OCD Garage
100 W
About six months ago I bought 2 LiFePo4 batteries from Golden Motor Canada but have only just noticed that the chargers say LiIon not LifePo4, are they interchangeable?
Thanks
Thanks
Are LiIon chargers okay for LiFePo4
- Thread starter OCD Garage
- Start date
In some cases they will be suitable. It depends on how the BMS balances the cells. i.e. at what voltage range the bleed resistors are open. With LiFePO4, you normally need 3.65v per cell to balance, which makes 43.8v total for a 36v battery. For most other chemistries, it's 4.2v per cell, which is a total of 42v. For 48v batteries, it's 58.4v and 54.6v.
Your first step should be to measure the actual voltage of the charger. Many are adjusted by a simple screw inside, so even if it's marked as 42.0v or 54.6v, it might still be higher.
Your first step should be to measure the actual voltage of the charger. Many are adjusted by a simple screw inside, so even if it's marked as 42.0v or 54.6v, it might still be higher.
arkmundi
10 MW
Battery chargers are by voltage and amperage. A chemistry specific charger, like the one I use, a Smart Charger from batteryspace.com, like a BMS, has a circuit board controlling various aspects of the charging process. That includes both a high amperage initial charge and a low amperage trickle charge at the end to bring the battery to 100% SOC. The chemistry of a battery is important in determining 100% SOC as well as max amperage. You don't want to exceed 100% SOC. So for my setup, using LiFePO4 at 36V nominal, max voltage is 12S x 3.65V or ~43V, charging at 6 amps. I usually get a final charge of around 41V because there are additional parameters in the setup of the charger. I run without a BMS, opting for careful monitoring of my pack and use of a Smart Chargers as described. So, just insure your charger will not over-charge your battery and you'll be OK.
OCD Garage
100 W
Thanks for the replies;
My chargers are labelled 58volts, but also say on the side to use for Li Ion only which concerned me, just trying to make sure Golden Motor did not send the wrong chargers with the shipment. Originally, I was sent only one of two batteries I ordered, which Gary blamed on his children helping him with shipping. I don't want to ruin 3 batteries for a mistake on the part of the seller.
Thanks
My chargers are labelled 58volts, but also say on the side to use for Li Ion only which concerned me, just trying to make sure Golden Motor did not send the wrong chargers with the shipment. Originally, I was sent only one of two batteries I ordered, which Gary blamed on his children helping him with shipping. I don't want to ruin 3 batteries for a mistake on the part of the seller.
Thanks
Ypedal
100 TW
Lifepo4 is Lithium Ion, just a different type of lithium cell... if the charger was send with the batteries in question, i would expect the voltage profile to be set correctly, but this is Golden Motor we are talking about, so i would highly recommend double checking just in case . :wink:
made_in_the_alps_legacy
10 kW
Thxs, long story made shortKiriakos GR said:
agniusm
1 MW
+1Ypedal said:
made_in_the_alps_legacy
10 kW
would you please state which nominal voltage rules for Lifepo4 and LiIon ?agniusm said:
(In Kiriakos link, it says : Li-ion is 4.20V, LiFePO4 is 3.65V, so I seek for clarifications...)
Ypedal
100 TW
Nominal = average working voltage
Li Cobalt / Manganese / etc.. = 3.7v
Lifepo4 = 3.2v
Li Cobalt / Manganese / etc.. = 3.7v
Lifepo4 = 3.2v
OCD Garage
100 W
Thank you to everyone for your opinions and advise. The charger is indeed 58.4v, as someone stated it is GM we're talking about, didn't want to take a chance with $$$ worth of LiFePo4 batteries. :wink:
Alan
Alan
made_in_the_alps_legacy
10 kW
OCD said:
I still feel confused reading along this topic... I have had a similar issue ( http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=63055 )
and I was brought under the impression that a
13s LiIon pack should be charged up to 54.6V,
16s LiFePo4 pack should be charged up to 58.4V
so... 58.4V for a charger marked as "LiIon only charger" would (somehow) make sens if it was orginally intented to charge a 14s LiIon pack ?
of course, in your case, you seem fine to use that charger for a 16s LiFePo4 pack...
dnmun
1 PW
lifepo4 BMSs are now built with the balancing voltage at 3.60V/cell so a 48V lifepo4 charger should have about 57.6V on the output.
for 14S of liion it will charge to 4.2V/cell and that is 58.8V, but most 48V liion batteries are 13S and charge to 54.6V
for 14S of liion it will charge to 4.2V/cell and that is 58.8V, but most 48V liion batteries are 13S and charge to 54.6V
made_in_the_alps_legacy
10 kW
ok, thxs,
I think I got it now (assuming I / we will never know why his 58.4V charger was labelled as a "LiIon only" battery charger
)
I think I got it now (assuming I / we will never know why his 58.4V charger was labelled as a "LiIon only" battery charger
)dnmun
1 PW
it doesn't matter. it is a golden motor battery and will be dead in a few months anyway.
Ypedal
100 TW
dnmun said:
Not always, i've gotten my hands on a few and on occasion you get a pretty good pack.. just not much consistency.
dnmun
1 PW
i rank them right next to Vpower. we don't see many complaints recently though. they don't seem to attract the insane haters like the sunthing guy though.
OCD Garage
100 W
So far I've gotten about four years of daily use from my V-power 48 volt 20amp pack, I must have received one made on a tuesday or wednesday. On the plus side, I see the price gap between a Ping pack and a V-power pack has narrowed in the last couple of years and there's no disputing which one is better.
The response re: "Li Ion only" from the Golden Motor forum is both battery formulas are Li Ion (with slightly different voltages) the intent was to warn people not to use with lead acid or other formulas.
The response re: "Li Ion only" from the Golden Motor forum is both battery formulas are Li Ion (with slightly different voltages) the intent was to warn people not to use with lead acid or other formulas.
