earthships

[Dauntless]

Also the type of glue ( don't know the right word for it, perhaps spray-foam? ) is suspected to be highly carcinogetic until hardened.

Ethyl Carbamate (Urethane) has NO link to cancer as yet, but carries a warning of the possibility. It is bad for your kidneys and liver, as well as causing vomiting, comas, hemorrhaging.

Its use as home insulation is interesting as indeed it does not endure moisture well. They used to use it as the core for fiberglas surfboards, but since fiberglas isn't truly waterproof there were longterm problems.

Another thing I'd want to avoid would be the rolls of fiberglas. How could anyone want that loose and inevitably airborne in their homes?

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/listing/2691471553492?r=1&cm_mmca2=pla&cm_mmc=GooglePLA-_-TextBook_NotInStock_26To75-_-Q000000633-_-2691471553492

 

[IBScootn]

I came across this article from gizmag regarding a passive house design that uses huge expanded polystyrene insulation blocks sandwiched between boards. Looks very simple to construct. The price they give includes labor. Wonder how much it would cost minus professional labor costs?

http://www.gizmag.com/pop-up-house-multipod-studio/31249/

 

[2007blueprius]

I have been tinkering with this all winter I am on my second draft sheet book, I am now leaning more towards a Passivhaus,

I have come to learn that an Earhship may not be such a great Idea for my location, it is mostly flat and holds water very well, great for farming not so much for a house with the floor below the frost line 42 inches here, quite honestly I am rather skeptical about any type of basement construction, even the common kind, it appears to be a bitch to waterproof to begin with and a mess when it fails and they all fail eventually, besides for my climate for any kind of efficient build it is important to insulate well, and that gets expensive fast below grade, plus there is a matter of water infiltrating the insulation reducing its R value, it gets complicated real quick.

at the same time I do consider the footprint of the building materials, and when you get into fancy synthetic insulations, and plastic/rubber membranes, concrete, simple double panes wont do for my location and fancy triples get expensive and lots of it would be needed and most are made in Germany, to what end? there is a crave with ICF some call it the next best thing thou the thermal mass in the middle and couple inches of Styrofoam is no where near Passivhaus standards, better than footings with cinderblock basements by far but still not good enough in my opinion and lots of concrete.

before I learned of all this it all started with a pole frame book my neighbor gave me, I read it many times, and that was my initial plan, my lots are wooded and I wanted to buy a saw mill and have at it cut my own boards, I now go back to the same concept using what I learned from Earthships and Passivhaus,.

benefits of pole building?

well my local utility yard sells used poles for $1/foot, I need 12 about 20 feet long, that is my foundation and loadbearing right there done, the foot print on the landscape 12 holes 3 foot wide, the roof can go on first, the floor can be a couple feet off the ground and dry, easy to insulate, and there are several ways to go about it walls can be placed inside the poles as regular stick build or outside as polebarn with girts and purlins, I am looking at doing both creating a 12 inch wall cavity which is dam near thermal bridge free naturally , thermal bridging is one of the factors PassivHaus concept stresses the most, should be able to cheaply insulate it with either straw or cellulose, I believe the latter is best, I have some new drawings I shall post when I get a chance

George

 

[dogman dan]

I should have revisited this sooner. I think you are correct, that a passive thermal heated house won't heat itself in your climate.
It will need supplemental heat of some kind.

However, one benefit you may be overlooking in the design of a true earthship, is the trombe wall like solar room will never experience the full brunt of the winter cold. so a reasonably affordable double pane glass south wall is then backed up with another set of wall and windows to the actual interior of the house. Yeah, your greenhouse room won't grow much in winter, but it will in the spring, before the roof shade cuts off the light too much for much more than houseplants. But it the dead of winter, that's still natural light coming into your living space, but the real interior wall may only see 20F, while outside it's a temp I can't even contemplate, even after a life of ski mountaineering, and camping in snow caves.

Re the flat roof, that's just how you build a roof cheaper, in a place where snow loads are only moderate. They virtually always leak. That's the style in NM. Like you said, snow melts in a week or so. You will need a steeper roof for sure, but you can still do a standing seam or channel drain metal roof and drink the water that comes from it.

But the basic concept of a passive solar house does not really change. What works for passive solar still works no matter how you get your heat. You ideally want thermal mass inside the insulation, and where you live, up insulated past code here wouldn't even meet code for you I bet. Not sure that last sentence makes sense. What you want to do is insulate more than code calls for, where you are. Code is just a minimum. more is better, always.

You still need to just insulate the crap out of its outer shell. Burying it into the hill can be good, but insulating it well is better. One product I've been real impressed with was a concrete and Styrofoam mix cinder block. These giant blocks are about R 30. Four times the size of a normal cinder block, but they weigh nothing. And they pass for structural, without a lot of pouring concrete into them. I forget what they are called, but they kick ass if you can afford them.

Most likely you are on the right track with rammed earth, but put at least 1" of foam on the outside, before you stucco. Or have some buried insulation between your back walls and the rest of the earth. That way you hold the heat you store in that dirt inside the house rather than try to heat the whole earth. Me, as a life long house framer, I'd just be inclined to build 2x6 frame, then put more foam to insulate when I sheathed it. Then the interior walls are the rammed earth, brick, or concrete walls.

 

[arkmundi]

Re the flat roof, that's just how you build a roof cheaper, in a place where snow loads are only moderate. They virtually always leak. That's the style in NM. Like you said, snow melts in a week or so. You will need a steeper roof for sure, but you can still do a standing seam or channel drain metal roof and drink the water that comes from it.

For whatever reason, the old industrial city of Worcester built a lot of housing stock with flat roofs. I live in one. We get lots of snow and it sits up there on top of that flat roof through the cold season. Ours was old, probably 40 years and yes, it started to leak. Being a condo building and being on the Board, I took on the project for a new roof. Primarily because I wanted to put on solar and wanted to insure the correct rebuild, so we had mount points up there. Anyway, we put on a Firestone EPDM membrane roof, the kind that is guaranteed not to leak for its warranty period, 25 years. I was up there putting on my mount points and watched them do it. I can say these are really tight roof and the membrane is thick and strong. You can have a flat roof, in winter climes, taking a snow load and see no leakage, if its done right.

