police e-bike crackdown

[raylo32]

Well, it is finally starting to happen here. The local news reported today that one local county (Loudon in VA) is coming after e-bikers and scooters. The problem, of course, is mostly kids and teens riding and scooting in unsafe locations and ways, riding in packs, running through traffic lights and signs, riding on sidewalks, hitting pedestrians, etc. This is not my county or even state, so I won't see any immediate problems. But this is how it starts... like how drones screwed up the RC hobby and brought on new regulation PITA.

 

[2old]

I hope they corral them, but very skeptical since they say the same thing in my burg (socal) and, except for a decent haul on one occasion, there doesn't appear to be much evidence.

 

[E-HP]

I hope they corral them, but very skeptical since they say the same thing in my burg (socal) and, except for a decent haul on one occasion, there doesn't appear to be much evidence.

There was a big uptick in small groups of teen on the 20” fat tire e-bikes this summer. I’m pretty sure they didn’t buy them using their allowance since jobs usually build some sense of responsibility. I doubt the parents care enough to even want to know how their kids are riding them.

 

[Risky Rob]

I've read that in Europe, the police will impound suspicious ebikes and test them on a dynomometer. The bikes that go too fast are crushed.

 

[E-HP]

I've read that in Europe, the police will impound suspicious ebikes and test them on a dynomometer. The bikes that go too fast are crushed.

Hopefully they dispose of the lithium in a responsible manner.

 

[fechter]

They've been cracking down on the kids in my area recently too. A few of them got killed. Since this is a rich area, the kids get Sur-rons or Talarias instead of a Super73. I see them riding wheelies down the middle of the street, run stops, generally riding stupid. The cops here will stop and ticket them if they are caught without a helmet, but not much more than that.

 

[stancecoke]

I've read that in Europe, the police will impound suspicious ebikes

We had that topic last year already

Dutch police found a way to test e-bike power on the side of the road

Interesting law enforcement technique. https://electrek.co/2024/02/13/dutch-police-found-a-way-to-test-e-bike-power-on-the-side-of-the-road/

endless-sphere.com

 

[neptronix]

It sounds like just a lack of enforcement knee jerking into an excess of enforcement due to a lot of bad behavior.

Enforcement is highly variable per area in the states.

I live in the burbs. Basically nobody walks here. I'm super respectful, and nobody has problems with me except when i'm on the car road at times. We don't have packs of teenagers being 2 wheeled menaces around. So cops somehow don't see the various hot rod gas bikes around here, which are 10x more common than hot rod electrics.

I pedal all the time at around 80-90pm cadence. My bikes focus on stealthiness. I slow down to ~10mph around pedestrians, and i'm doing legal ebike speeds >80% of the time. As a result, i've never had a problem with the boys in blue, except one time where a cop cracked a joke at me.

I thikn i have great odds mostly because my area is low risk and what i'm riding doesn't look like it's actually capable of 35mph - the opposite of most prebuilt ebikes.

I'm glad i don't live in a populated area where a small amount of jerks, via government, can ruin my hobby.

 

[TPEHAK]

I've read that in Europe, the police will impound suspicious ebikes and test them on a dynomometer. The bikes that go too fast are crushed.

Innotrace controller uses a secret combination of buttons and timing to unleash the power and remove the speed limit. If not applied each time you turn the controller ON it has limited speed and limited power. The Germany folks certainly know know how to hide the violation.

 

[raylo32]

It seems if the police were smart they'd do some research and be on to that trick. I guess they aren't smart. Or they are lazy.

Innotrace controller uses a secret combination of buttons and timing to unleash the power and remove the speed limit. If not applied each time you turn the controller ON it has limited speed and limited power. The Germany folks certainly know know how to hide the violation.

 

[E-HP]

It seems if the police were smart they'd do some research and be on to that trick. I guess they aren't smart. Or they are lazy.

I think if I were a cop, I’d have a hard time prioritizing e-bike enforcement over other stuff, not because I’m lazy or dumb, but because it’s ebike enforcement.

