Any law requiring brakes that cut off power to elect motor?

[Little-Acorn]

I've put together two 48V 1000W ebikes so far. Both kits came with "power-break" brake handles, that have electrical connections to the controller. They work: if you are applying throttle and you squeeze a brake handles, the bike sags abruptly as power is cut off to the hubmotor.

That part works fine. My problem is, these have to be the WORST brake handles in existence.

They are alloy handles, which is fine, but they have fairly long lever arms (distance from the cable to the pivot), and the plastic mounts they mount to, flex when you squeeze. So you get brakes that feel mushy and vague, and the handle gets all the way to the handlebar before you get any real stopping power.

My Trek 7500 ebike had great brakes until I put these things on, then the brakes were suddenly very sloppy. Finally got tired of wondering if I was ever going to stop, and took off the power-break brake handles, and put the original ones back on. Now the brakes work great again. But of course, they don't cut off power to the motor when you squeeze the handle. I don't see that as a problem - I just back off the throttle when squeezing the brakes. Is that so hard? I use a thumb throttle on both bikes.

My question is, is there a LAW saying you must have these power-break brake handles? Either a Federal law, or one in my state (California)? I guess different states may have different e-bike laws. I'm sort of provincial, I'm just worried about California for now.

Anybody know?

 

[mabman]

Yes, read down to bold. Doubt it will get you busted anytime in the near future though.

ELECTRIC BICYCLE LAW IN CALIFORNIA
California Motor Vehicle Code:
406(a) A "motorized bicycle" or "moped" is any two-wheeled or
three-wheeled device having fully operative pedals for propulsion by
human power, or having no pedals if powered solely by electrical energy,
and an automatic transmission and a motor which produces less than 2
gross brake horsepower and is capable of propelling the device at a
maximum speed of not more than 30 miles per hour on level ground.

ESP's California Electric "Moped" Law Summary: In California an
electric "moped" is NOT required to have pedals, and can not be capable
of traveling at speeds above 30 mph on level ground on the motors
power only. Mopeds require obtaining a one time licence plate and
registration card at the DMV. Moped licencing in California is only $6.00
and never expires or needs to be re-registered. Drivers must obey all
rules of the road, wear a DOT approved motorcycle helmet, and be over
16 years old with a valid learners permit or drivers licence. No insurance
is required.
(b) A "motorized bicycle" is also a device that has fully operative pedals
for propulsion by human power and has an electric motor that meets all
of the following requirements:

(1) Has a power output of not more than 1,000 watts.(2) Is incapable of
propelling the device at a speed of more than 20 miles per hour on
ground level.
(3) Is incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human
power is used to propel the motorized bicycle faster than 20 miles per
hour.
SEC. 3. Section 24016 is added to the Vehicle Code, to read:

24016. (a) A motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406
shall meet the following criteria:

(1) Comply with the equipment and manufacturing requirements for
bicycles adopted by the Consumer Product Safety Commission or the
requirements adopted by the National Highway Traffic Safety
Administration in accordance with the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle
Safety Act of 1966 for motor driven cycles.

(2) Operate in a manner so that the electric motor is disengaged or
ceases to function
when the brakes are applied, or operate in a manner such that the motor
is engaged
through a switch or mechanism that, when released, will cause the
electric motor to
disengage or cease to function.
(b) All of the following apply to a motorized bicycle described in
subdivision (b) of Section
406:
(1) No person shall operate a motorized bicycle unless the person is wearing a properly
fitted and fastened bicycle helmet that meets the standards described in Section 21212.
(2) A person operating a motorized bicycle is subject to Sections 21200 and 21200.5.
(3) A person operating a motorized bicycle is not subject to the provisions of this code
relating to financial responsibility, driver's licenses, registration, and license plate
requirements, and a motorized bicycle is not a motor vehicle.
(4) A motorized bicycle shall only be operated by a person 16 years of age or older.
ESP's California Electric Bicycle Law Summary: In California an
electric "bicycle" needs to have fully operational pedals, can not be
capable of traveling at speeds over 20 mph on level ground using the
motors power only, and must have under 1000 Watts of motor power
output. Drivers must obey all rules of the road, wear a bicycle helmet,
and be over 16 years old. No insurance is required. No driver license or
vehicle licensing or registration is required.

 

[Rassy]

Well, not exactly. If you read that sentence carefully there is an "or" in the middle of it. The second option describes a throttle that returns to "no power" when released.

