Battery indicator and speedometer Xtreme BX-700Li

[ProDigit]

I've also read that the battery indicator is not very accurate on this bike.
I've seen some guys plugging in multimeters.
I don't want to plug in a multimeter, is there some easy and cheap mod that is generally recommended for the speed (bicycle speedometer I guess) and battery indicator?

Thank you.

Also, I've read some people complain that the speedometer is not tuned correctly.
How can one fine-adjust it to display the speed correctly?

Thank you!

 

[dogman dan]

Best but not cheap thing you could do is buy a stand alone cycleanalyst. It would give you great battery data, Ah used, watts, wh/mi or wh/km.

It comes with a built in speedo, that you could calibrate to your wheel size. Measure the tire along the top of the tread, to get the distance in mm. Then enter that number in the speedo set up menu. That works for a CA or a bike speedo.

A voltmeter, multimeter or such could just tell you volts, and you could judge battery level more accurately by voltage.

You could get a less expensive wattmeter than a CA. Generally limited to 60v or less with that.

 

[ProDigit]

But a wattmeter, won't it be nearly the same as the internal meter?
Let's say with an extension battery, the internal meter shows 75% battery left (measuring the voltage only I presume), before the bike's limiter kicks in. It's not very precise, but at least I have some sort of an idea too (just drive around until 75%), I understand when accelerating, that the voltage will drop more than when driving.

 

[Alastor]

I will tell you my experience in that.

When i took my first e-bicycle it had an 8 led battery indicator a simple way to display battery lvl's but was a bit hard to understand how its working while on load.

The guy i took the bike believed that the led display was bad because it was not showing the same battery lvl's under load.for example i had full charge and before i drained the battery to 1/5 the led indicator was showing full battery at all the time (i am sure now that it can read all the batteries voltage while in full charge) after that it starts sowing you the battery level in a different way when i was climbing for example a large hill the battery indicator will display 4 from 8 leds and when i am riding in smooth ground it will display 6/8 leds.And by all that i just want to tell you that the battery indicators in electric bikes might look weird under load its like a volt meter : when you add load the volt indication will fall and when you don't have a load it will return to its natural position.When the load varies it will show different reading at the same battery levels.

I hope my example makes sense

 

[dogman dan]

If I'm not mistaken, your scootbike has a meter with full / empty indicators? Maybe different color led's that light up. Generally those are just activated by a voltmeter type device.

So it works ok with lead, which has a fairly steady voltage drop as it discharges. Voltage will give you a pretty good capacity left guage once you get to know your battery pack well.

But a wattmeter works different. You never quite know what is left, but get familiar with how many watthours you should have avaliable. Then as you tick away the wh on the meter, you get a very very good idea of when you are at halfway and should turn for home. So say you know for sure that your pack fully charged should have 300wh. If you see 275 on that wattmeter, you sure as hell know you are very very close to the end of your charge.

A wattmeter is really the ideal way to know when to stop when you desire to use a % of the battery, and leave a certain % left to extend battery cycle life. In the case above of a 300wh battery, youd know that at 240wh, you have used 80%.

Once you get into a lithium battery, which maybe you have? , the discharge curve is much flatter, and volt based guages work a lot less accurately. So for lithium, nothing beats a wattmeter.

 

[ProDigit]

I will tell you my experience in that.

When i took my first e-bicycle it had an 8 led battery indicator a simple way to display battery lvl's but was a bit hard to understand how its working while on load.

The guy i took the bike believed that the led display was bad because it was not showing the same battery lvl's under load.for example i had full charge and before i drained the battery to 1/5 the led indicator was showing full battery at all the time (i am sure now that it can read all the batteries voltage while in full charge) after that it starts sowing you the battery level in a different way when i was climbing for example a large hill the battery indicator will display 4 from 8 leds and when i am riding in smooth ground it will display 6/8 leds.And by all that i just want to tell you that the battery indicators in electric bikes might look weird under load its like a volt meter : when you add load the volt indication will fall and when you don't have a load it will return to its natural position.When the load varies it will show different reading at the same battery levels.

I hope my example makes sense

I understand the principle, but just questioning if a voltage meter would be such a great improvement.
So far I've only seen people measuring power by measuring voltage and amps. Doing so we're stuck with 2 meters, and perhaps is even more confusing.
If there exists a watt meter, that puts it all in 1 single meter, that one would be interesting.

 

[Alastor]

I will tell you my experience in that.

When i took my first e-bicycle it had an 8 led battery indicator a simple way to display battery lvl's but was a bit hard to understand how its working while on load.

