calinb
100 W
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2007
- Messages
- 102
I've been riding my 5304 equipped ebike through some very wet weather that's plagued NW Oregon over the last month. Although I've read that rust on the magnets can eventually become a problem, I've not had any trouble with my motor whatsoever. Nonetheless, I got a scare in an email from my vendor--Mike of ElectricRider.com. Mike cautioned me strongly against riding in wet weather and said that some people have even experienced failures after only a single ride in the rain!
Despite Mike's interest in keeping a customer happy rather than selling replacement motors, I remained unconcerned because I've had very good results corrosion proofing all kinds ferrous and non-ferrous metals with two products common in the aviation industry--Corrosion-X and ACF-50. I've also had fantastic results treating electronic equipment with the stuff. (It quiets old and noisy pots very well) and using it as a penetrating oil. I know of no electrical device that's ever been harmed by it. In one impressive trade show demo, the vendor filled a fish tank half-full with the fluid and placed an operating CRT television into the tank. Half the screen was submerged with the televised picture on the screen.
http://www.acf-50.co.uk/
http://corrosionxproducts.com/dealerpage.htm
In the U.S., I've used two suppliers--Aircraft Spruce and Chief Aircraft. I've used both products and can't really say that I've found either one to be superior to the other.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acf50.php
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/corrosionx.php
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acf50.php
I figured that, if I could get the cover off the motor, I could treat the inside and probably keep my motor protected from corrosion for many months, if not years to come. Unfortunately, removing the cover turned out to be somewhat challenging--hence this post and my hope it may prove useful to others. I wish I'd had a camera on hand, but I had not expected the removal of the cover to be such a big deal.
Before attempting the procedure on your own motor, please realize that your results may vary from mine. You may damage your motor resulting in financial loss or even the crash of your bike! You might smash your finger or even die--hard for me to say. Okay--enough of the forum disclaimers! How I got that cover off....
Mike mentioned that I could just pry evenly around the perimeter of the cover until the cover bearing disengaged from the axle. Haha--that's easy to say but very hard to do without damaging the cover or hub housing or perhaps modifying the housing to implement some pry points. You see--there's nothing to pry against or grab! The gap between the cover and the hub housing is too thin to permit the insertion of any effective prying tools without damaging the cover or the cover flange of the hub housing.
After removing the cover screws, I first ground down and smoothed a hacksaw blade using a grinding wheel in an effort to concoct a usable pry tool. Although I could force the blade into the gap between the cover and the housing with gentle tapping from a hammer, I could not budge the cover before my tool bent. I also tried to pry the cover loose with pin punches inserted into the cover screw holes with no success--not enough leverage or mechanical engagement of the tool was available. Tapping the punches against the holes did not rotate or loosen the cover either.
I finally found a solution in a 3x14 pan head sheet metal screw. After grinding off some of the sharp and pointy tip of the screw with my grinding wheel, the screw could be "self-tapped" into the cover holes without interfering with the underlying threaded screw hole of the motor housing. By slowly working the screw back and forth with a screwdriver (tighten/loosen...tighten/loosen..etc.), I was able to engage the screw into the cover over the distance of a couple of threads. Of course I could have used a tap to cut threads in the cover for a machine screw too, but probably not successfully while the cover was mated up against the hub housing because it would probably be impossible to use a tap without damaging the underlying hub motor housing screw hole threads.
Once I found that I could cut threads to tightly engage the machine screw into the cover only (but not the underlying motor housing of course, I placed the screw into the threaded tip of my Harbor Freight slide hammer (body work dent puller) and screwed it back into the cover with the slide hammer tip held captive by the screw head. Then I screwed the slide hammer shaft onto the tip, took a deep breath and started working the slide in an effort to dislodge the cover. The screw can only handle axial loads--pulling the cover straight off--so it's important to keep the screw straight while pulling and not impart a side load on the screw, possibly dislodging it from the hole. I started with soft taps but found it required a couple of moderately strong "hits' before the cover moved outward a very small amount. Once I saw movement, I removed the slide hammer and screw and re-installed the apparatus into the next cover screw hole to loosen my way around the perimeter of the cover. After the 3rd or 4th hole, the cover popped free of the motor housing flange, leaving a gap sufficient to insert a proper pry bar (or screwdriver ) and easily free the bearing from the axle with the cover.