 

[2007blueprius]

snow that collects onto flat roofs actually adds r value, however here you can clearly see the stud pattern due to thermal bridging, most houses are built like $hit even the new 1/2 mil, more snow on the roof the better is insulated, hence less heat loss, more snow collected.

as for the glass, it was explained to me that a single triple pane does better than 2 rows of double panes, as in one outside and one between that greenhouse and the living space.

the greenhouse almost works out as a perfect heatsink, in my case looser, in other words, I was tought how to calculate heatloss through windows, I could elaborate just take my word for now, for example for air filled double panes there is a certain distance the panes should be apart, too close and you have conductance heat loss, too far and you got convection heatloss, forgot the actual optimal number but it can be looked up in softwares like Resfen, there are tons as such and they are free.

so the 5 ft aproximately wide airspace/greenhouse sandwiched between two equal double panes would actually stay at about half the temperature outside and whatever you are trying to keep inside, when you run the numbers is like it is not even there heat leaks right through it almost,

don't get me wrong just the month of january those windows score negative, well insulated walls always score negative. as for these last ones, you mentioned code, an insulation contractor told me on a 2x4 stick frame sprayfoam is the only way to pass code at r 21, 2x6 1 inch foam rest cellulose for r24, inspector mentioned r 15 min, the house I am in now has nothing rammed earth is about 0.85/inch plus 1 inch foam, hardly worth mentioning.

in comparison a passive house features about 16 inches of foam under slab, r 60+ walls, r 100 roof, minimal thermal bridging

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rje2cJJYPh0&list=PLAFEE4D64BBA8296D

here is a good reference a definite must watch the entire series very well spoken

with this standard you won't need that much gain and thermal mass, reasonable size triple panes will do good, a rammed earth wall can be wrapped in insulation, but the foundation is a horrible thermal bridge and with earth temps of 47 below the frost lime -20 F outside, it is worst that the air touching the sides, its a shame I love the look and simplicity just cant see a good way to go about it up here

I'll post my new drawings when I get a chance, its a pole barn with walls inside the pole perimeter as well as outside leaving the cavity about as thermal bridge free as I could think of, and the whole concept carries to the floor and roof, the only thermal bridges are the contact points to the pole and even than we are talking 12 inches of wood which I think is about 1R/foot

George

 

[AndyH]

Great topic! Very happy to see Earthships getting some much deserved attention!

Some random quick comments based on the first read-thru...

- Tires/outgassing/degrading - Not an issue. This has been studied in the 'University of Anecdotes' - like the woman that's so sensitive to rubber and chemicals that she cannot walk into a tire shop, yet lives in an Earthship. And it's been studied by the University of Wisconsin-Madison. http://earthship.com/offgassing Bottom line: Even new tires (as they tend to do most of their offgassing during the first 20K miles or so) will NOT offgas when isolated from the sun and locked up in earth, clay- or cement-plaster. Whole tires are not an ecological problem when used for construction.

The main way tires are recycled is to shred or chip them and use them in asphalt roads or to make synthetic playground or sport flooring. Tires are a serious problem when chipped - this too has been well studied: http://chbenson.engr.wisc.edu/images/stories/pdfs/Reports/UW-Madison Scrap Tire Reprints.pdf

- Suitability in Michigan: Yes - they work fine - no rocket stove required. There's enough solar insolation for passive solar heat, PV, and solar hot water. How do we know? Because they work in upstate NY: http://freevilleearthship.blogspot.com/
And in Ontario: http://www.darfieldearthship.com/
And Quebec: http://www.darfieldearthship.com/
And in British Columbia: [youtube]RTIB3ZkD_Do[/youtube]
(lasqueti dude is not the home owner and is not a passive solar guy. )
And on the southern tip of South America. Folks from the Canadian Valhalla Movement documented the 2013 build in Ushuaia:
[youtube]CW0leds8YBU[/youtube]

In very cold climates, insulate the floor from the cold ground and rely on the thermal mass and insulation wrap around the sides and back. That's covered in the Earthship books and in the details when one purchases plans. Reynolds and crew customize/tailor construction details for location.

I rented a Global Model in January on the Earthship grounds north of Taos. After three days of clouds and nights down to 12°F, the greenhouse temp was 64°F and the air temp inside the house was 68. I made coffee in shorts, a t-shirt, and bare feet - the floor and walls were radiating at 69°F (yes - I packed important things for the stay - camera, IR thermometer, four thermometer/hygrometer units... ) This building was fully instrumented as well - it was one of the buildings used for develop and validate a model used to predict building performance in other climates. The research has been peer-reviewed and published. More here: http://www.earthshipironbank.com.au/research.html

Prius - trust the Global model and the info you get from Reynolds - don't change a thing - these things work!

BTW: This is the documentary that picks-up where Garbage Warrior ends - with the Baja build:

[youtube]ug19E3gZ0G8[/youtube]
[youtube]49A8c6t0y2A[/youtube]
[youtube]tUczLeBMgv0[/youtube]
[youtube]V_WqbK3FE-k[/youtube]

Cheers,
Andy

 

[AndyH]

Ah - two more items.

Roof angle/solar penetration in winter. The building angles work. Here's an early-morning photo from the place I rented in Taos:

Greywater and food: There are no ugly metals or chemicals in Earthship grey water. The greywater system collects and treats water from the washing machine, bathroom sink, and shower/bathtub. Water and solids from the toilet and kitchen sink go to the septic tank as black water. That being said, food has been grown in the effluent from the septic system in an Earthship and it was completely healthy and free of contaminants - no salmonella, no E. coli, nothing. Same for the grey water food production. And yes - grazing from the greenhouse in January (fresh figs, tomatoes, and banana's anyone?) is amazing!

For an excellent 'start to finish' look at building one of these buildings, hit 'Off the Grid Build' on YouTube. Dan does an excellent job showing unique details - even after he's enjoyed some recreational botanicals.

https://www.youtube.com/user/offthegridbuild

Here's a quick 'silent movie' walk through the greenhouse. January 10, 2012 after a 15°F/-9°C night.

[youtube]_XoryJDx2U8[/youtube]

 

[2007blueprius]

I was wondering what happened to you, I was following the Zephyr thread an all of a sudden you went missing.

I appreciate the input, especially your visit conclusions,

keep in mind those days in Januarry when you were down there, nights at 12 F, we had day time highs of -17F, don't get me wrong, I still love the idea, I would love Rammed Earth walls, I think they are awesome, I spent some time figuring this out to make it sortof work in Michigan it would take a lot of water and bug proof insulation, and a budget to go with it.

the area I am in is awful flat, and I been keeping an eye on it through the winter and spring, there were acres of ice rinks everywhere for miles, holding lots of water, which makes any floor below grade a waterproofing nightmare, a problem not found in Taos I think last I looked into it we get more rain in a month than Taos all year.

That is not to say I do not believe in the concept, just a bit terrified of building one out here, 10 miles north west there is a hilly area, I'd be a bit more comfortable berming one into the hillside at the top, at least wont have to worry much about the waterproofing

Oh and I ran the numbers, the glass, in January, plain double panes would net negative, triple panes would work but again, that comes with a suitable budget, I saw the BC Earthship winter videos, not a lot of details as to temperatures, also keep in mind BC gets the warm Pacific currents, there are species of palm trees living in Vancouver, I got to look up the Ontario ones, yep just read through it briefly, they are working on getting a woodburner.

don't get me wrong, it is better than the brick house with no insulation that catches sun in the summer and not the winter, house I live in, just not as advertised, possible of course but not feasableunless you win the lotto and don't know how to spend it

I have some new drawings I shall post shortly of what my latest idea looks like, I am trying to incorporate as much as I can, but up off the ground, easier to insulate and waterproof, I am planning one of those greenhouses eventually, but as an addition at a later date


same with new York, wood fire heater, in floor radiant heat, granted pipes will never freeze, they say 55f may be the bottom limit, they are confortable in the 60s but need to burn to get there, my better half has a fit below 72, my kid has a fit above 76, pretty small margin

 

[AndyH]

I feel your pain - I'm originally from Michigan - Flint area and way up north in the Keewenaw. Gotta love lake effect snow. Not sure how old you are, but this year's polar vortex anomaly was a taste of what was normal weather in the 1970s.

