Brushless dual 6kw ALIEN Power system - electric longboard

[benj]

Just wanted to post an update after my first long range test last night

I managed to get 10 miles (16km) from my setup and it was still going! I only stopped because it got dark, hahaha!

Top speed is 13mph (20kph), so a nice cruising speed without worrying about speed wobbles or eating pavement too bad

I'm super happy with that, so thanks again to Bruno and Beetbocks. Just to keep the info handy, my setup is:

Alien drive, single wheel, 63mm motor, 120amp single Alien ESC, and one 8000mah 5S Zippy LiPo.

 

[board3d]

I just wanted to suggest to Richard to put up a donation button on his site so we can donate for the future, because I'm happy to help, I think we have some thing great going, some thing adaptable some thing that can be repaired customised upgraded and can progress, the feeling of riding these evokes is great but when you have put the effort and hard work in your self it feels heaps better.

I would certainly donate to the cause. Given the time and effort expended in continuous development and testing (not to mention answering tons of question) versus the meager margins from sale of the kits, I would say they deserve all the support they can get, especially in the early stages.

 

[board3d]

Just wanted to post an update after my first long range test last night

I managed to get 10 miles (16km) from my setup and it was still going! I only stopped because it got dark, hahaha!

Top speed is 13mph (20kph), so a nice cruising speed without worrying about speed wobbles or eating pavement too bad

I'm super happy with that, so thanks again to Bruno and Beetbocks. Just to keep the info handy, my setup is:

Alien drive, single wheel, 63mm motor, 120amp single Alien ESC, and one 8000mah 5S Zippy LiPo.

Well done and congrats.

 

[beetbocks]

Well its just so good to hear happy customers! that's nearly worth the effort alone!!

Jacob- If you could click "donate time" that would help more- its not really the cost of development ,although that is a factor. Its more about the time to design,manufacture and then test,redesign etc etc..I have a full time job (that i love ) and 2 kids under 5... so i fit the Alien kit business in around that- most night's up until 12 just invoicing,answers questions ( i am slightly shocked at some of the rudimentary questions I get - i am afraid some body is going to blow themselves up!!) and putting kits together...so it doesn't leave much room for development of new kits,new projects etc.. i would love to do this full time and i know i could come out with awesome products but i couldn't leave a secure ,well paid job with pension and that pays my kids house mortgage..u see the problem? I also use my machines at work after hours to develop the parts before i get them made in bulk..
I am having this discussion with my wife at present!!- when does a hobby become a full time job that pays well and will last until i retire?
I must have made the truck mount bracket about 15 times before i got it perfect but that was admittedly due to the fact that its fitting to a cast hanger,which i couldn't model perfectly in solidworks..
I will freely admit I'm no expert long board rider (i'm actually a snow boarder who's too old and too many kids to go any more!!) and would not really know the difference between one truck another , I used the Holey Truck for 2 reasons,
1- it was British and easy to get hold off
2- it had convenient holes for mounting..
Same goes with the ABEC wheels ,they just fitted the spec perfectly..

I can easily see what the advantage would be for CNC trucks with interchangeable parts(I even contemplated making the hanger myself but realised a manufacturer could do it far cheaper than me..) and i think that as there all machined to exacting tolerance ,unlike castings I could model them up in Solidworks fairly easily (this is the key to quick manufacturing - why make it for real when you can make on a pc- and it works well as long as the parts your fitting to are accurately drawn) but the cost of the Reys is pretty high and I'm trying to keep the kit cost down..another reason I picked the Holeys..
Indecently what do people think of the cost of the kit now they've got it in there hand- do you think its good value for money?
We have to be careful that we don't make a DIY kit into something that costs the same as a finished article
i suppose i could make a kit for both trucks that just needed a new angle bracket-i just need a pair of trucks to machine to so just donate them- i admit to not exactly rushing to buy some as i just know i don't really have the time to redesign/make the truck bracket..
Would you all want to pay more for these trucks??
please let me know..

At the end of the day- I started all this just for the fun of making something better than you could buy and i never intended to sell to the public and i must admit that whilst the money i make is nice to have i am considering the future as i just seem to live and breath Alien!! 24hr a day! and I am wondering where my nice easy life's gone!! and I just don't seem to have the time to enjoy my board any more...