Phew--the hard part was done and I hadn't sacked my cover or motor yet! I pulled another el-cheapo Harbor Freight "special" off the shelf--a paint spray gun--and placed a few thimble-fulls of ACF-50 into the paint hopper. (Just spray some into the paint sprayer hopper, if you have the ACF-50 or Corrsion-X aerosol can rather than the bulk product.) I cranked up the air pressure on my air compressor, closed down the fluid valve on the gun to a very low setting, and opened up the air valve. The idea is to set up the sprayer to over atomize (at least compared to a proper paint spray pattern) the ACF-50 or Corrosion-X. Ideally, you want to transport the fluid to the internals of the motor with a heavy "fog." Make sure to blow a bunch of the fog back behind the stator and drive it into the magnets too. Leave no surface uncoated with a thin coat of material. The insides don't need to be dripping heavily--they just need to be coated.
After coating the inside of the motor, replace the cover by gradually tightening the cover screws in a cross-wise sequence. As always, I used RTV silicone sealant around my wires where they exit the axle, but I don't think it's a good idea to attempt to completely seal the motor elsewhere. It appears that water could get into this motor but, hopefully, it can also get out! Interestingly, I found no signs of moisture or corrosion in my 2-month old motor, despite many rides in light to very heavy rain.
I now ride in wet weather without worry of corrosion or corrosion induced failure because I've never seen ANY corrosion on any object that I've treated with these products in the past!
I hope this helps others to realize the enhanced utility (and even fun) of a rainy weather capable ebike and Crystalyte hub motor. Rain is likely 3/4 of the year where I live. I ride with an Aerostich Roadcrafter motorcycle suit and I've been riding motorcycles in the rain (and worse) for many years. I don't own vehicles that must be parked due to rain!
-Cal
Despite Mike's interest in keeping a customer happy rather than selling replacement motors, I remained unconcerned because I've had very good results corrosion proofing all kinds ferrous and non-ferrous metals with two products common in the aviation industry--Corrosion-X and ACF-50. I've also had fantastic results treating electronic equipment with the stuff. (It quiets old and noisy pots very well) and using it as a penetrating oil. I know of no electrical device that's ever been harmed by it. In one impressive trade show demo, the vendor filled a fish tank half-full with the fluid and placed an operating CRT television into the tank. Half the screen was submerged with the televised picture on the screen.
http://www.acf-50.co.uk/
http://corrosionxproducts.com/dealerpage.htm
In the U.S., I've used two suppliers--Aircraft Spruce and Chief Aircraft. I've used both products and can't really say that I've found either one to be superior to the other.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acf50.php
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/corrosionx.php
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/acf50.php
I figured that, if I could get the cover off the motor, I could treat the inside and probably keep my motor protected from corrosion for many months, if not years to come. Unfortunately, removing the cover turned out to be somewhat challenging--hence this post and my hope it may prove useful to others. I wish I'd had a camera on hand, but I had not expected the removal of the cover to be such a big deal.
Before attempting the procedure on your own motor, please realize that your results may vary from mine. You may damage your motor resulting in financial loss or even the crash of your bike! You might smash your finger or even die--hard for me to say. Okay--enough of the forum disclaimers! How I got that cover off....
Mike mentioned that I could just pry evenly around the perimeter of the cover until the cover bearing disengaged from the axle. Haha--that's easy to say but very hard to do without damaging the cover or hub housing or perhaps modifying the housing to implement some pry points. You see--there's nothing to pry against or grab! The gap between the cover and the hub housing is too thin to permit the insertion of any effective prying tools without damaging the cover or the cover flange of the hub housing.