As I said - these buildings work in that climate. Keep in mind that Ontario gets the full force of the continental dry/cold air - it's not moderated by the Lakes the way things are in Michigan. For a MI build, I don't think one would have to insulate the floor. The living space does not include the greenhouse area - it runs from the inside vertical glass to the back wall. Behind the wall there's ~25" of tire, then four feet of compacted dirt, then 4 inches of insulation, then the complete outer berm. There's a LOT of thermal mass. Once the building's been up for a year, there's a 'bubble' of ground all around that's storing heat.

Your numbers are likely from traditional construction sources and thus will take you in a different direction. American building knowledge and rules of thumb are completely inadequate for the job. They'd be useful for a strawbale place, as building a cube with doors and windows to pump full of conditioned air is what our building system has evolved into. Working with mass is different.

I learned that the hard way after being stationed in Germany. The house I rented was cinderblock with insulation and stucco on the outside. The building soaks up heat and it's stable for hours to days even with the heat turned off. The way I understood how to save energy in a house was the US model - turn the heat down when you go to to work then crank it back up when you get home. This is ok for an insulated stick-built house, but failed completely with a thermal mass building. Imagine rolling out of the way when a meter in diameter chunk of ceiling falls in front of the fireplace - winter time, cold house, big fire in the fireplace...

A Global Model Earthship has a super-insulated ceiling - that's all it needs. The solar gain is enough even on a cloudy day - there's still heat gain in the building - and there's still tons of earth all around radiating into the building from the floor and the back, east and west walls.

Check the Freeville house - they built an indoor pizza oven with a water jacket - they have a hydronic loop in the 'back hallway'. They need the loop in the 'back hallway' only because they HAVE a back hallway. Rule number 1 for passive solar - no back hallway.

I almost forgot - there are Global models in Montana and in upper areas of Colorado as well. And while not an Earthship, Amory Lovin's passive solar place is in Snowmass, CO. Thermal mass and passive solar works in very cold places. I wouldn't switch to PassivHaus and super insulation until Alaska.

Build what you want, design what you want - no worries! But if you're looking for passive solar understanding in the USA, the body of 40+ years of knowledge is in Taos.
Andy

Big Sky and Miles City, MT
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/7/prweb10976144.htm
[youtube]zuBr2mgCMYs[/youtube]
[youtube]WxmYUqj0F0k[/youtube]

Lovin's place in Snowmass, CO
http://www.rmi.org/Amory's+Private+Residence

PassivHaus in Fairbanks
http://www.reina-llc.com/
http://passivehouse.us/passiveHouse...erence-Passiv Haus Alaska-Thorsten Chlupp.pdf

 

[AndyH]

I have been tinkering with this all winter I am on my second draft sheet book, I am now leaning more towards a Passivhaus,

I have come to learn that an Earhship may not be such a great Idea for my location, it is mostly flat and holds water very well, great for farming not so much for a house with the floor below the frost line 42 inches here

George - the frost line and conventional footing process assumes that the ground surrounding the foundation is exposed to ambient conditions and will freeze. This doesn't apply to an Earthship. This isn't an underground house.

Assuming a Global Model - the back/East/West walls do not require a foundation below frost because the surrounding ground will never be exposed to freezing conditions. The berms and insulation move the frost line up and out away from the building. Tire walls don't need a foundation at all because the tires have significantly more area than any code requirement.

Moving forward, the window wall at the front of the living space doesn't need to be 42+ inches deep for the same reason - no freezing conditions. The only areas in the house that will need a cement footing below frost are the thresholds for the doors at the end of the greenhouse space. I don't believe the greenhouse stem wall needs a footing because it's insulated on the outside of the tire work - and the heat bubble from the house will keep that from freezing/heaving. This is covered very well in the 'off the grid build' videos as well - footings on the Mesa are 12 inches, if I recall correctly.

Water is important - siting to stay out of water (build up if you must) is important, as is any water-diverting earthworks upstream of the house. This is a Permaculture house, after all, so use Permaculture practices to keep the building dry.

Remember that the cooling tubes extend from the back of the Global, and the water cisterns are back there - this is not an underground house and isn't something that can be dug into a hill taller than the building.

I strongly recommend studying at least the first three Earthship books. The Engineers report isn't necessary unless you have a building department that needs engineering proof that no foundations are needed. When they built Dennis Weaver's house in Colorado years ago, they did a bunch of testing (engineering math backed up by driving fully loaded cement mixers on tire walls) to prove the designs. There's also video from a 3-day seminar that provides very useful background. All of this info is available from the Earthship folks, and some is in torrent land as well.

I'm not surprised that anyone - especially the Ontario folks at Darfield - add a small wood stove. After all, Darfield predates the evolutions that became the Global Model (it's a gen 1 U-based building - it was before the packaged model and the Global model), and everyone likes a fire now and again. The Global will stay between 60 an 80 year round without one, so it's not needed unless one makes changes (back hallways and the like) that deviate from passive solar best practices. For colder areas, the Global can get a 2nd outer greenhouse area that absolutely guarantees that a fire's not needed.

You owe it to yourself to rent a global model for a couple of days in the winter, and schedule a tour of the Phoenix while you're there (it has a double greenhouse). I guarantee you that when you're standing in a room at dawn on a below freezing morning, with heat radiating off the walls and floor, that it'll turn your head inside out. It works.

 

[arkmundi]

I'm in the process of designing a retirement home in Clinton, MA, so read through the thread with interest. Thanks for the posted videos. I'm currently inclined towards a small house and in that vein am reading Lloyd Kahn's Tiny Homes: Simple Shelter. Anyone in the process of thinking about building a home owes it to themselves the favor of a read. Best!

 

[2007blueprius]

dont missunderstand me Andy, I love your input, and I love the idea of an Earthship, just here are afew concerns I came across while looking into it.

Tires honestly I never been a big fan of, I done all the reading, no need to quote, even presented it to the building deparment got cleared from the EPA hell they were all for it even offer grants for such recycling, just personally looked like a lot of work I am not that young anymore, and honestly Reynolds went all out with these buildings some of this recycling is what turns most people off,

for me, to pound all those tires, chicken wire mud and stucco looked like too much trouble, if I had to build something this massive I would probably try Rammed Earth walls, do a google search look at some pictures they are awsome, and I have a large compressor allready and a loader tractor, I could go to town on that.

the one thing that really turned me off the tires, talking to a neighbor which I trust his experiences, he mentioned that at some point in the back yard there was this round impression where nothing would grow, despite his efforts over the years, when he had enough he dug it out sure enough there was a tire probably burried during construction,

now I read about the off gassing and the pro arguments, it just got me thinking how else can this be accomplished, and with Rammed Earth once the forms are pulled off you are done, no stucco, paint, a lot more enviromentally responsible and when you are dead it all melts back down.

windows, there is a way to calculate all this I can look it up if there is an interest, but bottom line there is a balance between R value and SHGC ( solargain heat coeficient I believe it stands for ), each pane decreases 15% SHGC, 2 0n the outside and 2 maybe just one at the living space do the math, then if you go for plain double panes, R value is not much, add coatings and argon, SHGC goes down, all in all somebody that kew better pitch in on a different forum and schoolen me into all this, I did not want to believe it at first but I ran the math myself, sure enough he had a point.