 

[Little-Acorn]

Hmmm, found a partial answer to my own question:

From Calif. DMV code online:

24016. (a) A motorized bicycle described in subdivision (b) of Section 406 shall meet the following criteria:
(1) Comply with the equipment and manufacturing requirements for bicycles adopted by the Consumer
Product Safety Commission (16 C.F.R. 1512.1, et seq.) or the requirements adopted by the National Highway
Traffic Safety Administration (49 C.F.R. 571.1, et seq.) in accordance with the National Traffic and Motor
Vehicle Safety Act of 1966 (15 U.S.C. Sec. 1381, et seq.) for motor driven cycles.
(2) Operate in a manner so that the electric motor is disengaged or ceases to function when the brakes are
applied, or operate in a manner such that the motor is engaged through a switch or mechanism that, when
released, will cause the electric motor to disengage or cease to function.

Looks to me like this says that you must EITHER have power-break brake handles, OR have a throttle that cuts off power if you let go of it. Either of these makes the bike legal. So no, you don't have to have power-break brake handles, if your ebike has a throttle with a spring on it that goes to zero-power. As both of my ebikes (with thumb throttles) do.

But, inevitably, there's another twist thrown in. Note that the first part I boldfaced, refers to "subdivision (b) of Section 406". That's the section of Calif. law that says a motorized bicycle is one with a top speed of 20mph, and certain other restrictions.

But Section 406 also has a "Subdivision (a)". And THAT part describes "motorized bicycles" with a top speed of 30mph... which happens to be the part my ebikes fit. Yes, Califonia law defines two different kinds of ebikes: the 20mph ones that need no license, registration, insurance etc.... and also a 30mph ebike that DOES require you to get a "M2" license (Moped license), register the ebike with DMV, etc.

And I don't know if this part of the law describing brakes that cut off power, is supposed to apply to the 30mph bikes, or just the 20mph bikes. Sounds like just the 20mph bikes, is my guess.

I guess it's asking too much, for this to be easy.

 

[biohazardman]

I figured there was a law like that some place. Still it's a good safety item to have. Several of us ran off for tests before we had them and it was not pretty with the throttle stuck at full. You don't want to be there. My first bike did a burnout up the cupboards in the kitchen and ruined the floor other bike incident below. If you don’t like the nasty levers included in the kits you can pull out the switches and put them somewhere else or use a reed switch and small magnet to do the same job. It would be my suggestion, and that of others as they gave me a hard time for not having one, that you install a brake cutout switch of some kind. Be creative there are many ways to do the brake cut off switch. Some help below.


http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=12347&p=184633&hilit=+reed#p184633

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=11760&p=178600&hilit=+reed#p178600

 

[Lyen]

Well, not exactly. If you read that sentence carefully there is an "or" in the middle of it. The second option describes a throttle that returns to "no power" when released.

You beat me on this one. Yes also agreed the "OR" in the sentence is legit. I communicate to work with my ebike in San Francisco since 2007 and have no electric cut off on my brakes. I believe it is actually safer because from my past experience that most switches on the ebike brakes tend to be quite sensitive and easy to trigger. I usually have my fingers on the brakes most of the time at high speed to expect the unexpected to happen. So a sudden bump when hitting a pot hole would disengage the throttle while an 18 wheelers is behind is not nice to happen.

 

[amberwolf]

There is an easy fix to the cutoff problem. Find some of those magnetic reed switch sensors used for security systems on doors and windows, and affix it to your favorite brake lever mounting. Affix a magnet to the lever itself, so that when the handle is not in use the switch allows the motor to run, and when it is pulled even a little that the motor is cut off.

This does work; I did it on my bike for a while, except all I had were the bare reed switches out of an old keyboard, and I managed to break them often enough (usually while working on the bike, rather than riding it) that I just left them off eventually.

I will still put them back on there once I find (or make) some enclosed switches, or once I get around to sorting thru the hall sensors I pulled off of a bunch of computer case fans with bad bearings; most of them are switch-type sensors, so they'll work great for brake controls, and be smaller and less destructible than the reed switches.

 

[Toorbough ULL-Zeveigh]

try potting the reed switch under a blob of epoxy if u haven't already.
also mounted on the underside of the lever might make it less vulnerable.

 

[amberwolf]

I tried a number of ways of using them, but without a shell around them that gives them space, anything that encapsulates them just passes the outside load onto the hollow glass tube. Press in the right (wrong) spot and it'll crack anyway. Sometimes with the epoxy or other material around it, it'll stay together, but little glass bits end up floating around in there and stopping the reed from closing correctly every time. At least, that's what I assume the failure mechanism is, since it's intermittent and it happens even with the entire lead length and exit wires encapsulated as well.

I'd need to put them in a little box like the security sensors are, suspended by their leads and the wires leading in, which would themselves be glued down (silicone, probably) at their exit points. Then it wouldn't break unless I crushed the box, which probably wouldn't happen.