 

[Risky Rob]

I expect the police will target young guys riding fast on what look like electric motorcycles.

 

[raylo32]

That's what we are all counting on. I guess my point was that if they were serious enough in some EU jurisdictions to be stopping and testing e-bikes for limit violations, they are already policing the e-bikes in favor of other stuff. So, they could and should BOLO for workarounds.

I think if I were a cop, I’d have a hard time prioritizing e-bike enforcement over other stuff, not because I’m lazy or dumb, but because it’s ebike enforcement.

 

[dgc]

As I have said elsewhere here in the UK police became very interested in E-bikes and E-scooters in main city centers when masked riders move from stealing motor scooters to using E-bikes and E-scooters for robberies going for mobile phones, handbags, stealing from shops etc etc. Police clocked one at 45 mph in London. So you have to be 14 or old and any E-bike over 250 watts and 15.5 mph will be crushed, if you have driving license you get done for no mot, no insurance , unregistered motor vehicle etc etc, as they are deemed as electric motorcycles. Police now have a task force go into a city for a day checking every E-bike or E-scooter they come across, I forgot what actual number was but in one day they confiscated over 100, a number was from fast food delivery riders.

 

[docw009]

We have plenty of kids riding ebikes, I'm not clear on the age limits here in Illinois. Used to think it was 16 for ebikes, but many interpret the state statutes as 16 for class 3 and 13 for class 1-2. Some nearby burbs have raised it to 16 for everyone, but I'm glad that it's 13 in my area,

In any case. I recognize the gang of middle schoolers that cruises around my neigborhood, and they're cool, I think they've learned to ride more carefully since I first saw them when school let out,

 

[dgc]

Here's where we are at.

 

[E-HP]

In any case. I recognize the gang of middle schoolers that cruises around my neighborhood, and they're cool, I think they've learned to ride more carefully since I first saw them when school let out,

To give credit where credit is due, at least the ones I’ve seen are wearing full face helmets, and clothing more protective than shorts, T-shirts, and sandals.

Growing up, we used to ride mini bikes through the neighborhood. If we all chipped in, we could fill the tanks for less than a quarter, and take turns riding them around all day, wearing shorts, and tshirts, and no helmets. You learned the consequences of taking risks, while the gash in your knee or elbow was healing, or of not being careful after burning your leg on the exhaust. A lot of parents were ok with their kids learning that stuff on their own, probably assessing those risks against what they experienced when they were kids. After all, we could only hurt ourselves lol.

Here, parents are responsible for their kids until they are 18. One thought would be, for things like running through traffic lights and signs, riding on sidewalks, hitting pedestrians or any illegal activity performed while riding an ebike, they should simply change the law so that although they are minors, the kids will be tried as adults for the offenses, but the parent will serve the sentence if convicted. That way the parent can assess the full risk and take into account the possible consequences of letting their kid have an ebike. If they have a good kid, no problem. It doesn’t guaranty that only responsible kids will be riding e-bikes, but it does add a little more weight to the decision the parent should be making. Over time, it may even reduce the amount of time that cops have to devote towards parenting.

 

[Hillhater]

Its also the hot topic down under currently .
As with other places, its the kids on fat bikes and Light Bees that have drawn attention to all ebikes.
But, battery fires ( several hundred this year already)..especially a bad one on a Metro train…and injured pedestrians ( and a death !) , have also caused proposals to ban DIY conversion kits .

 

[offGridDownUnder]

The problem, of course, is mostly kids and teens riding

A powered vehicle can do damage. The solution is to only permit responsible people access to powered machines and then hold them accountable for any damage they do. We already do this.

It's called a Driver's License. We already understand this, and we understand why. The only change needed is to require a Driver's License for any user of a powered vehicle (apart from the already-defined and already-regulated use of disability scooters). And then enforce the existing framework for licensed drivers.

We permit people to modify their petrol vehicles, and so we already have the laws and frameworks to deal with DIY electric vehicles. There is no objection there if you notice this and if we stop attempting to twist ourselves into permitting children (who by legal definition are not responsible) access to powered vehicles, then we have no problem with "modifications" or "DIY".