Conclusion was a good quality tripple pane on the outside performed better than 2 walls of double panes, which for the month of januarry were netting negative, while the triples netted positive, further more as you noticed the green house tends to stay about half way between living space and outside, going the tripple pane route on the outside only makes the greenhouse area living space at the same temp as the rest of the house. just a different aproach, is all I am saing, I was all about true earthship design dont change a thing when this was presented to me, further more I dont remember the exact argument but angled glass did not make much sense either, pain to watterproof to begin with, but did not offer much gain compared to vertical glass design, but most importantly in the hight of summe the SHGC of vertical glass was was much less, now this was all calculated using real weather station averages for the past 20 years, some by hand some with softwares such as RESFEN, THERM, cool stuff and they are free look them up

now that you mentioned it I knew about the foundation and frostlines, couple other things you brought up, I watched the entire off grid build this winter, several seminars and most the videos you posted,

all in all I am all for it just some things I am not sure if they were verry well thought out, Taos is considerably milder climate, hardly ever sees a cloud, beeing from michigan, you know the clouds come in in the fall and you don't see much sun till May, with clear skyes most of the time can see how one of these buildngs can recover fairly quickly after a cold nght, and of course some fire is nice etc.

anyways, one of the lots I have is a little too narow for this, the other have too much to clear, budget, time, speccific location, those are some factors fo me, loans are out of the question for this project, whatever money I have it got put towards tools such as a backhoe tractor, a saw mill, lots are wooded, why buy the lumber, I only plan on buying what I can't make, I need to find some time to go out there it is allready warming up, this year I may barely get arround to clear and landscape a bit, ditches and mowhills, I'll post pics when I get a chance

George

 

[Punx0r]

Is there any reason for the inclusion of tyres in the walls other than as a means of utilising them as a waste product?

 

[2007blueprius]

not necessarily, neither are the cans, the whole concept about Earthship biotecture is to go all out and not only create sustainable living with minimum if any operating expenses, ( other than the innitial cost ), but deal with some enviromental issues while at it and tires is one of them, back when they first started so were cans, now they are recycleble, esp in Michigan not an issue, some bottles are not and honestly some collored glass makes a pretty wall, as a side note Heineken at some point made rectangular bottles with recycling in mind.

after all the reading I have done, I dont see any reason to be concerned not to use them either, if anything a personal prefrence of mine to rather not, alsoif anything the main reason for using tires other than recycling is that anybody, fit enough can build a very massive wall, very low teck with plain simple tools, like a shovel leve and a sledge, it does not require expensive machinery, the dirt is usually on site and tires are free, might even get paid to haul them away, Michigan had some grants for such ideas.

it is not verry different than Rammed Earth costruction, the tires are forms that are left in place, and the dirt does not require to be a certain mixture, true rammed earth doesnt either but most builders cheat with cement, another enviroemental issue, an the way they lean the wall against the birm, I honestly cant figure out a better way to do it,

there are many other things about earthships that are very simple yet well though out, the plumbing for example in most homes, bathroom is at one end of the house hitchen at the other laundry somewhere to the side all because someone had some bright idea that it is well designed that way, creating a maze of pipes under the house with too much fitting an possible leaks, in an earthship kitchen , laundry and bath are against 1 plumming wall with minimal plumbing.

since reading into this you start looking at the buildings arround you in a different light, especially milion dollar mamoths, with large cheap leaky windows pointing North, just because that is where the street is and its got to look good from the street, right?

further you start reading about Passiv Haus, and an Earthship roof is a Passiv Haus roof essentiallly, than you look at the expensive subdivission next door, and in the winter you can count the trusses, again milion dolar uninsulated barns, its like having X-ray vision, and the only window pointing south is the small 1x1 bath window, all the large ones are pointing west, because thats where the road is, but that is ok, because they have a 2, 5 ton AC condensers to combat the late afternoon summer sun.

I ran the numbers for my area, again based on real metereoloogical data, and if your desired temperature is 70F, theoretically you still have to heat up your house in july, not much but a little bit, however most homes are built to work as a greenhouse in the summer and paper bag shelter in the winter.

I was sold on an Earthship the moment I found out about them, it just makes sense and nothing else does, unless the street happened to be due south of the house but even than that is the only thing they got right.

the only thing that deters me from a pure Earthship are some personal circumstances, like the lot beeing too narrow, too flat, holds watter, most of these can be dealt with but it gets complicated and expensive, there is so much I can do, and a mortgage defies the whole concept, there are some other resourses I have available on site, and looking at Passiv Haus buildings, I realise that you dont need as much solar gain if your losses are 15% the average building, so I can do with either less verry expensive windows, or if doing as manny might not need that rocket stove, not even in Michigan, but that is a much stricter standard, it also is a bit more authorities friendly as it can be done in many different ways, most conventional methods, thou rather oppen minded my inspector had some reservations when I told him I wanted a tire house, than tell him you want to catch rainwatter and recycle it, oh boy, again it is doable, but lots of leg work and birocracy to get all the right signoffs,

at the moment I am leaning towards something a bit more conventional with as manny Earthship design features as possible, sealed up like a Passiv Hause, no green house, no grey watter planters, but run the plumbing with all that in mind, what they don't know wont hurt them, we'll put up a " Sun room addition " later after we get the CFO

 

[Punx0r]

Interesting. It does seem on the face of it that like rammed-earth (with the aid of mechanisation) would be a viable alternative to tyres.

I'm all for efficient engineering and efficient use of resources. Just less so about the politics, dogma, sandals and hallucinogenics that come attached to many of these kinds of ideas. I'm also not overly keen on growing cress in my own poop.

 

[2007blueprius]

I'm half way in between, I think the excessive recycling is what deterred lots of people from this concept, aside from that, the tire wall is very labor intensive and requires several finishing coats, they still employ some concrete, Buttresses I think they call them if memory serves, where I grew up there, were several buldings/castles built with 8 ft wide walls, dirt river rock, etc, it depends of local resources I guess, same effect can be accomplished in many ways.

they took it a little too far with all the recycling, thou the water aspect and planters, does not deter me, part of it is more suited for the arid south west, in Michigan I would have so much water I wouldn't know what to do with, I'd have to dump the cisterns from time to time to get some fresh water in there so there is no sense overdoing it, I do however like the idea of collecting rain water, and a south sun room that stretches the length of the house..

you got to take some good with some bad, I need a bigger boat soon so might as well put some thought into it, I am aiming for a neutral house, that doesn't require massive amounts of energy to stay comfortable, yet passive in nature, some so called net zero houses are just a typical bad construction with 10 acres of solar 6 large windmills and a small beaver dam instead of grid power


I am also on a budget, no need to get carried away, and by budget I am not only referring to $$$, I can always make more, but I don't want to overcomplicate it to the point my grandchildren may finish it, part of the consideration is size, I have a family of 3, no need for 6000sqft, 12 bathrooms and 4 berdooms, 6 kitchens you get the idea.

now what did I do with those last drawings, I got to ask the wife.