 

[sk8norcal]

FYI, Reys is the cheapest RKP trucks on the market. AFAIK

for price reference,
Death Rey - single truck (with baseplate/axles) is $91.50 usd
http://shop.reytrucks.com/completes/death-rey-truck/

vesus $35 usd for one Holey truck.


there's 2 other cheaper models without the holes.
http://shop.reytrucks.com/complete-single-trucks/

not sure if Rey hangers fit any cast baseplates out there... cuz they do offer just the hanger also...

 

[jacobbloy]

How are Holey trucks "not so great" for freeriding?
many pros ride cast trucks with no issues.
too bad Holey's are not popular trucks. The more popular cast trucks offer more width options and baseplate

I think what you mentioned about Boosted is completely inaccurate.
the 500k raised through kickstarter is NOT a donation.
They are preorders.

As I said the holey trucks are great for the kit, but with the benifit of speed on flat grand it takes free riding to a new level, one of the reasons boosted used a loaded deck and bear trucks,
When I said they are not so good for free riding, this is some thing I love to do, and I ride cast trucks too, Paris saber Randell bears and caliber's I have them all on my old decks, the different degree baseplate and hanger width, all play a lot but every truck brand even with the exact same specs feel different and it's up to the rider, but the holey trucks I feel are very stiff but not so stable at speed, the bushing seat is very sloppy using nipples, venom ect just dusnt feel right, I do like them however with a very hard duro bushing bombing a straight, but with my Rey's I can do what 3 different trucks could do, I can bomb that same straight slide around the tight corner at the end and the return to centre pops me back to continue down the hill, with bushing's that are a lot softer, this is all I was trying to say

As to boosted I was one of the donators in the kick starter, but that money was preorders so they need to provide a product, they still had the money to help out tho, where Richard did not and that is was I was recommending to ppl just to help out, as Richard has said you puts a lot of time into the kits not just money.

 

[jacobbloy]

FYI, Reys is the cheapest RKP trucks on the market. AFAIK

for price reference,
Death Rey - single truck (with baseplate/axles) is $91.50 usd
http://shop.reytrucks.com/completes/death-rey-truck/

vesus $35 usd for one Holey truck.


there's 2 other cheaper models without the holes.
http://shop.reytrucks.com/complete-single-trucks/

not sure if Rey hangers fit any cast baseplates out there... cuz they do offer just the hanger also...

I've tested they Rey's in Paris caliber Randell they say bears work too,

I also have distrabutor discounts that we can help out with kit prices ect.

 

[sk8norcal]

interesting about those trucks,
i never ridden Holeys or Reys. (not very popular trucks around here)
Gunmetals and Calibers are my favorite cast trucks right now.

And regarding your "preorder" (which is not a donation)
Companies do fall behind on their projected delivery date.
Which happens often on Kickstarter, due to logistic issues starting a production line, which people don't realize.
And Boosted is doing a turnkey product.
Very different from a making a small batch of CNC parts.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2413382,00.asp

and I am not sure where you are in the line,
but some of the very first orders have got their boards, and under going product feedback.
(I actually met a guy with one at the local Maker's faire)

 

[beetbocks]

As I said the holey trucks are great for the kit, but with the benifit of speed on flat grand it takes free riding to a new level, one of the reasons boosted used a loaded deck and bear trucks,
When I said they are not so good for free riding, this is some thing I love to do, and I ride cast trucks too, Paris saber Randell bears and caliber's I have them all on my old decks, the different degree baseplate and hanger width, all play a lot but every truck brand even with the exact same specs feel different and it's up to the rider, but the holey trucks I feel are very stiff but not so stable at speed, the bushing seat is very sloppy using nipples, venom ect just doesnt feel right, I do like them however with a very hard duro bushing bombing a straight, but with my Rey's I can do what 3 different trucks could do, I can bomb that same straight slide around the tight corner at the end and the return to centre pops me back to continue down the hill, with bushing's that are a lot softer, this is all I was trying to say

that's interesting Jacob- i do find on my Hyper 6Kw board that under hard acceleration at over 30mph you can get a severe 'wobble on' to use a technical term which can be pretty scary!!..so i've just tightened the kingpin which has stopped the wobble but it means the turning at low speed is poor now- a trade off really.
I have spoke with Mr 'Holey' AKA Gavin at Surrey Skateboards..and he says you can tighten a few turns but too much and you loose the geometry of the truck.and he has not got any harder bushings left for me to try,,
on the new smallerboard i want it to be more turny and i wont be doing any where near the high speed ,so i think it will be just right..lets see...

