18650 li ion battery for skateboard ?

[KayWerks]

Hi all,

I have a pack of 18650 battery im going to order from okashira and was wondering if anyone has any red flags for using former Tesla battery pack cells on skateboard packs.

These cells are 3200ah with 10a discharge and 15a burst. My planned configuration so far is 10s 3P but if I can do 12s 3or 2p.

Currently i have zippy lipos 3s 5a (two in series) strapped on my board and i have to disconnect all wires and use the balance leads to charge them indivisually. A bms onboard with a simple power adapter would allow me to charge like the boosted boards charge (simply wall to board and wait) . Any thoughts , am I wrong ?

The bms would push our DIY boards to more pro boosted competitors.

I know enertion space cell uses a similar form factor battery pack.

 

[KayWerks]

If i was to purchase this and connect it to my pack. http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=181929750265&alt=web

Or this for 10s
http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=271803920379&alt=web

Can I then charge the batteries using just a wall charger and not have to haul around a imax to charge my current lipo and have to pray I don't light my office on fire somehow.

I've seen many folks inquire about this but it isn't a popular practice with diyers to build bms onto the board. Anyone that can help me lay out this plan would be appreciated! I'll post pictures of the build in progress so if you're interested in something similar, bump.

 

[okashira]

I have no idea how well the chinese BMS work. I have a couple on order from China to test.
You can also keep an eye on this one
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=76011&start=50

 

[KayWerks]

Wow, that bms looks awesome !

I'm definitely going to try sticking a bms on the li ion pack. Waiting to test a few things before I work on replacing lipos for li ion with bms.

Is anyone else using 18650s on their skateboards ? I know there's a huge community using them for e bikes.

 

[chuttney1]

Wow, that bms looks awesome !

I'm definitely going to try sticking a bms on the li ion pack. Waiting to test a few things before I work on replacing lipos for li ion with bms.

Is anyone else using 18650s on their skateboards ? I know there's a huge community using them for e bikes.

Chaka of Ollin Board Company, Enertion, and another User whose name I forgot, provides 18650 packs for users here who request them.

 

[whitepony]

Is anyone else using 18650s on their skateboards ? I know there's a huge community using them for e bikes.

you can follow the first 2 builds in my signature for diy 18650 batteries. Im using them in combination with my evolve carbon 10S chargers with a simple jack. my experience with BMS is: quality cells dont really drift, I was running my 10S6P evolve battery for probably 1500km without a single issue with drift (checked regularly, about once a month). I wouldnt recommend going without a BMS in general, but if you know halfway well what you do and you check the cells halfway regularly, I dont think a BMS is really required. discharge protection should be in place, in my case the VESC is doing that.

 

[eLDoska]

it all depends on the motor.
for example for 10S3P we take 6364-190kv motor. max loading is 65A. it means that each cell will have a max load of ~22A (65/3 in 10s3p).
enertion space cell is 10S3P 270Wh and supports motors of 2400W or less. so the max loading of space cell is 65A and it consists of 2.5A cells. i guess there are Samsung INR18650-25R high drain cells or similar.
so if you want to use Tesla cells you want to be sure it is safe, you need an 10s6p pack

 

[whitepony]

it all depends on the motor.
for example for 10S3P we take 6364-190kv motor. max loading is 65A. it means that each cell will have a max load of ~22A (65/3 in 10s3p).
enertion space cell is 10S3P 270Wh and supports motors of 2400W or less. so the max loading of space cell is 65A and it consists of 2.5A cells. i guess there are Samsung INR18650-25R high drain cells or similar.
so if you want to use Tesla cells you want to be sure it is safe, you need an 10s6p pack

my next battery for my mountain board with dual 6374 will be made of LG MJ1 or sanyo GA! fairly high current, very high capacity! the reviews have been VERY good on these cells. will still go for a giant battery, probably 10S6P or 10S7P since ill have the room in the waterproof box!

 

[eLDoska]

my next battery for my mountain board with dual 6374 will be made of LG MJ1 or sanyo GA! fairly high current, very high capacity! the reviews have been VERY good on these cells. will still go for a giant battery, probably 10S6P or 10S7P since ill have the room in the waterproof box!

2х70-80A(140-160A) motros wiht 60-70A battery pack? i hope you know what you do

 

[whitepony]

2х70-80A(140-160A) motros wiht 60-70A battery pack? i hope you know what you do

yea, I do .. whats the point in discussing unreasonable hypothetical burst moments of nearly 6kW - Ill limit the vescs to reasonable amounts that are actually managable by a rider! 60A current translates to 2kW power and thats a LOT of continuous juice! :|

 

[Nordle]

Or we can add fuses.