As for placement, my bars are not flat, but rather are cruiser bars (from a Schwinn postal bike) run vertically, so the grips are more like semi-vertical posts. If I put things on the inside of the brake levers, I end up hitting them with tools and stuff as I manhandle the bike around when I'm working on it. If I have them on the outside, I bang them into things when moving the bike. I'm just clumsy and forgetful (and easily distracted by one or more of the five dogs), so I have to try to "me-proof" things.

 

[number1cruncher]

I use my original lever for the front wheel (left side) and a cut-off lever for the rearwheel(right-side). All the stopping power is in the front with the good lever. In an emergency, my instinct is to grab both levers, cutting the power and giving me good stopping power. Best of both worlds. Plus I have a backup cut-off lever when I break this one.

Bryan

 

[Dingo2024]

I bought a set of these (which are ALL alloy last week) if you dont want to modify your existing levers

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/motor-cut-safety-brakes-for-electric-bike-scooter_W0QQitemZ220537586078QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Sporting_Goods_Scooters_LE?hash=item335910819e

and seem pretty good...only cost me £5 (about $8 US)

Ian

 

[PeteCress]

Does anybody think there is a real-world benefit from brake cutoff switches?

I've already removed one bc I was uncomfortable with the possibility of losing my main brake if/when that funky pot-metal lever failed.

I'm now thinking about removing the other one bco several instances I've had where I unknowingly had my thumb on the throttle while braking and releasing the brake resulted in an unexpected surge.

The only reason I can think of for having them is the possibility of a jammed/malfunctioning throttle, and that seems like a very good reason unless braking can overcome a 500w+ motor at full throttle long enough to stop the bike and have the rider raise the front (FWD) wheel.

Is the malfunctioning/jammed throttle scenario realistic?

 

[biohazardman]

Does anybody think there is a real-world benefit from brake cutoff switches?

I've already removed one bc I was uncomfortable with the possibility of losing my main brake if/when that funky pot-metal lever failed.

I'm now thinking about removing the other one bco several instances I've had where I unknowingly had my thumb on the throttle while braking and releasing the brake resulted in an unexpected surge.

The only reason I can think of for having them is the possibility of a jammed/malfunctioning throttle, and that seems like a very good reason unless braking can overcome a 500w+ motor at full throttle long enough to stop the bike and have the rider raise the front (FWD) wheel.

Is the malfunctioning/jammed throttle scenario realistic?

Full throttle mishaps happen to some if not many of us. Two times with me thus far in about 3K miles so is a good safety item. Those of us with gear motors can trash them fast without a cut of switch. I ran my 500W DD without one cuz my brakes had no problem overcoming the motor. But have seen the light and will not do that again. Only takes a couple of seconds for a full throttle incident to put you in the road where you don't want to be. Had a car pull out in front of me yesterday when I was doing 25mph and had to panic stop, skidding some feet, to avoid broadsiding him. It was a close one and any extra throttle at that time would have put me into the side of his car. I have not yet seen a zinc, usually referred to as pot metal, brake lever. All of those I have seen are cast aluminum, which is much stronger. That's not to say they don't exist just that most of the cheap junk we get with our e-bike kits are aluminum like the good ones we replace them with.

 

[PeteCress]

Full throttle mishaps happen to some if not many of us...

Since my previous post, I discovered the "Brake Shut-Off, How Important?" thread at http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14066

Now I'm a believer.

But I think I will look into some sort of retrofit for my "real" brake levers.

Some weeks ago, I saw this: http://www.bike-eu.com/products/3654/sng-launched-universal-e-bike-stop-for-brake-levers.html

Sounded promising, but when I tried to track down a retailer, no luck.

 

[mabman]

I just plumbed the cutout leads in to a push button switch that I was not using on my throttle. It is right there and easy to activate. Plus with it pushed in the motor cannot be activated by the controller so it makes a little bit of a failsafe device in case someone idly hits the throttle and is not prepared for the bike to go whooooosh.

I do like that SNG part though and have sent along a mail to my guy in Taiwan to see if he can track it down.

 

[mabman]

I got a response from Taiwan about the SNG connector. It looks like they are not available in the US at this time. They look like a pretty clean setup though that allows for brake cable adjustment which is good. Both sides go into a sealed junction block and come out to a 2 pin connector which should mate up well. They are only for mechanical brakes but will work for all types of that nature. I am having a sample sent to me and will report back on my findings after I receive them.

 

[PeteCress]

...looks like they are not available in the US at this time. ... having a sample sent ...

Any word on the sample yet?

If they're any good and you have too many to use, maybe I could buy a couple, two-three....