 

[simonjook]

Gunmetals and Calibers are my favorite cast trucks right now.

I built my eboard on Caliber trucks will probably have a kit similar to beetbocks avail in a couple of months designed for Caliber. Just the hanger/motor mount though - hubs and everything elseyou can grab from Beetbocks/Alien It's also bolt on/off and does not require any mods to your trucks. So far have put 100+kms using the prototype without even needing a single tighten.

 

[simonjook]

i do find on my Hyper 6Kw board that under hard acceleration at over 30mph

Beetbocks, there's is slight adjustment to technique and relaxing as the wobbles begin so as to deal with them ... it takes practice to decondition the snowboard muslce memory maybe - I find that's true for me at least and also being an older rider I really don't wanna take major stacks any more.

 

[board3d]

anyone use a LiFePo4 battery on this type of set up instead of LiPo. I hear they will hold a charge better and are safer

 

[beetbocks]

Yes I've mastered the muscle memory now so it's no so bad ..you've just got be a lot lighter on the weight , very similar to when your running a flat base on a snowboard..
I have had one fall at about 20mph and it hurt pretty bad and as you Simon I'm not getting any younger!!
I now ride with elbows pads and a pair of Kevlar lined jeans with thigh and knee pads - I feel a lot safer!!

 

[board3d]

Yes I've mastered the muscle memory now so it's no so bad ..you've just got be a lot lighter on the weight , very similar to when your running a flat base on a snowboard..
I have had one fall at about 20mph and it hurt pretty bad and as you Simon I'm not getting any younger!!
I now ride with elbows pads and a pair of Kevlar lined jeans with thigh and knee pads - I feel a lot safer!!

Kevlar lined jeans! Learning something new on this forum everyday. This is going to be must for me . I am seriously thinking about figuring out a way to lock the throttle to 60% so I can't go past 15 mph during the early days of riding the board - I know I will be tempted to go fast and will end up a mess on the asphalt.

 

[beetbocks]

Yeah there actually meant for use on a motorbike ..

 

[sk8norcal]

I built my eboard on Caliber trucks will probably have a kit similar to beetbocks avail in a couple of months designed for Caliber. Just the hanger/motor mount though - hubs and everything elseyou can grab from Beetbocks/Alien It's also bolt on/off and does not require any mods to your trucks. So far have put 100+kms using the prototype without even needing a single tighten.

interested in seeing what u got.

 

[jacobbloy]

Very very interested in seeing the caliber mount, maybe some pics? Caliber's are my fav all round cast try k I love them with a nice yellow orang venom bushing combo,

 

[simonjook]

Yes I've mastered the muscle memory now so it's no so bad ..you've just got be a lot lighter on the weight , very similar to when your running a flat base on a snowboard..
I have had one fall at about 20mph and it hurt pretty bad and as you Simon I'm not getting any younger!!
I now ride with elbows pads and a pair of Kevlar lined jeans with thigh and knee pads - I feel a lot safer!!

I had a stall where the whole board locked up at 20km/h and on hard acceleration which of course was total surprise and put me into the tarmac hard on day 2 of testing. I have gloves and a lid when I ride now. I designed mine for hill climbing as it's quite lumpy around me and my top speed is only a measly 30km/h but I can haul up most of the local hills at 18-20 which is what I wanted. When I want high speed I have gravity to assist round here.\

Very very interested in seeing the caliber mount, maybe some pics?

Soon, the prototype was milled using aluminium offcuts on my home made CNC in the garage (which I designed for wood) as there was a backlog in the metal workshop ... so the prototype is a bit ugly. So I will post the remake we will spit out next week - I will take off the clamp too so I can't see what it's done to the coating on my black Calibers.

