A TC100 Project!

[Bison_69]

Bonjour Dotrick,

Indeed tires make a big difference... I am using some fat Kenda Kraze road tire 24 X 3.00'' and I would never go back to slim tires again...
and if I could I would even go larger with those 4.8'' tires used on the Canadian made SURLY bike from B.C. they are amazing...
http://surlybikes.com/bikes/moonlander/bike_specs

 

[MadRhino]

Bonjour Dotrick,

Indeed tires make a big difference... I am using some fat Kenda Kraze road tire 24 X 3.00'' and I would never go back to slim tires again...
and if I could I would even go larger with those 4.8'' tires used on the Canadian made SURLY bike from B.C. they are amazing...
http://surlybikes.com/bikes/moonlander/bike_specs

Kenda Kraze are nice fat tires with a low rolling resistance, but they are not made for speed with only 1 ply 30 TPI and hard compound. Surly Fat Larry has a better casing, 1 ply 120 TPI, but not stiff enough for speed. It is a "floater" made to ride the sand or snow at moderate speed.

In the bicycle tires, there are very few that are made to safely handle a heavy bike at high speed. The 2.50 Maxxis Hookworm is the only slick that I know, that is stiff enough with dual ply 60 TPI and wire bead.
Then, if one doesn't mind the rolling resistance, there is a better choice of options in racing knobbies. Generally speaking, if you are gonna ride hard and fast it is much safer to chose a tire that has a wire bead, dual ply casing with thick sidewalls and sticky compound. Just my 2 cents, for I don't like the feeling of my tail tracking 2 inches beside the tire in fast cornering, or taking a slide because my rubbers didn't grip the curve. I don't believe motorcycle tires are necessary like many performance builders are riding on ES, but a careful selection of bicycle tires is a must.

 

[Hellscreeper]

hey salut Dotrick!
Nice bike!
Thats the motor of my dream you got there!
Im from montreal too. i see a lot of hi-performance E-bike in the street of montreal in the last years. that give my the idea to built one.
Right now im on a project to built my own E-bike like yours. but for now its a work in progress.link...http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=55541
im not working in the winter season so no money no candy.
But for the next year i got a lot of good idea to continue my project.




Luc

 

[dotrick]

News!

I would like to know the torque of my TC100 motor but I have some doubts about the torque of the datasheet...

I don't have a torque meter, I did some tests to measure acceleration and after I can estimate the torque of my motor. Three tests, 0-50kph and about 7.0s - 7.5s.
I think the real torque is about 66% of the theoretical curve.

 

[neptronix]

The TC100 in the ebike simulator seems to disagree with your graph there; pushing a peak of 205nm on 90A x 90v.
Or 140 ft-lbs of torque peak

For a TC100, you want an 18 fet at a bare minimum by the way..

 

[madin88]

you can measure torque easily by your own with a human scale:

place the scale vertically to a wall, put the front wheel against it, sit on the bike and give full throttle :lol:
with the radi of the back wheel you can calculate the torque of the motor.
I do not know if the controller will give really full power at stall (hall sensors do not move) but i would say try it out.
before the test better do some calulation if the motor axle and dropouts will hold the torque you expect.

or put the bike on a motorcycle dyno. there you will get some serious data

 

[dotrick]

Bonjour Dotrick,
Indeed tires make a big difference... I am using some fat Kenda Kraze road tire 24 X 3.00'' and I would never go back to slim tires again...

Two flats last week with my "Swalbe crazy bob"! :?

I had 3 flats tyre in 2000km. The same thing each time, a small wire of steel, like a staple.

The Kenda Kraze looks good for me... I will try!

 

[dotrick]

Only 63kph on 24s3p lipo. That doesn't sound right.

I have a new setup. A 18FET from LYEN. I did a test at 90A (Ibat) and 270A(Iphase). My battery 24s3P was full at 99V. The new top speed is 99kph, it's good!

 

[Jonathan in Hiram]

you can measure torque easily by your own with a human scale:

place the scale vertically to a wall, put the front wheel against it, sit on the bike and give full throttle :lol:
with the radi of the back wheel you can calculate the torque of the motor.
I do not know if the controller will give really full power at stall (hall sensors do not move) but i would say try it out.
before the test better do some calulation if the motor axle and dropouts will hold the torque you expect.

or put the bike on a motorcycle dyno. there you will get some serious data

You can calculate torque and horsepower (mechanical watts out) from acceleration if you know the weight of your bike with you on it. They make gadgets to do this with accelerometers and I think GPS as well but I've done it the hard way by videoing my speedometer in the car as I accelerate and then coast on a straight flat stretch of road and then manually reading the data points every half second (15 frames at 30 fps) from the video and plugging them into a spreadsheet to do the calculations. The reason for measuring the deceleration during coasting is so you can add the watts or torque used to overcome drag to your acceleration reading to get the actual torque and horsepower.

I figured this one out back when I was learning to hypermile and playing with minor aerodynamic mods to my car to lower drag. Needed a low or no cost way to measure aero drag and I already had a digital camera that did video. Just to measure relative drag all you have to do is count the number of frames between one speed and another while coasting down from say 60 mph to 40 mph and that will tell you how long, all else being equal less drag leads to a longer coast down time. If you do a mod and the average of several runs in both directions is the same before and after then your mod probably didn't have any effect.

I could easily tell the difference between 25 psi in the tires and 35 psi in them this way, particularly in a 30 mph to 20 mph coast down, I tried that one day just to see if my technique was measuring anything real or not.

 

[Jonathan in Hiram]

Deleted duplicate post..

 

[MadRhino]

I have a new setup. A 18FET from LYEN. I did a test at 90A (Ibat) and 270A(Iphase). My battery 24s3P was full at 99V. The new top speed is 99kph, it's good!

Good to see that you finally got it to meet performance expectations of this motor, and one more ebike in Montreal to have some serious power.

Now it is time to do a ride together, so you can measure your torque :wink:

 

[dotrick]

You can calculate torque and horsepower (mechanical watts out) from acceleration if you know the weight of your bike with you on it...

Yes, I did some tests but the measures were difficults. With a camera it's a good idea but I don't have good stuff to do that. I think i will do that with the CA output.
I will use this excel file to measure drag coefficient : http://www.iwilltry.org/b/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Drag_Coefficient.xls After i will do the acceleration test to measure the torque.