The guy i took the bike believed that the led display was bad because it was not showing the same battery lvl's under load.for example i had full charge and before i drained the battery to 1/5 the led indicator was showing full battery at all the time (i am sure now that it can read all the batteries voltage while in full charge) after that it starts sowing you the battery level in a different way when i was climbing for example a large hill the battery indicator will display 4 from 8 leds and when i am riding in smooth ground it will display 6/8 leds.And by all that i just want to tell you that the battery indicators in electric bikes might look weird under load its like a volt meter : when you add load the volt indication will fall and when you don't have a load it will return to its natural position.When the load varies it will show different reading at the same battery levels.

I hope my example makes sense

I understand the principle, but just questioning if a voltage meter would be such a great improvement.
So far I've only seen people measuring power by measuring voltage and amps. Doing so we're stuck with 2 meters, and perhaps is even more confusing.
If there exists a watt meter, that puts it all in 1 single meter, that one would be interesting.

You will have to pay a lot for a nice voltage meter but there are some meters that are quite accurate and inexpensive for e-bikes.This is a nice meter check it out it might solve your problem.

http://www.powerwerx.com/digital-meters/watts-up-meter-dc-inline.html

 

[ProDigit]

I just did some surfing, Voltage meters are quite cheap.
It can easily be measured by a $5-25 multimeter.
Multimeters only measure upto 10A, so are not suited for measuring current on e-bikes.

For amps a needle like this $8 50A amp meter (for 350-750W motors, 48V) should be good enough :
http://www.amazon.com/0-50A-Rectangle-Analog-Panel-Ammeter/dp/B0050RXMSK/ref=sr_1_58?ie=UTF8&qid=1338180837&sr=8-58
They also have a similar meter for upto 30A, good for your 250W motor.

Watt meters, seem more expensive. Unfortunately the affordable ones have such a small display, not suited for dashboard use.
Turns out there are some that actually are made for battery packs like these:
$56 meter (0-60V, 50/100A continuous/peak)
http://www.amazon.com/Watts-Meter-Analyzer-WU100-Version/dp/B001B6N2WK/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1338180086&sr=8-3
Or this $60 meter with same specs:
http://www.amazon.com/100-Amp-DC-Watt-Meter/dp/B005534KM6/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1338180086&sr=8-1

 

[dnmun]

harbor freight has really cheap digital voltmeters on sale for $2.99 all the time. buy two.

the electrathon guys used them for their panel meters.

they are so cheap i give them away to people in need.

 

[ProDigit]

I see they start from 4.99.
What I don't like is that they are less visible while driving,and you have to turn them on, and set them to the correct value.
It's even possible to have the meter stolen.

I prefer these $6-10 analog types, which you can build into the dashboard (though the needle is pretty thin):

50V:
http://www.amazon.com/Amico-0-50V-Voltage-Analog-Voltmeter/dp/B006Z95BJ0/ref=sr_1_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1338187816&sr=1-2

Concerning the 50V meter, I'm a bit concerned what would happen when the charger is plugged in.
It may surpass 50V, even 56V. Those 6 V may not pose an immediate danger, but they may in the long run.
Lucky they have a 100V version too, though on that one you'll see the needle most of the time in the 30-48% range of the spectrum.
100V:
http://www.amazon.com/Amico-0-100V-Voltage-Analog-Voltmeter/dp/B006Z959CY/ref=sr_1_4?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1338186442&sr=1-4

 

[Alastor]

I prefer the digital one because meters with needle are sensitive with vibrations and unfortunately you will not be able to see its readings at night.Also i don't like typical volt meters because they will need battery replacement soon.I hate opening meters to replace there battery while they are mounted on something.

Also the digital meter i suggested has a lot more functions that are useful in my opinion if you will experiment with your ebike .

 

[dnmun]

the digital panel meters are on ebay. they get the illuminating voltage from the pack they ride on. using a voltmeter from harbor freight is cheap. since they are $2.99 you can buy two. then also buy a package of alligator clips from harbor freight at the same time. 69 cents.

from one of the voltmeter packs, cut the probe ends off the leads and solder on the alligator clips. now you have two sets of probes, one can be attached with the clips, one used as probes.

to monitor voltage while riding, alligator clip the voltmeter leads to the pack terminals, or some place where the battery voltage is accessible, and tape the clips in place so they cannot short. plug these into the voltmeter so you have real time voltage monitoring using the digital display and the other voltmeter probes can be used if you have to diagnose problems on the road using that voltmeter when it is disconnected from the alligator tipped leads. not too difficult, and you got a voltmeter to use on the road and one in reserve for when that one breaks.

 

[dogman dan]

The HF voltmeters can even be free. I bought some zip ties last week, and with a coupon from the paper got another voltmeter. On the wrong day in the store, they can be ten bucks though. I used one of those multimeters on my race bike a year ago, because my CA was good to 100v, and I was running 110v.

Last week, I bought a led voltmeter for 15-120v for little money. http://www.ebay.com/itm/170846310527?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649 I'll let you know how it is, can you read it in the sun, etc when it gets here.