George

 

[AndyH]

Is there any reason for the inclusion of tyres in the walls other than as a means of utilising them as a waste product?

Yes - the tires and other products are selected because they are universal waste products of modern civilization - they're raw materials that are easier and less expensive to find almost anywhere on the planet than wood.

Mike Reynolds makes that very clear in his writing and lectures. While some, especially in the US, think it's all about recycling, it's really about finding a way for humans to build their own housing. He says ants, wasps, bees, otters, and everything else on the planet can build their own house - humans should be able to as well.

 

[2007blueprius]

to continue Andys comments, I really believe Reynolds is due for a Nobel prize or something like that, althou some of his methods may be a bit difficult for your average American to digest.

but on the comment about ants and bees, us humans used to build our own shelter up untill a couple generations ago, along with the industrial era, economics and mortgages, its almost like evolution has started to go in reverse and the human race gets dumber/weaker/fatter every minute, not only to need to have others build your house, but some to feed you, and some to get you arround and more to insure you, forbid something ever goes wrong, we live in this perfect bubble where a tornado can level a trailer park and next week insurance magically rebuilds it at no cost to the people, really, anybody buy that $hit.

this gets into some philosofical stuff, but on my family tree my parents and inlaws are the only ones that are clueless how to put a roof up, grandparents did it themselves, never heard on words like insurence and mortgage and interest, one of my grandmas is pushing 100 still going strong, and since looking into this I realize both my grandparents homes were esentially Earthships ( not the reynolds kind ) but only southern windows one room wide, adobe built, they did not have a fancy name for it just common practice, Earthships are more about going to the basics with a tecky twist and modern ameneties ( no out house )

As for using wood, my lots are wooded and I have to clear some anyhow, figured I'll rig up a sawmill and put it to some good use, in all honesty taking down some trees t obuild a lifetime shelter is not that big of an impact, if you do it right it may last more than a generation, the Earthships use the VEgas which to me are overkill, and in a sense waistfull but oh well it can easily be offset by the minimal carbon footprint of the building, I probably butn more natural gas in a winter in my curent house than the footprint of putting one of these up.

the real issue with deforestation is the massive sccale projects, and I notice a trend in my area, one gastation gets leveled and another just like it takes its place, WTF, that is iresponsible just because loans make it posible to sign some paperwork and snap your fingers, most people don't see the full picture anymore.

Part of my reasoning to put something up is becauce my boy is young and I want him to witness this, or he will grow with the blinders on like everybody else, I consider myself fortunate to have caught my Grandparents alive and witness theyr ways, I was otherwise brought up in a highrise with all the stores downstairs, one would not have to leave the building in a lifetime, looking back the barbwire was missing.

 

[AndyH]

dont missunderstand me Andy, I love your input, and I love the idea of an Earthship, just here are afew concerns I came across while looking into it.

Tires honestly I never been a big fan of, I done all the reading, no need to quote, even presented it to the building deparment got cleared from the EPA hell they were all for it even offer grants for such recycling, just personally looked like a lot of work I am not that young anymore, and honestly Reynolds went all out with these buildings some of this recycling is what turns most people off,

for me, to pound all those tires, chicken wire mud and stucco looked like too much trouble, if I had to build something this massive I would probably try Rammed Earth walls, do a google search look at some pictures they are awsome, and I have a large compressor allready and a loader tractor, I could go to town on that.

I do understand - I've been where you appear to be. It all looks hard - looks strange. Cob? Stucco? Natural plasters? Tires? WTF?! That's why I'm trying to at least clear up the obvious misconceptions -- because now I know it's all much easier than working with 2x4s or pulling romex or trying to get lines of shingles straight on a new roof. :lol:

The tire walls ARE rammed earth walls. They have forms that don't have to be removed and only need to be transported once - to the job site. They keep tires out of landfill and leachate out of ground water, and forms that can be used again after the house biodegrades. I get it - you're talking about earth block or something - and that's fine. I realize we in the West love our gadgets and often have equipment sitting around looking for a purpose. If you think rammed earth blocks are the way to go, consider adobe. Same result with no pounding and you still get to use the tractor. There's a guy down here in S Texas that has an earth block machine, and the Open Source Ecology project has a great earth block machine as well. http://opensourceecology.org/portfolio/ceb-press/

the one thing that really turned me off the tires, talking to a neighbor which I trust his experiences, he mentioned that at some point in the back yard there was this round impression where nothing would grow, despite his efforts over the years, when he had enough he dug it out sure enough there was a tire probably burried during construction,

This might sound nit-picky to some, but it's important to understand that most common knowledge about passive solar comes from the viewpoint of 'modern' stick-built building practitioners and is incorrect. I'm not trying to change your mind, but want to make sure you're using good information to support your decision. Sorry if that sounds harsh but you said you read all the references but still seem stuck on bad tire info. Yes, tires degrade and leach. As has been documented repeatedly, a tire kept wet will degrade, and a tire in the sun will degrade. What you're seeing is what happens with most used tires on the planet. That's why, when you read the research papers linked earlier, they shred the tires and put them in water. They already know they don't leach when they're kept dry and in the dark.

A tire used as a form for a rammed earth wall will NOT be wet and will not be exposed to the sun. It will remain inert. It will not degrade, will not leach, will not burn. There are 40+ year old Earthships in the wild, and there are Earthships that have burned - the info's known.

windows, there is a way to calculate all this I can look it up if there is an interest, but bottom line there is a balance between R value and SHGC ( solargain heat coeficient I believe it stands for ), each pane decreases 15% SHGC, 2 0n the outside and 2 maybe just one at the living space do the math, then if you go for plain double panes, R value is not much, add coatings and argon, SHGC goes down, all in all somebody that kew better pitch in on a different forum and schoolen me into all this, I did not want to believe it at first but I ran the math myself, sure enough he had a point.

