Dual drive BPM 48v500W sensored rear sensolrless front

lc_60

1 mW
Joined
Jul 16, 2012
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15
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Portugal
I'm making an e-bike and bought last year an e-bike kit from BMSBATTERY with a Bafang BPM 48v 500W sensored hub rear drive with 201 rpm for a 26" and a KU123 controller, and I also bought a 48v 10ah Ping battery for it. As I use to cross step hills as i travel from home to work, this year I thougt to buy a front kit with the same characteristics to make a dual drive e-bike with independent throttle, (in fact i only use the PAS and the 3 switch speed). The day before yesterday I bought it from BMSBATTERY and yesterday they e-mail me sayind that they only have sensorless hub motors to deliver. Now I don't know if I can syncronize these motors being one sensored and the other sensorless, because I think the sensorless one could have a rough start power than the sensored and they wil be pulling and pushing each other.

The question is, can I use the sensored one wihout connect the 5 wires to the hall sensors and make it sensorless too?
 
The KU123 controller can run with or without hall sensors. it has automatic detection, so you can pull the plug on the sensors to see how it feels sensorless. I have a front sensorless BPM and it makes a bit more noise than my sensored one and it's slightly rougher at start. The noise might be just because it's new.

My understanding is that you need two separate controllers for two motors because it's not possible to syncronise them due to the fact that they never have exactly the same size tyres. I've never heard about anybody using two motors with one controller if that's what you're thinking of doing.

Another consideration is your battery. A 10aH Ping is a bit on the light side for one BPM, so it'll struggle with two. Maximum continous discharge is 20A. You'll need at least 40A with two BPMs. 50A would be better.
 
The noise will remain. I built a bike like this. The rear is definitely quieter.
Next one will be dual rear motor with custom fork.
 
lc_60 said:
I'm making an e-bike and bought last year an e-bike kit from BMSBATTERY with a Bafang BPM 48v 500W sensored hub rear drive with 201 rpm for a 26" and a KU123 controller, and I also bought a 48v 10ah Ping battery for it. As I use to cross step hills as i travel from home to work, this year I thougt to buy a front kit with the same characteristics to make a dual drive e-bike with independent throttle, (in fact i only use the PAS and the 3 switch speed). The day before yesterday I bought it from BMSBATTERY and yesterday they e-mail me sayind that they only have sensorless hub motors to deliver. Now I don't know if I can syncronize these motors being one sensored and the other sensorless, because I think the sensorless one could have a rough start power than the sensored and they wil be pulling and pushing each other.

The question is, can I use the sensored one wihout connect the 5 wires to the hall sensors and make it sensorless too?
Well, you left a lot of stuff out like, what bike and do you like to pedal, being the most important.
But here goes.
Just get the 36V/350W frt. The wind will be a little different, which is not a bad thing. You don't want to run any more than 1200 Watts or so on the frt., so get the KU93. More power than that and they get kind of difficult to control when WOT. It will spin a lot and will spit you on your ear when you least expect it.
These are geared motors, they freewheel so there's no "pushing", but they help each other by "pulling" each other up into a slightly higher efficiency range.
If one runs the exact same systems on one throttle, they can "sync-up" electrically, which I found unpleasent.
When you get tired of the crude PAS, thinK about dual throttles, I do mine this way;
SAM_0689.JPG
Half twist[left side]/stk. BMS Battery thumb right next to it.
SAM_0690.JPG
Easy and intuitive to use.
You can drive 80 to 90% of the time on just the frt., as it will be smoother and use less battery power. It will be a higher wind, but should be nice for cruising in the 25 to 30 mph range.
Both motors together will climb like as homesick angel.

But like the others have said, you need more battery. A lot more battery.
You should read my build thread.
It's about mini's, but I think most of what I found to apply, will apply to the BPMs as well.
You will have to deal with good torque arms, which I, for the most part, didn't.
There was a recent post here about BPM speeds, where a reader really nailed down their no-load rpm values. you need to find it and plug in some ajusted values in the Ebike CA Simulator. Use the BMC and BPM. motors provided and note that you can overlay both motors on the same graph.
Another way to search those BPM posts is to use Google, Put in Bafang BPM, BPM, etc. and go for the Endless Spere threads that slow up.
 
360373-bici-electrica-wayscral-300-negro.JPG
I already bought it as an ebike with a cute rear hub 24v 250w, a 24v 14Ah controller and a SLA battery 24v 10Ah with 10Kg.
I was thinking to put it just with PAS, two PAS, one in the right side close to the chain for the rear motor and the other in the left side of the crank for the front motor, each conected to a controller with a three speed switch each. I want to mantain the bicycle spirit and do a little help from myself wen it needs, to spare the motors and batteries. About the batteries, you say I must have more batteries. I have some doubts about where to buy them.
I saw on BMSBATTERY the 48V 15Ah 40152S LiFePO4 Battery Pack for $409.00
http://www.bmsbattery.com/packs/430-48v-16ah-40160-lifepo4-battery-16-cells-ebike-battery-pack.html
and on PingBattery the 48V 15AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack for $533.00.
http://www.pingbattery.com/servlet/the-12/48V-15AH-V2.5-LiFePO4/Detail
They have similar weight about 8Kg each, and if I put two to make 30 Ah it wil be 16 Kg on the rear plus the 4Kg of the rear motor will be 20 Kg on the rear. The bike is in steel and have 25Kg, plus the 4 Kg from the front motor and the 3 Kg of the steel fork suspension I adapted, and the 1,6 Kg of two rear shock absorbers I want to put in the place where was the SLA battery, it all wil make a 54 kg bike. But my doubt is what battery shoud I buy, from BMSBATTERY, from PingBattery or else where? The price is very important to me but I don't want to buy something that gets problems or don't last enough.
 
That's not a frame to do what you are out-lining here.
In fact, it's not even close to being a sensible conversion.
Good luck
 
If you really want to use that bike with two motors, a better solution might be a 36v 201 rpm Q100 for the front. The forks on the bike now should be OK fo such a motor with one torque arm. I'd use the 36v 15aH 40152S battery on the rack. You can take the present batteries out of the case and put the extra new controller in the case and use the rest of the space for tools or whatever. Two Q100 motors will give quite good climbing power. Your existing 24v controller should be OK at 36v, but, just to be sure, you could order an extra KU63.

Alternatively , and much easier, you could use the same 40152s battery, or the 12aH 38140 one (lighter), and a 500w rear BPM motor instead of your present one. With a KU123 controller at 30 amps, I think it will have more than enough climbing power.
 
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