 

[rf]

How are Holey trucks "not so great" for freeriding?
many pros ride cast trucks with no issues.
too bad Holey's are not popular trucks. ...

Surveying the current offerings, I think the popular items have gained their following more from marketing than performance. You can buy a popular deck for $200. Or a clone of it, sans the fancy graphics for $30.

Holey trucks seem to have garnered good reviews until they were overshadowed by others with better marketing and distribution channels.

Truck specifics seem more a matter of preference. Angles and bushings, etc. I doubt you could tell the difference between one set and another of similar dimensions and geometry. I've experienced how putting new handlebar tape on a performance bicycle can make it seem faster -- much like gleaming new graphics might on a skateboard. Perceptions.

Adding good brakes could well overshadow many other things all by themselves.

 

[rf]

anyone use a LiFePo4 battery on this type of set up instead of LiPo. I hear they will hold a charge better and are safer

Lipo's lighter weight and smaller size seem like winning features for skateboards.

 

[brunotollot]

Hi guys, just a quick post from italy. I'm on holiday until the 29th. I just needed a break. First i would like to say thanks for the kind post. Me and Richard are working very hard on this project, and like he already say, we have to find time between family, work, lots of emails to reply etc. I'm also building my website and doing some other Alien product for EV and RC ( new throttle interface, hall sensors PCB, outrunner cooling system etc ) . I'm working with different companies for new products and different people for some RC record.

With Richard we are working to give a complete kit ( electronics and mechanical ) to give to our customers an easy plug and play system. the kit will be more compatible with different kinds of board. Also the new electronics kit will be available in a box enclosure, ready to be fit on your board, with switch, without having to worry about sparks, plug, connectors. Also will be available a direct plug for charge the batteries, without disconnecting them always. The only wire you will see, will be the motor\s connectors.
Also available will be New firmware for a better sync, and 15% more torque on startup, expecially designed for mountain board. Everything to give to our customer a very good and reliable system at a friendly price. I dont think its fair that those who love this hobby need to pay 1500$ for an E board so, a friendly kit is our goal. Then the customer can choose from the different levels of power available and consequently choose how much to spend. Also the nunchuck style controller is ready. I'm just waiting to come back and do some test with Richard. It is programmable, but this functionality will not be available for safety reasons. It is factory programmed with fail safe, brake delay (ms) and throttle delay(ms).

Any suggestions are welcome.

 

[sk8norcal]

anyone use a LiFePo4 battery on this type of set up instead of LiPo. I hear they will hold a charge better and are safer

papo on here uses headway,
silenthunter is using hobbyking lifepo4
boosted is using lifepo4

 

[bboards]

I'm using lifepo4 2 x 5s in series http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__14071__ZIPPY_Flightmax_4200mAh_5S1P_30C_LiFePo4_Pack.html

It's dangerous enough what we do so I thought I would reduce my risks, not as fast as what lipo would be (33V v's 37V) but I'm happy with the trade off.

Weight isn't that major when compared to the lipo version http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__8589__ZIPPY_Flightmax_5000mAh_5S1P_30C.html

 

[bboards]

Has anyone tried using pogo raceplates to reduce the base plate angle?

I was thinking of putting some Riot Cups and Plugs into the Holeys but they don't have anything specific... Could go ghetto DIY http://www.silverfishlongboarding.com/forum/longboard-skateboarding-trucks-bushings/235632-hate-slop.html#post1299065667

I like the idea of precision trucks but only have Cal 44s on my DH board and if you can do Bathurst on cast Paris with a few tweaks I'm sure we can mod these to be suitable

Check this FB vid Matt K drafting like a BOSS to take the win on casts

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10152790708220304

 

[sk8norcal]

Has anyone tried using pogo raceplates to reduce the base plate angle?

according to their description it's compatible with Randal/Calibre/Gunmetal/Paris
If Holey is Randal compatible, you can buy 42/35 randal plates by itself for a cheaper price.

Note that changing ur baseplate angle would change the angle of the motor mounting plate.
the motor would end up getting closer to the deck.

I am picturing the ideal motor mount would have some "side-to-side" and "rotational" adjustment.

*BTW, the drop-up design is not invented by POGO
I wish someone would make some cheap cast ones for Caliber/Gunmetal.