Conclusion was a good quality tripple pane on the outside performed better than 2 walls of double panes, which for the month of januarry were netting negative, while the triples netted positive, further more as you noticed the green house tends to stay about half way between living space and outside, going the tripple pane route on the outside only makes the greenhouse area living space at the same temp as the rest of the house. just a different aproach, is all I am saing, I was all about true earthship design dont change a thing when this was presented to me, further more I dont remember the exact argument but angled glass did not make much sense either, pain to watterproof to begin with, but did not offer much gain compared to vertical glass design, but most importantly in the hight of summe the SHGC of vertical glass was was much less, now this was all calculated using real weather station averages for the past 20 years, some by hand some with softwares such as RESFEN, THERM, cool stuff and they are free look them up

For a conventional house (one with insulated walls and mechanically conditioned space inside) then yes - use the tables, rules of thumb, and all the fantastic construction knowledge available in the western world - there's plenty of good info there! But that's not what an Earthship is. It is not a conventionally constructed building. If one is trying to calculate the R or U value of a rammed earth wall they might get a number, but it won't be a useful number - because we using different pieces of physics here. In a conventional house, we have low interior mass, are heating or cooling the air, and want to keep that energy inside. Insulation, R value, U value, etc. - use it, love it. But - but but - this is important! We do not want to impede energy movement in passive solar thermal mass. We want a LOT of mass - and we want the energy to freely move into and out of it. We want to do that because physics and the real world tells us that when we have 100 tons of earth wrapped around a room, and that earth is 70°F, and the air temperature in the room drops to 69, that energy will move from the high to the low energy location - the mass will heat the room. Same for cooling - hot air, cool mass, the energy moves from the air into the mass and the room is cooled.

The Global model Earthship is an highly evolved system - it's a machine evolved to do all the work required to do the jobs associated with living in a house. That includes the greenhouse. One does not want to replace any of the glass with coated or triple panes and they don't want vertical glass and then remove the greenhouse. If they do, they'll have a 'Packaged Model' Earthship - and we already know that building doesn't heat or cool as well as a Global, we know the grey water planters add too much humidity inside the house (and ill-informed building departments don't want 'sewage' in living spaces), we know that air circulation doesn't work as well, we know that relying on skylights to stay leak-free for 50 years is a challenge, etc.

The greenhouse glass angle is set where it is because, using the permaculture goal of getting multiple functions from each object, it is perpendicular to the winter solstice sun angle for maximum solar gain when you need it the most. Additionally, the angle reflects a significant amount of sunlight and thus heat during the summer. You don't want to shade the greenhouse because you're growing food and treating grey water for re-use - you want light. Also, the heat on the greenhouse floor creates the air updraft that exits through the vents above - and that's what creates the thermal siphon that pulls air through the cooling tubes. Changing the glass or the glass angle degrades water treatment, reduces food production, and kills the AC system!

One small change by someone that doesn't fully grasp how all the pieces fit together will create a building that doesn't work. That's one of the reasons the Earthship folks started an Academy - to show more people what works and why, and what doesn't work and why.

now that you mentioned it I knew about the foundation and frostlines, couple other things you brought up, I watched the entire off grid build this winter, several seminars and most the videos you posted,

all in all I am all for it just some things I am not sure if they were verry well thought out, Taos is considerably milder climate, hardly ever sees a cloud, beeing from michigan, you know the clouds come in in the fall and you don't see much sun till May, with clear skyes most of the time can see how one of these buildngs can recover fairly quickly after a cold nght, and of course some fire is nice etc.

anyways, one of the lots I have is a little too narow for this, the other have too much to clear, budget, time, speccific location, those are some factors fo me, loans are out of the question for this project, whatever money I have it got put towards tools such as a backhoe tractor, a saw mill, lots are wooded, why buy the lumber, I only plan on buying what I can't make, I need to find some time to go out there it is allready warming up, this year I may barely get arround to clear and landscape a bit, ditches and mowhills, I'll post pics when I get a chance

George

I do get the age thing - I'm 50+ and the thought of pounding 700+ tires seemed like I'd need a ton of Motrin and maybe a side of morphine after each work day. Then I interned on a project in E Texas and found out that it's a lot easier than I thought. I laugh now watching many of the videos where people are swinging the 8 pound sledge over their heads - it's totally not necessary! Gravity works - it will pull the hammer. Don't get me wrong - it's work! But the blisters on my heels caused more discomfort than arms, shoulders, or back.

Yup - I know what Michigan winters are like. I'll guarantee you that a Keewenaw winter is unique as well - most folks down-state don't understand how life works in the UP. That's why I said in an earlier post that one doesn't need clear skies for passive solar Earthship style to work. There is still solar energy coming through the clouds - the greenhouse and floors still get some heat even on cloudy days. But the bulk of the work is done by the thermal mass. It's the combination of the tire walls, the 4' of compacted earth behind them, the floor and the large bubble of mass under the building that keep the temperature so even year round. The building was designed to work anywhere in the world with materials easily found there. It's not designed around special windows only made in Germany (as we currently have with PassivHaus/Passive House). Again - a conventional 1970s passive solar house (S windows, overhang, insulation, cement slab floor) requires regular sunlight or aux heating because it simply doesn't have enough thermal mass. "Not enough thermal mass" is a disease Earthships cure.

I really do understand what you're saying - I was absolutely where you are before I went to Taos. I have all the books, ebooks, engineer's report, all the videos, everything I can find in torrents and eco-community libraries. I was afraid the building wouldn't stay cool for a Texas summer, that the cooling tubes might grow mold, that it would take a crew of hundreds to pound all the tires. I mean really - how can a few plants clean water? More inputs just expanded the already huge list of unknowns and worries.

I started studying environmental science and learning about how wetlands work. Then I stayed in the Global model building in January, 2012. Then I worked on one in hot, humid E Texas and got to spend a week talking with the folks living in the house. Tire pounding is much easier than hauling forms and running equipment. Cooling tubes remove humidity but don't grow mold. The buildings do stay warm in the winter even when the sun hasn't been out for more than three days - and the battery bank was at 97% full and there was 40 gallons of 110°F water ready to go. These are some of the most tested, tweaked, evolved, peer-reviewed buildings on the planet.

I'm now 120% 'all in' on Earthships. My solar systems (PV and hot water) are staged in the garage along with the water organizing module - once I close on a piece of land I'll be in full Permaculture mode.

edit... just stumbled on this: you might enjoy a drive to MO for a workshop:
http://opensourceecology.org/microhouse-workshop/

The central activity of the workshop is the construction of a MicroHouse shell using open source equipment including a tractor, soil pulverizer, and brick press. Extreme manufacturing concepts of parallel processing and prefabrication are applied to achieve rapid on-site assembly. Philosophy of open source development is also emphasized, and the participants become more than just builders, they become active collaborators in the MicroHouse evolution.

- Fundamentals of passive solar design and natural ventilation
- Building envelope basics and importance of detailing
- Understanding of thermal mass and insulation in relation to performance
- Open source development philosophy
- Hand-sketching basics

 

[AndyH]

I should have revisited this sooner. I think you are correct, that a passive thermal heated house won't heat itself in your climate.
It will need supplemental heat of some kind.

Depends on the person and the house. PassivHaus practitioners in central Alaska have found that building to the PassivHaus/Passive House spec reduces energy demand by 85-90%. Most of the building's heat can be supplied by cooking, humans, and hot water use (heating the house when one takes a shower). Solar thermal works most of the year; 1 cord of wood does the rest of the job. Remember - that's Fairbanks. PV isn't very useful there, but the combination of passive solar design and solar thermal collectors is - even on cloudy days. http://www.reina-llc.com/

However, one benefit you may be overlooking in the design of a true earthship, is the trombe wall like solar room will never experience the full brunt of the winter cold. so a reasonably affordable double pane glass south wall is then backed up with another set of wall and windows to the actual interior of the house. Yeah, your greenhouse room won't grow much in winter, but it will in the spring, before the roof shade cuts off the light too much for much more than houseplants. But it the dead of winter, that's still natural light coming into your living space, but the real interior wall may only see 20F, while outside it's a temp I can't even contemplate, even after a life of ski mountaineering, and camping in snow caves.

