Amp/hour to gram. Lipo vs li-ion.

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Apr 25, 2014
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Multistar 10c. 5200mah. 20.8 grams per amphour
Zippy compact 35c. 4500mah. 26.6 grams per amp hour
Lg hg2. (20amp per cell) 3000mah 15.0 grams per amphour.


These li-ion cells are only 3000mah, there are real 3500mah cells with 10amp per cell possible and if your pack is big enough to compensate for the low 10amp drain....assuming the same weight as the Lg cells it's 12.7 grams per amp hour.
 

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yea, energy/weight is better with liion. for skateboards both options are viable imo - sometimes you dont have room for enough liions in parallel to safely generate the currents you need. thats where lipo is the better choice again!

funny that you mention these cells: I have built a 10S4S HG2 battery and 2 10S6P from 3300mah+ cells! :D
 
Do you think these 20amp Lg hg2 cells are necessary with 12s4p because I was tempted to get the sanyo 3500mah cells that do only 10 amps a cell. That would've given me a rated 40amp continuous and I'd only ever seen 45 amps on my wattmeter before it broke. I never found a burst amp/time graph for the Sanyo that would put my mind at rest. They don't seem to publish any or make any claims and I couldn't find a private test. I think I was being over cautious and should've gotten them

These 48 Lg cells cost me 280$ and the sanyos would've been 200$!!
 
think for batteries up to 40cells in moderately demanding scenarios, I would definitely use the HG2 - they are an excellent middleground of capacity vs. max currents. between 40 and 60 cells is imo grey area where it depends on the application, think with 60cells onwards, the sanyo is a nobrainer for most skateboard applications. :)

one thing to take into consideration: the LG HG2 are nearly double the price of samsung 35E, sanyo GA and LG MJ1 (all 3 are extremely similar)!
 
Hummina Shadeeba said:
These 48 Lg cells cost me 280$ and the sanyos would've been 200$!!

ah, thats a fairly cheap price for the HG2 and a slightly more expensive price than mine for the sanyos! I bought mine here *click* for 3.79$/cell (which is probably not an option for you outside europe). :)
 
I'm in the thread u linked practically right before your recent pics, asking to find a burst rating. With shipping it was 208$ I think. That's where I was going to get them.

I'm now trying to find what protection is on the cell. On the Lg hg2 I mean. I want to put them in rubber and am worried I'll seal the pressure release valve if there is one. Seems most cells have one but nothing I've read says specifically the hg2 has one
 
Check out our Benchmark:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fuahiw-FJLqgtYf-5d3W6AfFhiZ8a3FjsLbM79GZI_E/edit#gid=548150658
 
I'll add my grain of salt here... been looking a lot through EVERY DAMN CELL MODEL and battery type.

Depends on what you look for and the space you can get. The maximum weight you aim for is important too.

If capacity is your only concern, you can easily get like 10S6Ah for under 800Gr of battery with Li-Ion cells, which you can't achieve with LiPo. But all our stuff requires big amp draws, be it burst or constant, and for that you need cells able to take it. LiPos deliver that. Some small capacity Li-Ion and some Lifepo4 cells do too.

Battery tech' guys in the main section of ES were disregarding amp draws as most rides don't go above 30Amps continuous. They said that many Li-Ion batteries, for example, can be pushed for quick burst close to 40A without a sweat.

I strongly disagree with this statement above, as nobody wants to swap periodically battery packs or see their packs go burn in fire. Plus not everybody has same riding areas, or goals. Overengineering is always a good safety for your ride. Note that materials inside cells can be prone to big failure above some temperatures, and each cell has a different optimal operating temp which you really DON'T want to go past.

So here is my advice for you no matter what cell model /chemistry / form you choose :

Size your pack according to your power requirement first, be it 1P/2P/3P/4P/5P to achieve your SAFE continuous discharge rating IN the cells rating, not burst rating, THEN try to reach the maximum capacity you seek in the limit or the cells you acknowledged as powerful enough.

This way you will obtain best of both world, quick reactive power, big capacity, limited voltage sag under load and long battery calendar.
 
_eXo_ said:
Check out our Benchmark:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fuahiw-FJLqgtYf-5d3W6AfFhiZ8a3FjsLbM79GZI_E/edit#gid=548150658

That's great!
I wish you had an English version and li-ion cells on there. Do you do any of the testing yourself?


Vanarian after researching a lot also I'm not worried about the cells blowing up from possibly sucking them too much with bursts as the tests the manufacturers do show all the cells capable of much more abuse, but the graphs do show voltage sag and loss of capacity with big amp draws and then later a loss of capacity and I'd like them to perform well and last.

***but I wonder how many times the manufacturers perform their tests where everything doesn't blow up though and maybe I should be more concerned****

The 10amp 3500mah sanyos seem right on the cusp to me with 4p but thats basing my decision on a lack of info
 
Was it just me with poor 18650 but the voltage on my 10s pack would drop off quite linear where as lipo stays high nearly till they depleted so I get more usable power out of the lipos they feel more energetic at the end of discharge but my18650 pack was 90 recycled cells still tested them all to 1.8 ah capacity and threw away anything less maybe the new lico 4.35v cells will prove a good choice ?
 
I have just completed my 3rd cycle on 3 series 4s2p 16ah lipo multistar pack, light load with peaks only of 4c discharge but 4c is needed quite often and for long durations on a scooter.
My end voltage after 12000mah of discharge was 3.83v rest voltage and 3.68v under 60ah or 4c load, thats 75% deplete very close to the 80% golden rule for a packs health and longevity so it still felt nearly just as fast as full charge I can't say it was the same for my 18650 cells it was noticably slower at 70% deplete, the voltage had dropped to 3.5v cell at rest but like i said they were recycled laptop trash i bet limn 18650 would put up a better fight but lipo are more dangourous if miss treated they must be monitored due to the fact the will continue to discharge hard and keep voltages high even close to empty.
Battery technology is moving at a reasonable pace lately so we may be in for a few treats soon with faster charge times higher discharge and ah rates I can only hope they improve like computer memory has but I think a 4* capacity increase will be enough to turn transport on its head
 
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