Building A 2 Wheel Self Balancing Scooter (Segway)

el_walto

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Kamloops BC Canada
I've decided that sometime in my life i'd like to build a Segway Clone. I like this design because it uses bicycle wheels.

http://diysegway.blogspot.ca/2009/06/riding-95-finished-product.html

The thing i dont like is the brushed motors. Does anyone think it makes sense to use two DD 16" hub motors for such an appliction?
 
el_walto said:
I've decided that sometime in my life i'd like to build a Segway Clone. I like this design because it uses bicycle wheels.

http://diysegway.blogspot.ca/2009/06/riding-95-finished-product.html

The thing i dont like is the brushed motors. Does anyone think it makes sense to use two DD 16" hub motors for such an appliction?

The Segway uses hub motors. I don't know if they are geared. Backlash in any mechanical transmission would be a huge problem to overcome in this application. And you need lots of torque to do the job right.

Chalo
 
I recently went on an offroad segway tour to try them out. I know it sounds lame, but it was a lot of fun. I was really impressed with how plush the device was. I know it would be hard to build one of simular quality, but i'd still like to give it a go at some point. If using hub motors i might need to add extra hall sensors for sensitivity. I think the offcial segway uses a gear box or something and the wheels only mount on one side.

I like the idea of hub motors with an axle on only one side, but not sure how durable that would be mounting wise.

I'd consider buying one if they were 1500$, but $7800 is a little much for me.

Anyone know a good place to get a couple 16" hub motors that would have strong enough axles to only be mounted on one side? Looks like bmsbattery sells cute q100 201rpm 24V250W-350W motors that might work.

Edit: Seems that cute motors are actually geared. Now researching to see if one can built a 9c wheel into a 16" Rim. Yes, i am crazy.
 
Looks like most people build them using chain drive and DC motors. Probably for good reason. Might be way hard for a n00b like me to figure out how to drive brushless motors with hall sensors from an arduino.

I did find some motors with 16" rims. http://www.conhismotor.com/ProductShow.asp?id=94
 
As mentioned above, I made one, not a great success I have to say, but interesting to build. Brushed motors are much easier to use, as the controllers need to reverse on the fly very quickly to maintain balance. The vast majority of readily available BLDC controllers won't allow going from forward to reverse without stopping first, most will lock out if you try. My simple BLDC controller, with just a simple hardware "brain" would allow reversing on the fly, so two of them could perhaps be adapted to drive a balancing scooter.

The balancing control loop isn't too hard to design, although it needs a fairly fast processor to get the PID loop running fast enough and to process the signals from the accelerometer and rate gyro quickly. Mine was a bit "soft" feeling, so I suspect the loop wasn't really running fast enough.

The other point worth noting is that it's easier to hurt yourself with one of these things. The Segway has lots of safety features designed in, and uses very well tested code. A DIY balancing scooter will almost certainly be less safe and robust. When the code glitches, or something daft happens, like the batteries sagging because they're nearly flat, these things will just throw you off, usually with a violent face plant with hour hands too low to stop them from coming up and breaking your fall. Not a real problem as long as you know this may just happen fairly randomly, and as long as it doesn't happen at speed...........

The most useful site for DIY balancing scooter stuff is Trevor Blackwell's pages, here: http://tlb.org/scooter.html
 
Thanks for the advice. I'll try to build a brushed 2 wheel self balancing scooter, since i'm already in over my head and don't need to complicate things.

Proposed Parts List:

$195 with shipping
Sabertooth dual 60A motor driver
http://www.dimensionengineering.com/products/sabertooth2x60

Arduino Pro $19.95
http://www.sparkfun.com/products/10915
IMU. Accelerometer and gyroscope $36 without shipping
http://www.sparkfun.com/products/11072

10Ah 6s battery pack. $118 with shipping
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8586

Small Wheel Setup: 16"
374$ with shipping
12-1/2" x 3" Street Rear Wheel Assembly (5 - Spoke Dual Threaded) x2
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=68&product_id=442
24 Volt 500 Watt 3000RPM Electric Scooter Motor x 2
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=52_55&product_id=59
80 Tooth Sprocket for #25 Chain x2
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=63_89&product_id=131
55 Tooth Sprocket for #25 Chain, other size just incase x2
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=63_89&product_id=127
FreeWheel x2 (will glue this in rim)
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=63_114&product_id=389
#25 Chain, by the foot, 5 feet
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=38_103&product_id=276
#25 Masterlink x2
http://tncscooters.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=38_103&product_id=273

Large Wheel Setup: 20"
$449 plus shipping
Need to build custom wheels as they don't make 20" wheels with sprocket mounts?
20" Rims $62 plus ship
Spokes ???? $80 plus ship
Disc mount hubs front $100 plus ship
Disc compatible sprockets $60
24v 500w 3000RPM Electric Scooter Motor 128$ plus shipping
#25 chain $15 plus shipping
masterlinks $4
 
After lots of reading, this is the design i'm going to work from.

http://youtu.be/nJk0e-0Lp5E?t=44s

$632 used up so far, and i havent even ordered any dedicated batteries or metal yet.

ESC Can take 8S Lipo which might be benificial when compared to the 24V 12Ah SLA most people are using.
 
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