Bike stuck in reverse
- Thread starter matthook
- Start date
John in CR
100 TW
matthook said:
Sure it's easy. Just swap 2 of the larger wires, and give a go with the different combos of halls. If I remember correctly the false positive can't be correct for the halls (give it a quick throttle pulse first to be sure), and you already know color on color isn't right, so it's just 4 left to try. I'm almost certain it's also not a swap of the same colors, so a 33% chance of getting it first try, and takes a couple of minutes at most.
Look out for spinning pedals if it's a rear motor. A false positive after the 2 phase wire swap will be reverse, and pedals don't freewheel in reverse.
friedwires said:
Nice one Friedwires, That spreadsheet makes it a lot clearer. Im going to have a few hours on it after.
DOGMAN I think you are spot on, I expect the previous owner has put a new controller on and like you said couldnt work it out.
Im feeling more confident now, that it will be a runner again was beginning to give up lol
Thanks again to the forum
John in CR
100 TW
LOL! Nice pic. Glad it wasn't worse. Some of my kids are just getting old enough to heed my advice after years of ignoring it.
Ignore that stupid spreadsheet. It takes less time to get the right wiring combo that it does to load the damn thing, much less print it out or enter the data.
If you motor runs smoothly in reverse, you simply swap 2 phase wires and get the right hall combo through quick trial and error. Only change 2 at a time while doing the trial and error too, because it's easier to be systematic. It's so easy that I won't even mention the info you already have to give you a 50/50 shot of getting it right on the first try, because it will more likely just confuse.
Ignore that stupid spreadsheet. It takes less time to get the right wiring combo that it does to load the damn thing, much less print it out or enter the data.
If you motor runs smoothly in reverse, you simply swap 2 phase wires and get the right hall combo through quick trial and error. Only change 2 at a time while doing the trial and error too, because it's easier to be systematic. It's so easy that I won't even mention the info you already have to give you a 50/50 shot of getting it right on the first try, because it will more likely just confuse.
dogman dan
1 PW
John's right. But do be aware that if you have a bad connection somewhere, you can go crazy trying to figure it out. If you have one wire not really connected when you try the correct combo, you'll try it and it won't work. So make sure you are getting good connections when you try your different combinations. I like to remove the plug covers, and work with the loose wires till i find the right one. That way you can see if your connections are good. Inside the plug, a connector can back out and not be connected unseen. In any case, the halls wires get swapped a lot easier when out of the plug.
friedwires
100 W
that stupid spreadsheet works great for me every time 
John in CR
100 TW
friedwires said:that stupid spreadsheet works great for me every time
I'm just not into wasting my time. It's a simple logic problem with a simple solution that with bullets on the phase connections and the hall spades out of their connector I could find the right wiring combo blindfolded. As Dogman pointed out, good connections are a must.
If the correct firing sequence is A-B-C, since the magnets run in a continuous circle, A-B-C is the same as B-C-A and C-A-B, because they all repeat to A-B-C-A-B-C-A-B-C-A-B-C . It doesn't matter if the starting position is A or B or C, the continuous result is the same.
That covers 3 of the possible combos of the phase wires. Now for the other direction, just swap any 2 and only 2 and you get C-B-A-C-B-A-C-B-A-C-B-A- as the continuous sequence for reverse (ie ABC backward). That's why with a sensorless motor you just swap 2 phase wires to change direction of spin. The same is true for our sensored motors, but we just need to find the right combo of halls to go with it, and there are only 6 possibilities.
A lot of the motors will spin the wheel on a bad combo, what I call a false positive. With a bit of experience you'll know the sound of a false positive, and they actually can be a short cut to finding the right combo. That's because they spin the wrong direction, so if you run into a false positive you know to swap 2, any 2, and only 2 phase wires and the answer has to be in the remaining 5 hall combos.
Teach people to understand the problem and how to solve it. Crutches like the spreadsheet can be valuable tools, but only if they are true savers of time and effort. This one is just the opposite.
John in CR said:friedwires said:that stupid spreadsheet works great for me every time
I'm just not into wasting my time. It's a simple logic problem with a simple solution that with bullets on the phase connections and the hall spades out of their connector I could find the right wiring combo blindfolded. As Dogman pointed out, good connections are a must.
If the correct firing sequence is A-B-C, since the magnets run in a continuous circle, A-B-C is the same as B-C-A and C-A-B, because they all repeat to A-B-C-A-B-C-A-B-C-A-B-C . It doesn't matter if the starting position is A or B or C, the continuous result is the same.
That covers 3 of the possible combos of the phase wires. Now for the other direction, just swap any 2 and only 2 and you get C-B-A-C-B-A-C-B-A-C-B-A- as the continuous sequence for reverse (ie ABC backward). That's why with a sensorless motor you just swap 2 phase wires to change direction of spin. The same is true for our sensored motors, but we just need to find the right combo of halls to go with it, and there are only 6 possibilities.
A lot of the motors will spin the wheel on a bad combo, what I call a false positive. With a bit of experience you'll know the sound of a false positive, and they actually can be a short cut to finding the right combo. That's because they spin the wrong direction, so if you run into a false positive you know to swap 2, any 2, and only 2 phase wires and the answer has to be in the remaining 5 hall combos.
Teach people to understand the problem and how to solve it. Crutches like the spreadsheet can be valuable tools, but only if they are true savers of time and effort. This one is just the opposite.
HEY EVERYONE ITS ALL GOOD<
I swaped one pair of the hall wires and it runs like a dream now, Smooth and everything, Only problem is my brakes are shot, so have to work those out now
I really appreciate everyones help on this subject, I couldnt have done it with out the spreadsheet and the common sense advice from John in CR. I would have given up long ago and probably fried the controller or MYSELF LOL.
Ive rewired all the dodgy connectors now soldered it up nice and sealed all the wiring in heat shrink, so its the business now.
Id like to buy you all a beer, thanks a lot, keep in touch all
friedwires
100 W
im glad you got it sorted! ride safe!
Mine ran fine then acted as if it was shorting out. Now,under load it wants to run backwards after running perfectly fine.
I replaced the thumb throttle and the controller.
Ran perfectly.
Then began cutting out under load.
Thought I had a bad switch so cut it out straight wired it and again the bike ran like a new one, then 3 miles later began to cut out out like a bad/loose connection.
Now wants to run backwards again after running forward, then backwards, now forwards.
Of what is this a symptom??
I replaced the thumb throttle and the controller.
Ran perfectly.
Then began cutting out under load.
Thought I had a bad switch so cut it out straight wired it and again the bike ran like a new one, then 3 miles later began to cut out out like a bad/loose connection.
Now wants to run backwards again after running forward, then backwards, now forwards.
Of what is this a symptom??
