike as a Stealth once I got close enough to pass him. If I did not know ebikes I probably would have ignored him since I regularly see the Lycra crew cruising around 30mph on that stretch of road since it has a slight down grade.

 

[Arlo1]

In most jurisdictions, mopeds are limited to not more than 30mph, which is less than 50km/h. Bully for you if your place has a higher limit.

This is not a matter of taste-- mine, yours, or anybody else's. It's just the law. There is no place anywhere with a legal definition for electric bicycles that will allow that definition to be applied to a 60km/h e-motorcycle.

Outlaw bikers with hardtail Harleys may like to go without plates too, but when they do, they are in violation just like this Greyp bike is if you ride it on the street without registering it.

Personally, I hope that folks who ride this kind of bike on the street without credentials get ticketed and their bikes impounded, because that would indicate law enforcement is bothering to tell the difference and won't necessarily be cracking down one day on all e-bikes regardless of compliance.

Ok so now you argue what a limited speed motorcycle or moped is what ever.

But you miss the point in the video and the details of the bike.
From the link provided.

Most EU countries consider two-wheeled electric vehicles as motorcycles if they can reach a speed in excess of 25 km/h and have more than 250 W of power. The G-12 has a special mode to comply with the regulations for road vehicles – which limits the speed and power. Still, the top-speed is just a tap on the touch-screen away when you need it.

And because you like to miss use words and try to troll for some more people to argue with.
What they are getting at is this bike has a Legal e-bike mode to comply with most if not all of the world then when you want to go off of public streets you can use the higher settings! How is this hard for you to understand?

 

[Chalo]

We all know what limiter modes are for: turning them off when you ride, and on again in case you get busted. It's like saying "but officer, my sports car was in first gear "legal mode" during which it can't exceed 60mph." Yeah, right.

Just plate it according to what it is and don't be a dick. And stay out of the bike lane.

 

[Alan B]

The other day a couple of guys on racing bicycles were doing over 30 mph in the bike lane along the highway. Clearly there's something illegal about their bicycles that should be legislated. Dangerous, too. No suspension, narrow little tires, just a pothole or patch of gravel away from total disaster. One little slip and they could fall, break bones and leave slippery blood on the pavement, fall into the car lane and cause a truck driver alongside to swerve into the oncoming traffic lane and wipe out a schoolbus full of children at 100+ mph head-on.

We should be smarter than blaming the vehicle for the problem. Ebikes are unusual in that they can have split personality in power and speed. One ebike can be street legal and have higher power offroad capability. A Greyp may seem heavy but it is no heavier than a Yuba Mundo with a couple bags of groceries onboard, or extra batteries and gear for a trip across Canada. It is all about how the machine is configured and ridden. Do you blame the car when someone drives too fast?

Around here ebikes are allowed 1000w OUTPUT and allowed on bike lanes along roads, with cars going by at 50+mph in some cases. They are not allowed on most bike paths separated from roads. Even at 250 watts. So you are stuck mixing with traffic on low speed streets with no bike lane, or having it whiz by a few feet away. Even at an illegal 40 mph the traffic isn't impressed, it still whizzes by, and you get to deal with all the debris in the bike lane, branches sticking out, glass, rocks, gravel, and fast food bags under wheel. Not exactly a high speed lane there. But it seems high speed when the traffic stops and you glide by at bicycle velocity.

You can't license an ebike even if you want to, it doesn't have the proper DOT rated motorcycle components and paperwork.

 

[Chalo]

There is no speed restriction on pedal bikes other than the prevailing speed limit. But there is a speed restriction on electric bicycles in all developed counties, and in all of them I am aware of, the Greyp does not comply.

For what it's worth, you have to be an experienced (not to say smart or considerate) pedal cyclist to exceed 30mph on level ground, and you have to be riding a bike in good mechanical condition. Not so with an illegal e-moto. Wesnewell goes faster than that on his $59 Walmart rolling disaster, which isn't even safe at its 8mph design speed.

We don't blame the car for its bad driver, but we don't allow them on sidewalks, bike lanes, and bike paths either. And we require them to be plated and insured, no matter how good the driver.