Natural light fills Earthships from sunrise to sunset. I'm at a point where I need additional light to read but didn't need any additional lighting once the sun came up. The greenhouse actually will grow food year round. By design it must, after all, as these garden beds are the manufactured wetland that cleans grey water for re-use. Banana plants are tropical - they cannot freeze - yet they're in full growth on the mesa north of Taos - with well below freezing nights and just above freezing days. The floor of the greenhouse is part of solar collector/thermal mass system - the greenhouse is in the low 80s even with it's 45°F outside. Here's actual data collected in a 2 bedroom Global model in Taos - compare/contrast temperatures winter and summer: http://www.earthshipironbank.com.au/research.html Note that the lowest temperature noted in the greenhouse was 8°C (46°F) - and it was 12°C (54°F) on a minus 18°C (0°F) night.

Re the flat roof, that's just how you build a roof cheaper, in a place where snow loads are only moderate. They virtually always leak. That's the style in NM. Like you said, snow melts in a week or so. You will need a steeper roof for sure, but you can still do a standing seam or channel drain metal roof and drink the water that comes from it.

Sorry, no. The Global model roof can be built with either vigas (12 inch diameter logs) or engineered trusses. Either way, the roof will take the full snow load - this building is designed to meet code where it's planted. The roof is standing seam metal and all penetrations are forward over the greenhouse. In addition, the rear of the roof is heated with a couple of loops from the solar hot water system. The roof is designed to collect precipitation and channel it to the water storage cisterns year round. It doesn't need to be shoveled in upstate NY (lake effect snow), Colorado, or Wyoming - it will work in Michigan as well. It's as close to a self-shoveling roof that I've yet seen.

 

[AndyH]

Part of my reasoning to put something up is becauce my boy is young and I want him to witness this, or he will grow with the blinders on like everybody else, I consider myself fortunate to have caught my Grandparents alive and witness theyr ways, I was otherwise brought up in a highrise with all the stores downstairs, one would not have to leave the building in a lifetime, looking back the barbwire was missing.

I whole heartedly agree with your position and decisions, prius. No worries at all. I'm in a similar position in that I'm long past thinking that modern society has a real clue. I want to get back to something resembling a normal life, want to permaculture the hell out of a piece of land, and show my 11 year old son that mortgages, utility bills, and food bills are optional. And I'm trying to do it at least carbon-neutral, but think that carbon negative is do-able.

Back to work...land shopping...

 

[2007blueprius]

so that's why you went missing? you've been busy interning, I love the enthusiasm, I was at the lot today after work, we had some downpours in the morning, holy moly I had standing water in the driveway a good 4 foot higher than the draining ditch, I can't even get to the back without a canoe, yeah I'm not sure about a slab floor,

I love it out there thou, I can't bring myself to leave when I go, we are planning a full day tomorrow, I opened up some drainage ditches hope it starts going down, honestly I am afraid to move the tractor, or it may sink.

there are wetlands nearby, this is relatively higher, but its undisturbed land, the darkest soil I ever saw, and moss and stuff it soaks water like a sponge, I hate to mess with it but I got to, the plan this year is to clear it, and do some grading that is about as far as we may get.



these are couple of my last sketches, I used to do a lot more detail only to realize I need to start over so lately I have been just putting my thoughts on paper, this is after 2 drafting books,

I like pole houses for their minimalistic impact, as I said, I love it out there, I hate to clear it, but I have to at least grade it a bit to get it draining some.

this concept is a bit of a hybrid between the 2, its more compact as a Passivhaus, the angles are all worked out for my area the southside of the house will get direct sunlight on the floor, the northside on the back wall, best I can do for mass is terra tiles, laim compared to Earthships, but if you look into pole buildings there are several ways to frame them, girts and purlins on the outside perimeter, or 2x4 stick build on the inside, I figured both, creating a 12 inch cavity thermal bridge free, works to about R40, 18 inch would be R60-70 gets pretty close to Passivhaus, at that point I would not need as much solar gain or mass since in theory the needs of the building would be a fraction of what is considered normal.

this is a compromise mostly due to my circumstances, the local utility company sells used poles for $1 a foot, I got more lumber on site that I know what to do with, cellulose is cheap etc, plus in Michigan residential under 3500 sqft as long as it is nothing crazy architectural plans are not required and I am aiming for about 1200, the Earthship biotecture plans are 10k, plus I got to find a Michigan licensed architect to sign off, and the health department, it is doable but because of its nature there is significant legwork and expense involved, I could have this roof up before I start pounding tires.

I still want an Earthship, might do a garage/greenhouse at a later date, but I did borrow some concepts, I do plan to collect the water, just not in the plan, what they don't know wont hurt them, I may add a sun room the entire length of the house at a later date, right now I just want to move out there already.

we'll see after I do some digging how it looks, I may change my mind next spring if pull it off this year an get that property draining properly.

my initial thoughts were a massive building, but that is a bitch to waterproof and insulate and you get into high dollar foams, etc,

I got to look up permaculture I come across it all the time I still don't know what it is

oh and this is what I ment by rammed earth, also look up syrewall?? not compressed earth blocks
https://www.google.com/search?q=rammed+earth&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=F2xgU__8EqelsASRtICgBg&sqi=2&ved=0CDIQsAQ&biw=1301&bih=592

as an alternative to tires, by all means I am not against tires, I'm just not too excited about them, but it is pretty hard to duplicate.

this particular lot is too narrow for a Earthship, last I figured it out it would leave me with about 50 feet front yard to the south staring at a wall of trees, its fine now but 20 years later may be shaded, my other lot would work 330 ft east to west 600 due south, and it has a berm too, but that is untampered woods I got a lot of clearing to do there I could be bussy for a while just clearing .

to clarify the window comments, it has nothing to do with the building, I'd have to look it up again to elaborate, I am not that good with this, but in principle say inside desired temp 70F, maintained by whatever method, outside my local HDD ( heating degree days figured by 20 years of data collected by the local airport weather station) than you can calculate the heat los in watts per square meter per hour.

than figure the solar exposure, again same weather station data, with specifics to our area, in the month of January only plain double panes net negative, as in more loss than gain, that is not considering the rest of the structure just heat loss versus gain for my instance, it gets more involved but no need to stress it in Texas, plain doubles are plenty.

oh and about the solar angle, I did not realize this till I started drawing, I can argue with you that the winter solstice is the incorrect day to pick for maximum exposure, it isn't the day you need it the most, not for me, sometimes in January the 31st I think is the day, that is the coldest day of the year again data based on that weatherstation, that is when you want full sun, if you design for full exposure at solstice by that date the sun has already climbed some and you are not getting all the sun you could get on the day you needed it the most, also for my latitude the summer sun bounces considerably more off vertical glass than the proper angle, offsets a minimal heat gain loss in the winter by a large margin, its a compromise that proves more efficient overall, while loosing some gain in the winter, I am also loosing a very significant amount in july, when heat gain is a bad thing.