After removing the cover screws, I first ground down and smoothed a hacksaw blade using a grinding wheel in an effort to concoct a usable pry tool. Although I could force the blade into the gap between the cover and the housing with gentle tapping from a hammer, I could not budge the cover before my tool bent. I also tried to pry the cover loose with pin punches inserted into the cover screw holes with no success--not enough leverage or mechanical engagement of the tool was available. Tapping the punches against the holes did not rotate or loosen the cover either.
I finally found a solution in a 3x14 pan head sheet metal screw. After grinding off some of the sharp and pointy tip of the screw with my grinding wheel, the screw could be "self-tapped" into the cover holes without interfering with the underlying threaded screw hole of the motor housing. By slowly working the screw back and forth with a screwdriver (tighten/loosen...tighten/loosen..etc.), I was able to engage the screw into the cover over the distance of a couple of threads. Of course I could have used a tap to cut threads in the cover for a machine screw too, but probably not successfully while the cover was mated up against the hub housing because it would probably be impossible to use a tap without damaging the underlying hub motor housing screw hole threads.
Once I found that I could cut threads to tightly engage the machine screw into the cover only (but not the underlying motor housing of course, I placed the screw into the threaded tip of my Harbor Freight slide hammer (body work dent puller) and screwed it back into the cover with the slide hammer tip held captive by the screw head. Then I screwed the slide hammer shaft onto the tip, took a deep breath and started working the slide in an effort to dislodge the cover. The screw can only handle axial loads--pulling the cover straight off--so it's important to keep the screw straight while pulling and not impart a side load on the screw, possibly dislodging it from the hole. I started with soft taps but found it required a couple of moderately strong "hits' before the cover moved outward a very small amount. Once I saw movement, I removed the slide hammer and screw and re-installed the apparatus into the next cover screw hole to loosen my way around the perimeter of the cover. After the 3rd or 4th hole, the cover popped free of the motor housing flange, leaving a gap sufficient to insert a proper pry bar (or screwdriver ) and easily free the bearing from the axle with the cover.
Phew--the hard part was done and I hadn't sacked my cover or motor yet! I pulled another el-cheapo Harbor Freight "special" off the shelf--a paint spray gun--and placed a few thimble-fulls of ACF-50 into the paint hopper. (Just spray some into the paint sprayer hopper, if you have the ACF-50 or Corrsion-X aerosol can rather than the bulk product.) I cranked up the air pressure on my air compressor, closed down the fluid valve on the gun to a very low setting, and opened up the air valve. The idea is to set up the sprayer to over atomize (at least compared to a proper paint spray pattern) the ACF-50 or Corrosion-X. Ideally, you want to transport the fluid to the internals of the motor with a heavy "fog." Make sure to blow a bunch of the fog back behind the stator and drive it into the magnets too. Leave no surface uncoated with a thin coat of material. The insides don't need to be dripping heavily--they just need to be coated.
After coating the inside of the motor, replace the cover by gradually tightening the cover screws in a cross-wise sequence. As always, I used RTV silicone sealant around my wires where they exit the axle, but I don't think it's a good idea to attempt to completely seal the motor elsewhere. It appears that water could get into this motor but, hopefully, it can also get out! Interestingly, I found no signs of moisture or corrosion in my 2-month old motor, despite many rides in light to very heavy rain.
I now ride in wet weather without worry of corrosion or corrosion induced failure because I've never seen ANY corrosion on any object that I've treated with these products in the past!
I hope this helps others to realize the enhanced utility (and even fun) of a rainy weather capable ebike and Crystalyte hub motor. Rain is likely 3/4 of the year where I live. I ride with an Aerostich Roadcrafter motorcycle suit and I've been riding motorcycles in the rain (and worse) for many years. I don't own vehicles that must be parked due to rain!
-Cal