Cyclone-USA Communication Issues...

[bendyline]

Well I finally decided I'd give the Cyclone 500W kit a try, from cyclone-usa.com. But as unfortunatly seems to be the case with them
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3681&p=54303&hilit=+Cyclone#p54303
, they're still very poor at communcating with their customers. I got the Automated confirmation email from him, but that's it so far. I ordered on Sunday (5-4-08) emailed the sales address yesterday, and still no response as of today.

Like others, I'd just like to know if he has them in stock and when I can expect it. I'm going to be building at least one more ebike after this, and if this is how it works, then I guess I'll order from TW next time, if I like the kit.

If any of you have contact with Jim , I believe his name is, and find anything out about them having kits or not, please let me know.

 

[Pete]

If you have not ante'd up the cash yet, consider buying direct from the source. You would (obviously) need to check how the costings work out with shipping, but I received my kit in Australia less than a week after I ordered it and have had excellent after sales support. There was an oops with the order and Cyclone sent me out the correct part, free of charge without batting an eyelid. And all within 8 days of finding the problem.

I know the preferred option is to support your local distributor, but if they can't get organised and respond to your queries when you are trying to give them money then what are they going to be like when you need help ?

Apologies to the distributor if you are on this forum, but personally I will not tolerate lousy communication. Same as I don't care that my batteries are going ot take another 5 weeks, I know that and I was told that up front so all is good. /rant off

 

[bendyline]

Well Jim finally replied to my email lastnight, not sure if that had anything to do with me posting this on here or not? Once I recevie the kit, I will try and document how the install goes and whatnot.

Thanks,
Britton

 

[Pete]

Do please keep the forum updated on how your install goes, there is very little info out there on Cyclone installs. If you can bring yourself to stop during the build, work in progress pics would be great. Goodluck with the build, my trike build has been an interesting challenge

What is your plan for the install ? base bike, battery types and capacity, anticipated usage.

It would be excellent if you are able to take some photo's of the embedded controller so the experienced people here can give some idea of the performance headroom in the controller

 

[sierraskies]

Just a week ago I emailed and called Cyclone USA with a question. I also emailed Taiwan, and got a reply immediately. We exchanged emails several times, got my questions answered, and ordered what I needed. The next day, after a total of 3 phone calls and 3 emails in one week to the USA distributor, I got this response:
"Hi,
Please order on-line http://www.cyclone-tw.com. Thanks.
Ricky"

I'd already taken that advice, and I'd recommend others to do that too. I wanted to deal with the USA distributor, even though his prices are higher (!), but why bother if service is non-existent. Taiwan waited a week and just now shipped my motor, haven't gotten it yet.

Wayne

 

[Dee Jay]

I understand that chain driven ebikes can be noisy. But are these motors alone noisy?

And can they be run in reverse for left hand drive?

Are these motors reliable?

wheels are turning . . . 8)
J

 

[Pete]

Noise ? I think ypedal will have to chime in on that one, I have never heard a hub motor. There is some motor and gearbox noise, very roughly, think old windscreen wiper motor for noise levels. On my trike the motor is right underneath my back and I expect to be able to hear the motor above the road noise but not above my MP3 player

The info for reversing the 650w motor (external controller) is here http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3921&p=61873&hilit=650w#p61873 . All the motors can be ordered in both rotation directions. I don't have the info to reverse the motors with the internal speed controllers.

As far as reliability goes, the planetary gearbox is all metal gears. I don't know how many members are running cyclone's, but we are the minority. I doubt there is a large enough installed base to give meaningful reliability data. I do know Greenspeed broke the front mounted freewheel fairly quickly, but on a trike there really is no reason to run the Cyclone front freewheel anyway and there are better and stronger alternatives available.

 

[lawsonuw]

All the motors can be ordered in both rotation directions.

Oh?! Cyclone sure doesn't make that clear on the web site. Good thing to know.

As far as reliability goes, the planetary gearbox is all metal gears. I don't know how many members are running cyclone's, but we are the minority. I doubt there is a large enough installed base to give meaningful reliability data. I do know Greenspeed broke the front mounted freewheel fairly quickly, but on a trike there really is no reason to run the Cyclone front freewheel anyway and there are better and stronger alternatives available.