When you can afford one, look at the Cycleanalyst. It is a voltmeter, spedometer, watt meter, amp meter, and cycle counter all in one tidy display. If you get the direct plug in version and have a controller with the compatible plug, it can also limit speed or amps.

But just a voltmeter is an improvement on your led dispalys. With the led, how many volts are you sagging under load? Dunno. How low are you discharging the battery? dunno. You could look at your voltage with a voltmeter, then calibrate your led's to specific voltages and then you would know what voltage each led means.

 

[ProDigit]

the digital panel meters are on ebay. they get the illuminating voltage from the pack they ride on. using a voltmeter from harbor freight is cheap. since they are $2.99 you can buy two. then also buy a package of alligator clips from harbor freight at the same time. 69 cents.

from one of the voltmeter packs, cut the probe ends off the leads and solder on the alligator clips. now you have two sets of probes, one can be attached with the clips, one used as probes.

to monitor voltage while riding, alligator clip the voltmeter leads to the pack terminals, or some place where the battery voltage is accessible, and tape the clips in place so they cannot short. plug these into the voltmeter so you have real time voltage monitoring using the digital display and the other voltmeter probes can be used if you have to diagnose problems on the road using that voltmeter when it is disconnected from the alligator tipped leads. not too difficult, and you got a voltmeter to use on the road and one in reserve for when that one breaks.

I don't know why you keep on posting wrong prices! I only see multimeters starting from 4.99, and alligator pliers from .79.
Either way, a multi meter has it's levels of discomfort when using it while driving (not easy to build into the dashboard).
Also, my experience with cheap multimeters (though I have several at home) is that usually the first thing that breaks is the cable pins. they get disconnected from the cable quite easily.

But if you really want to buy a multimeter, just spend $4 extra to get at least a large display version, like this one:

It would somewhat be better visible while driving (except at night).

The needles, perhaps are prone to shocks, but I yet have to see one break because of some incident.
Since the bike has shocks, the meter is protected from the hard higher frequency vibrations which are most dangerous for it. The only way I see to break a needle meter would be by crashing the bike or letting it fall.
For the rest you can drive on rough terrain, and potholes, the shocks and tires take care of the most dangerous shocks and vibrations.
What is left is some wobbling, that at most would fluctuate the needle some.

The cycleanalist is pretty expensive, and IMHO not worth the price for purposes of using it in the on board display. The display LEDS are too small to read during driving, and the tool is a diagnostic tool rather than a display tool.
One glance at the display while driving shows just a green blur with black dots on. It's not clear.

A gauge that can be built into the bike would be best.
So get a gauge for amps and voltage (or just a wattmeter like this $70 one: http://www.amazon.com/Digital-Power-Watt-Meter-Solar/dp/B002PKWGH8/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1338212569&sr=1-1 )
and a speedometer with ODO meter built in.

The only thing I don't know is the meter is rated for 14V DC, but it ays upto 500V dc with shunt or something... I don't know what this shunt is, and if it's powering the device or not.

 

[dogman dan]

Hoo Boy, Now you did it. You just spewed nonsense about the CA, which you clearly know nothing about.

Get ready, you just opened a can of whoop ass on yourself. You may not know how popular the inventor of the CA is here. You may not know this forum still exists thanks to Justin. You just lost what little credibility you had here.

Prices vary localy. My HF sells voltmeters anywhere from 3.99 to 9.99 depending on what sale they are running. Last week was the first time I got one free with another purchase. The meters work ok, but you are correct that the leads are junk. I took some male 4mm bullets and made some better ones when I put one on the race bike.

 

[ProDigit]

Hoo Boy, Now you did it. You just spewed nonsense about the CA, which you clearly know nothing about.

Get ready, you just opened a can of whoop ass on yourself. You may not know how popular the inventor of the CA is here. You may not know this forum still exists thanks to Justin. You just lost what little credibility you had here.

Prices vary localy. My HF sells voltmeters anywhere from 3.99 to 9.99 depending on what sale they are running. Last week was the first time I got one free with another purchase. The meters work ok, but you are correct that the leads are junk. I took some male 4mm bullets and made some better ones when I put one on the race bike.

I don't know if you're joking, or purposely acting like a retard?
I mean,I just checked the prices (twice).

And I really don't know what other nonsense you're talking about, but whatever,
if you think you're right, you probably are (if that makes you happy).


BTW what is a CA? to me it stands for California, or Cranking Amps.

If everyone is just going to switch words for 2 letter words nobody's going to understand a thing of it.

 

[dogman dan]

What is a CA? It's a Cycleanalyst. Which was invented by the owner of this forum. It is expensive, because it does so much and comes with a fantastic warantee.

I'm not joking. Spew all you want about other stuff, but don't say Grin Cycles products are poor around here. It won't fly. At least you didn't call a moderator a retard.

Have fun over at V is for voltage.