I love the Reynolds talks and all that they have done, and I have nothing bad to say about their work, these are just some aspects I found while looking into it, if you would like to know more I'll dig up my notes and figure all this for your location together, and than we can argue some more. took me a while to get it through my thick skull, at the time I came across this info I was 120% sold on a pure Earthship at all costs

George

 

[2007blueprius]

I had a chance to watch the Baha build just now, I cant get over how dry and arid the landscape is, there is no way this will work for me, I was at the lot today dug some ditches to get it draining, should have taken some pictures, under the green there is black soaked muck, I would love an earthen floor, but cant imagine what would taker to keep it dry in the first place, still, there are so many good concepts to borrow, I would love to figure out how to build something this massive but I can already see it sinking in the muck, the warehouse I work in, next door to DTW airport, sunk a few inches this winter due to the frost heaves, and the concrete parking lot was poured a couple years back its now all cracked,

the landscape here is much more alive, and solid ground is not that solid, compared to new mexico and baha, where they have to use jackhammers to break loose the dry compacted clay, here this time of year you have to watch where you step or you may sink, I forget which part of Texas you are from I traveled the state several times, west of Dallas, sure why not, any closer to the coast, I'm not so sure, Montana, possibly, Exeter, MI we'll see once I have it all cleared and graded and ditched, well see how it looks next spring, right now there is no way and if I were to hire a crew it would cost a mortgages worth before I pound the first tire.

by the time I left today I had freed up some old drainage ditches, there was a good stream leaving the property, eyeball meter could fill up a 5 gal bucket in a few seconds, I am still leaning towards a pole house and suspend the floor 4 ft above grade, but if I do that, so much for thermal mass.

George

 

[AndyH]

Hi George,

Yes, it's a very wet spring up there. Feel free to send some water this way - we just went to stage 3 water restrictions earlier than any year in history. I think your spring observations will be very useful as time goes on. It sounds like you'll need to at least provide drainage away from the building site and may have to bring dirt in. As climate continues to change, you can expect more downpours and more flooding. Anything you can do to divert a LOT of water will be useful, I think. I'm not an expert on Permaculture earthworks yet, so just consider this to be a rough suggestion. You could plan the property first, select your foundation footprint, then bring in heavy equipment to build swales or ridges to move water away from the home site as well as to divert water around the building. Maybe add a pond and use the 'scrapings' to build up the house location. Then probably perimeter trench/hose/gravel, and plastic under the foundation or slab. Got any pictures?

The BMS project basically stopped when everyone went broke and had to get a job. I wanted to keep my prices as low as possible so that more folks could build packs, but wasn't making any money. I was putting all my profit and some of my retirement cash into the dev/testing process. I'm glad to see that it's coming back to life as the V4 BMS is the best I've used. I'm still using my prototype in half a case in my 21S scooter and it hasn't failed yet. It's been rained on and baked - and I mean baked as in balancing a 60Ah Thunder Sky pack with some slightly damaged cells on a 110°F day. I started the business to grow an Earthship fund. No fund, but I've got plenty of resisters and a kick-ass BMS.

- Geoff Lawton has a couple of videos on-line that give an overview of water-moving earthworks as part of site design. They were posted in advance of a permaculture design course that's underway now. You'll need to give an email address to access the vids but they won't bother or spam you. Intro to earthworks: http://www.geofflawton.com/fe/64068-earthworks-course Property overview (completed earthworks): http://www.geofflawton.com/fe/65840-student-property-tour

This guy's got a few videos that show his road construction, pond, swales, and chinampa work in the UP. Here's a look at his ground - familiar, I bet!: [youtube]i0uP-vdXMv8[/youtube]

- Pole barn and tile: Stage 1 thermal mass could be to use 2 layers of sheetrock on the inside walls. You could build to Passive House standards (or close) inside a metal building, or wrap the building in a ton of foam, like the REMOTE wall system: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1leyQtqVV-A

- There's some good scientific data on building performance. Check the numbers again from Martin Freney. He's an architect, industrial designer, and he instrumented a couple of Global Model Earthships as part of his PhD work. His papers have been peer reviewed and published - this is real info. http://www.earthshipironbank.com.au/research.html Check the summer and winter temperature charts. See how the greenhouse actually runs cooler in the summer and is warmer in the winter? Thats all about glass angle and regular old dual pane window units. One of the papers does an excellent job of talking thermal details: http://www.ibpsa.org/proceedings/bs2013/p_1137.pdf This article is related: http://renew.org.au/earthships/

The focus of Freney's PhD work is on overall sustainability and carbon footprint and this is high up on my list of requirements as well. This chart from his page really hits home:


The building on the far left is a 'low embodied energy' Earthship in which adobe has been used instead of cement in the can walls. It has no berm, no greenhouse, and is insulated outside the tire wall. The next house is an adobe building, also off-grid. Note that it requires more than twice the heating/cooling energy (the purple section). The third is a full Global Model Earthship with greenhouse and berm, but reduced cement use. Note that in this and the next (also a standard Global Model, but with cement used for the inside walls) they require almost no heating/cooling energy (purple zone). building 5 is strawbale, 6 and 7 are rammed earth. After that there are various combinations of timber frame, brick, etc. Notice how much energy the greenhouse saves!

This is an old vid but still applicable. It's part of a 4-show "Global Gardener" series. This shows a passive solar house, also in S Australia (around -38°S) but is in higher country, so this would likely work well in mid-Srn Michigan. http://youtu.be/8_ZC3KTBxts?t=20m8s

- As far as I can tell, the area of the Global Model Earthship that can use more work is cooling, not heating. The building I worked on in E Texas had been built about 3 years ago, and was built after the Baja build but before Georgia. The ground is sandy, it's in dense forest land, and they get a TON of rain (Gulf coastal plain, E Texas pines, in the rough vicinity of Crockett) and while the ground drains, it floods first. It's hot, humid, damn wet. We had to do more water diversion work and add another layer of plastic in a couple of the berms. We also added the solar chimney vent boxes you can see in this image from the Georgia build:

Even with optimum glass angles and the standard 20' cooling tubes, summer was too hot in the greenhouse. The owner added shades for the greenhouse windows, but that also reduced the solar hot air siphon that pulls cool air through the N berm and cooling tubes. We added the solar chimney (extended vent boxes with windows and a 1/4 inch steel plate inside) so that air flow was increased even with the greenhouse windows partially covered. That's why I say that the glass calcs aren't important for this building - it has so much excess mass that it can be vented nearly year round. This building just doesn't need high-tech glass.

To better cool my building, should I build down here, I plan to use the solar vent boxes, 40 foot cooling tubes, and make the living space a foot deeper. Should I build somewhere in the west 1/2 of the UP, I might narrow it to 16'. Standard depth is about 17' but they can go to 19 or 20' without reworking the vigas or trusses for a hot area, and down to 15' for extremely cold areas.

Gack...too many words again.
Andy