 

[WeeChumlee]

Well said whitepony.
Ah, the beauty and ease of use of the VESC.

 

[okp]

hey guys, there's something I don't get.

for a single 190kv RSPEC 6355 motor with Sony VTC5 cells.. is it better to get a 12S2P (5200mAH) or a 10S3P (7800mAH) ? talking about autonomy - I assume that torque will be also good. I got enough clearance for both packs on the deck... and the cells are quite good, so even 10S3P would not damage the cells.

I am also wondering if I can get a better autonomy with a dual 190kv in 12S2P vs a single 190kv 12S2P... vs a single 190kv 10S3P.

if someone could give me a tips on this that would be really nice !

 

[whitepony]

hey guys, there's something I don't get.

for a single 190kv RSPEC 6355 motor with Sony VTC5 cells.. is it better to get a 12S2P (5200mAH) or a 10S3P (7800mAH) ? talking about autonomy - I assume that torque will be also good. I got enough clearance for both packs on the deck... and the cells are quite good, so even 10S3P would not damage the cells.

I am also wondering if I can get a better autonomy with a dual 190kv in 12S2P vs a single 190kv 12S2P... vs a single 190kv 10S3P.

if someone could give me a tips on this that would be really nice !

its really simple: 10S3P = 30cells, 12S2P = 24cells. 30 > 24cells (30 cells have 25% better range)! 8)

dual vs single motor is a more difficult question I guess ... one thing is certainly true with dual motor: youll have drag from 2 belts vs 1!

 

[chaka]

hey guys, there's something I don't get.

for a single 190kv RSPEC 6355 motor with Sony VTC5 cells.. is it better to get a 12S2P (5200mAH) or a 10S3P (7800mAH) ? talking about autonomy - I assume that torque will be also good. I got enough clearance for both packs on the deck... and the cells are quite good, so even 10S3P would not damage the cells.

I am also wondering if I can get a better autonomy with a dual 190kv in 12S2P vs a single 190kv 12S2P... vs a single 190kv 10S3P.

if someone could give me a tips on this that would be really nice !

It all boils down to what the individual cell has to output. The more cells you can add the less each individual cell has to output. In my opinion a 10s3p pack is good for runs around the park or an afternoon cruise. If you want a long lasting commuter you should build at least 60 cells into your pack.

 

[KayWerks]

it all depends on the motor.
for example for 10S3P we take 6364-190kv motor. max loading is 65A. it means that each cell will have a max load of ~22A (65/3 in 10s3p).
enertion space cell is 10S3P 270Wh and supports motors of 2400W or less. so the max loading of space cell is 65A and it consists of 2.5A cells. i guess there are Samsung INR18650-25R high drain cells or similar.
so if you want to use Tesla cells you want to be sure it is safe, you need an 10s6p pack

Damn having a 6P would be a pain !! That would require so much board real estate. Would the board be using max amp of the motor ?
If one was to only use 3P would that limit the top speed of the board since the discharge of battery pack is limiting that?

 

[KayWerks]

2х70-80A(140-160A) motros wiht 60-70A battery pack? i hope you know what you do

yea, I do .. whats the point in discussing unreasonable hypothetical burst moments of nearly 6kW - Ill limit the vescs to reasonable amounts that are actually managable by a rider! 60A current translates to 2kW power and thats a LOT of continuous juice! :|

This is what i think also, thats a massive amount of discharge current.

 

[eLDoska]

Would the board be using max amp of the motor ?

you can find it in Vedders videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inj75Ku7KXU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGb-zt2Jp9k

If one was to only use 3P would that limit the top speed of the board since the discharge of battery pack is limiting that?

no, it wouldnt limit the top speed of the board, but lover Amp would limit the torque of your board.

 

[okashira]

it all depends on the motor.
for example for 10S3P we take 6364-190kv motor. max loading is 65A. it means that each cell will have a max load of ~22A (65/3 in 10s3p).
enertion space cell is 10S3P 270Wh and supports motors of 2400W or less. so the max loading of space cell is 65A and it consists of 2.5A cells. i guess there are Samsung INR18650-25R high drain cells or similar.
so if you want to use Tesla cells you want to be sure it is safe, you need an 10s6p pack

Damn having a 6P would be a pain !! That would require so much board real estate. Would the board be using max amp of the motor ?
If one was to only use 3P would that limit the top speed of the board since the discharge of battery pack is limiting that?

The tesla cells can take 20A fine for the short bursts, but you'll need to watch battery temperature if you're pushing it.