There is no sensible argument to be made for contorting ourselves into odd new schemes for approaching this. Powered vehicle requires responsible operator, a Driver's License specifically is about granting permission to a responsible operator, and we need only correct our laxities in current enforcement to make this work. It's already exactly what we want and need.

I don't see why supposedly intelligent adults continue to insist that children should be given powered vehicles. Children can't be relied on to behave properly so don't put them in situations where that is life and death, either for them or for others. Children also need to use their bodies to grow properly. Why is this even a question? For the same reasons we don't permit children to drive cars, we don't give them other powered vehicles until they are not children.

The only change needed then is to improve enforcement of adult drivers of any sort. If you want a class of DIY bikes permitted, get off your ass and get involved in putting through the laws and you'll get what you want that way, instead of twisting yourself around in weird ways to inexplicably insist that children should be permitted access to powered vechicles and insisting that everything should be changed so that they can and you should nevertheless have no restrictions on what you can do.

This is stupid..

Edit:
People don't like being told their choices are stupid, whether they are or are not. In this case, I wrote about the various sideways efforts to permit children actions which they are not ready to bear the consequences of, and the weird sideways efforts to somehow blame this on the technology while simultaneously attempting to also give carte blanc to adults do do as they wish under the same approach. Those efforts, to me, seem obviously contradictory so insisting on them simultaneously rather than addressing responsibility and who can be considered responsible does seem directly stupid to me.

Nothing about requiring a Driver's License in Public spaces prevents, say, permitting your children to use quad bikes to herd the sheep on your private ranch.

 

[neptronix]

Who is 'we' in this case?

 

[aroundqube]

New Jersey Spotlight News , the state owned television , has reported on the critical violations by operators of e-Bikes , and those stand on top of electric skateboards with steering that are reported as scooters.The result of all news sources is that legislators announce that they will write laws to address this. If you watch the video there is a security camera recording of an e-Bike collision with a motor vehicle .https://www.njspotlightnews.org/video/push-for-new-regulations-as-e-bike-accidents-involving-children-on-the-rise/

 

[offGridDownUnder]

The result of all news sources is that legislators announce that they will write laws to address this.

I will suggest that the cure for this is for us to actively see to it that we are proposing and insisting on the laws before "they" do. This does require a common effort (albeit broken up by jurisdiction) and so agreement and communication are needed.

But so is action to get ahead of the situation. I'm looking into this where I am. I give no guarantees on how soon/how much I might accomplish - I have only the one vote.

You can read my own position above, and I'll work with others to hear theirs.

"He who rests upon his laurels is probably wearing them in the wrong place." Unfortunately, democracy requires work.

 

[dgc]

It's not the we but the "royal" we, anyway when I was young many moons ago we use to ride strip down mopeds around the fields but we did not go around robbing people etc etc, if we wanted a bike frame odds on we would find one dumped in a hedge, a ditch or stream.

 

[stancecoke]

As with other places, its the kids on fat bikes

Quite funny, in Germany the discussion is in the opposite direction.
Senior citizens are not trusted to safely ride a bike with motor assistance up to 25 kph. They react too slowly, can barely stay on their feet when walking, but can legally ride a motorised two-wheeler.

If you only take bikes with electric drive, people over the age of 65 cause a good 80 per cent of all turning accidents. 40 per cent of them are even older than 80.

 

[2old]

Its also the hot topic down under currently .
As with other places, its the kids on fat bikes and Light Bees that have drawn attention to all ebikes.
But, battery fires ( several hundred this year already)..especially a bad one on a Metro train…and injured pedestrians ( and a death !) , have also caused proposals to ban DIY conversion kits .

I'm surprised they're convinced it's DIY that's the culprit since I would trust my DIY system much more than some random fat tire Chinese clone where every part is the cheapest available. Additionally, my daughter's DIY was built with a Dillenger (AU brand) kit and the battery is still good after nine years. Will be at Burning Man for the fourth consecutive year in Sept.