60 Volt - 100 Amp Controller - $70

[safe]

60 Volt - 100 Amp Controller - $70

60V Controller (Model HK-60)

Rated Voltage - 60 Volts
Rated Current - 60 to 100 +/- 1.0 Amps
Rated Motor - Up to 1000 Watts
Conversion Efficency - 95%
Under Voltage Protection - 52.5 +/- 0.5 Volts
Speed Control - Hall Effect Throttle (1 - 4 Volts) Included with controller.

http://www.tncscooters.com/HK-60.php

http://tncscooters.com/partsdb.php?type=ES

$70

 

[lazarus2405]

Brushed?

 

[OneEye]

Brushed?

Looks that wasy, otherwise a lot of wires aren't showing up in the picture. I only see 2 for the battery, 2 for the motor, and 3 for the throttle. It's missing the 5 for the hall sensors and another phase wire for the motor. I guess it's possible that's a sensorless/start-first controller, but I'm skeptical.

 

[Link]

Where are they getting these power ratings? I know they're approximations, but geeze. 100A @ 60V is no where NEAR 1kW.

That does seem like a pretty impressive controller, though. Too bad I'm already ordering some 4110s 8).

 

[lawsonuw]

Where are they getting these power ratings? I know they're approximations, but geeze. 100A @ 60V is no where NEAR 1kW.

Right, but the given spec. is right inline with what a 1Kw motor would draw while overloaded or stalled. (I'd also expect the 100A max current to be in "hobby amps" i.e. like a 30 second or less rating) Agreed, that looks like a good deal for a controller.

Marty

 

[lazarus2405]

Agreed on the Chinese math. Though, where it is accurate to rate your controller for 5kw continuous, it might not be wise from a marketing or liability standpoint. Sort of like how all of us in the States who run 72v40a controllers with 53xx motors, run them at "750 watts".

I'd also expect the 100A max current to be in "hobby amps" i.e. like a 30 second or less rating

We call that an RC rating. 8) Sure, your little RC plan might draw 100 amps, but it'll do so for 5 seconds top while you climb straight up. Then you glide down and do tricks for 30 seconds or more while using almost no motor.

Another question is how their voltage rating is determined. Is it a 48v controller that will work up to 60v? Or is it a 60v controller with headroom above that?

 

[RLT]

Yeah, they are for BRUSHED motors.... I don't think TNC sells any brushless stuff... yet anyway.

I saw that controller a couple of days ago when I was setting up my most recent order from them. Didn't know if it was new or I had just not seen it before.

Nearly ordered one, but since I have several controllers around here that aren't in use and enough Fets and schottkys to upgrade them if I need to, I decided to save the money and not order it .... Maybe later though, and I'll let y'all know about it if I do get to play with one.

 

[lazarus2405]

Maybe later though, and I'll let y'all know about it if I do get to play with one.

I'd especially be interested in the ratings and quantities of the caps, fets, and diodes in the thing. If it had the headroom for 100v...

 

[RLT]

No Problem; IF I ever get one, I'll post all the 'E-S pron' info like I have for all the other controllers I've gotten.

 

[safe]

I've sent an email to TNCScooters and hopefully they will get back to me about the controller. I'm seriously considering this for my Project #002. At 60 volts my 36 volt 750 watt motor jumps up to 1400 watts peak output and the heat rating is never exceeded EVEN AT LOW RPM so it would be impossible to overheat. (I'm thinking of using Armature Current Limiting at 30 amps with an 8 speed for a top speed near 50 mph) 72 volts is too high because I can't gear it down enough to be able to handle it. (and the maximum rpm is too high anyway... you start losing performance at some point) 60 volts seems like the maximum level you can go before things start not making sense for a typical small Unite motor.

At $70 this is a cheap way to get into a controller for the higher voltage levels.

 

[Toorbough ULL-Zeveigh]

At 60 volts my 36 volt 750 watt motor jumps up to 1400 watts peak output and the heat rating is never exceeded EVEN AT LOW RPM so it would be impossible to overheat.

Just want to enshrine these famous last words, should they at some point in the future mysteriously disappear.
Of course we would have no way of knowing if it did overheat.

 

[safe]

Just want to enshrine these famous last words, should they at some point in the future mysteriously disappear.

With a maximum rpm of 5600 the more likely failure will be throwing a bearing or trashing the geardown. The heat profile is the best of all the motors I've looked at. Basically 60 volts is the highest you can go before rpm's start to worsen the performance and if you lower the current limit from the standard 40 amps DOWN to 30 amps AND add Armature Current Limiting on top of an 8 speed internally geared rear hub you've pushed the limits of all the "best practices". I have a feeling that this particular bike (while using older NiMh batteries) will showcase near the "ideal" as far as motor configuration. The efficiency is very, very good as well.

All my past work has proven itself so far, (in real world comparisions of the spreadsheet) so I've got a good historical reputation to stand by. 90% of the folks here haven't even gotten above 40 mph and this "monster bike" is projected to be able to exceed 50 mph without using much energy. (less than 2 hp)

This will be the LAST of the pure performance bikes... after that I'll be moving towards legality so that it might be able to be sold one day.

Keep in mind that this is a 600 watt motor that is being tricked out to produce double that amount without a significant heat rise.

600 watt Motor - $70
60 volt Controller - $70

1400 watts of power for only $140... now THAT's a deal!

Note: For anyone who wants to duplicate this the gearing from motor to rear wheel needs to be 9/28 or 18/56 or something similiar and it's a Sturmey Archer 8 speed. And don't forget the Armature Current Limiting circuit... without that you will turn the motor into toast!

 

[lazarus2405]

Safe, I know you must have explained this before, but how can you expect to achieve 50mph on 1400w? Granted, you'd have 1400w from a setup 1/4 the weight, and you can always run the motor in its optimal efficiency range thanks to the gears, but how can you overcome the poor dynamics of a bike and provide enough thrust to overcome the resistance?

Not knocking the geared/smaller motor approach at all, but I don't see how it's possible. The various gears modulate the power output of the motor, but they cannot increase it.

 

[vanilla ice]

Its gotta have at least a little headroom. When somebody sticks their "60v" of 5 fresh SLA's on there its going to be around 72 volts. 100 would be great though.

 

[Toorbough ULL-Zeveigh]

If you think you can get power without heat then you are violating the second law of thermodynamics & down the yellow brick road of perpetual motion.
This woulda worked 10 days ago.

 

[safe]

Safe, I know you must have explained this before, but how can you expect to achieve 50mph on 1400w?

Yeah, I have been over this many times before.

The one word answer is "aerodynamics". From my past experience on my first project I know that a "Road Racer" positioned bike and rider produces an aerodynamic result very close to the lowracer option found here:

http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm

...I've found that even slight position changes in the tuck can mean a couple miles an hour difference in top speed. This year (before the end I hope) I'm hoping to have full fairings on all three projects.

Whew... it's a lot of work... I've spent 5-6 hours per day in the garage working on all of this stuff. When I was a kid I could go for 10-14 hours working on this sort of thing, but these days it's hard to do more than 5-6 hours before I get tired.

Ahhhh, to be 18 again... :lol:

 

[lazarus2405]

a "Road Racer" positioned bike

Can you please be more specific? A picture or drawing would be great.

 

[safe]

Can you please be more specific? A picture or drawing would be great.

Go here:

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1266&start=420

 

[TylerDurden]

The more things change...

 

[safe]

.

 

[TylerDurden]

^^^^ :lol: :lol: :lol: ^^^^

I resemble that remark...





at least you've got opposable thumbs.

 

[safe]

I demand to see the permit for your minkey!

(it must be friday... :lol: )