I would agree that the crank freewheel on the "normal" cyclone kit needs upgrading. When motoring only, the crank freewheel is freewheeling while supporting heavy chain loads. Bicycle freewheels just aren't built for this. (while pedaling or pedal+motor it should last fine though. A ball bearing freewheel could also fix it.) Assuming Cyclone used a one way clutch with integrated support bearings, I would expect this mid-drive system to last a long time. (see the attached pictures for the difference)

Marty

 

[rkosiorek]

I understand that chain driven ebikes can be noisy. But are these motors alone noisy?

And can they be run in reverse for left hand drive?

Are these motors reliable?

wheels are turning . . . 8)
J

the 500W cyclone has a planetary gearbox that uses straight cut steel gears. of course it makes a lot of noise compared to the almost total silence of a direct drive hub motor. it makes a whine whenever it is on. pedestrians on the sidewalk beside me can hear it at a distane of 10ft or so and often turn to see what is making that sound. i never have that experience with a hubmotor.

to reverse the direction of the motor for left hand drive requires the motor to be disassembled so you can get at the internal controller. 3 small surface mount resistors have to be located and removed. then 3 jumpers have to be added in other locations. instructions how to do this are available from Cyclone Taiwan. this will void the Warranty. you could also buy the motor already modified for reverse direct from them preserving the waranty.

next the freewheel attached to the motor would be for the wrong direction. and the motor shaft adapter would also have to change. the stock freewheel is a southpaw BMX freewheel that uses M30X1.0 left hand threads. that is what the stock adapter is machined for. to use it on the Left side of the bike you need a conventional freewheel that uses 1.375 - 24tpi threads. Cyclone does not supply such an animal. you could buy one from Staton Inc. that has a 0.750 shaft hole and have a local machine shop open that up to 20mm (the motor shaft diameter) and touch up the drive keyway.

lastly the freewheeling crank becomes completetly useless. think about it the motor drive on the left will be driving the crank axle on the left side to transmit the power to the crank sprockets on the right hand side. the crank arms are fixed to this axle. so when the motor is running the cranks will turn. no more free wheeling crank unless you use a jackshaft of some kind for a mid drive style arrangement.

so if you want to keep the freewheeling cranks without a mid drive style setup. just stick with the stock kit and live with the chain alignment problems.

rick

 

[Dee Jay]

Hi Pete, Rick. thanks for the great info.

Pete: I saw your cyclone setup. Your motor mount welds aren't too bad. Just paint over the welds. If I were me, I'd cover the whole thing with some kind of plastic cowl not only for stealth, but also to keep the noise down as well as water & dust off.

I didn't notice that Cyclones are geared. But good to know they are metal gears. I would rather have gearless though. I'll need a motor for my 50v A123 packs. The 48v 1000w looks gearless...

Rick:Thanks for the motor-freewheel tips, that was going to be my next question. .

After seeing the RC motor recumbent and Deafscooter's Dual motor LimoScooter, I was re-inspired. Basically, this is what I want to do: (not even sure if it's feasable so I'm still shopping around) I want to keep things simple and avoid the gearbox and the whole freewheeling crank thing and just go directly with a 48v 1000w with freewheel to a sprocket where the disc brake is mounted. As most of you know, I'm very into dual motor bikes. But this time around, I'm shooting for light weight motors. I really liked Deafscooter's Dual Motor LimoScooter. I want to do the the same with another high speed Cyclone at the front. but they don't have a small 48v motor . .

Anyway, I'm hust kicking these ideas around for now. Thanks again guys.

J

 

[Pete]

Assuming Cyclone used a one way clutch with integrated support bearings, I would expect this mid-drive system to last a long time. (see the attached pictures for the difference)

Marty

The mid drive Cyclone does use the integrated support bearing clutch. I don't have the tools to strip the dual freewheel assy, so I can't tell you what the threads are on the normal freewheel.

But this time around, I'm shooting for light weight motors. I really liked Deafscooter's Dual Motor LimoScooter. I want to do the the same with another high speed Cyclone at the front. but they don't have a small 48v motor . .

J

Check out ypedals pics of the 1kw motor. It looks to be pretty big / heavy. With the 650w planetary motor you get an external controller, so that opens up a whole world of options as far as over volting. I have not done this yet and I don't know of anybody who has so you would be the guinea pig.

 

[recumbent]

I think my Heinzmann hub motor has roller-ramp clutch bearings, they worked excellent for 7 years so far.
The needle bearings that roll directly on the axle look small, but the outer ramp clutch bearings are huge, a picture was posted on my "Heinzmann motor" thread last month.
It's amazing how much force those bearings can endure.