Gas Prices Rising Fast

My not too distant future project is to set up my own bio-diesel plant on a small scale to run both mine and my wires cars on bio-diesel. My friend has successfully ran his Land Rover turbo diesel on his own home made bio dies for the last few yearsl. I am impatiently waiting until i can fully erect my middle finger up to the government. Im sitting on the train as i post this as there are just too many cars on the road, It costs me more to ride by train than it does to go by car but the train has a lot less damage on my stress levels and its going my way anyway whether I'm on it or not. ;)
 
Come on guys, it's pure greed. Middle eastern oil cost about $2 a barrel to extract, according to the oil minister of Saudi as viewed on 60 Minutes about a year ago. We want it. OPEC knows it. They have it. They can charge whatever they want. Do you blame them? I've actually sold things to people for less than they've offered, but I'm not a greedy sob. Most people are. want to pay less? I'm all for grain for oil. We have it. They want it. We should put a huge export tax on it going to oil producing countries.
 
Bush did as bad of job as had ever been done. Obama seemed to take it as a personal challenge to 1-up him, and he seems to have won.

Don't even acknowledge the political parties with a name. It's just one group of crooked thieves that stand up to lie in your faces.

They use the illusion of a party system to create that sports-team-like loyalty so the blind masses feel like they have a team to cheer for or something to oppose.
 
I think the above two posts are as clear and concise as possible on why things are the way they are.
 
Except Nixon.
 
Bush is by far worse than Obama or any other president. He wrecked the USA with his horrible policies.

In the Bush tax cuts businesses actually get a tax cut to outsource a job overseas. wtf ???

A trillion dollar war that was unpaid for, and nothing to show for it... WHERE IS OUR FREE OIL???? and WMDS????

I can go on and on but I dont have the time. Obama hasnt been great either but hes no where near as bad as Bush.


Oh and notice how NONE of the Republican presidential candidates mention his name??? It's always Reagan this, Reagan that. etc. They are embarrassed by what he did.
 
Jason27 said:
A trillion dollar war that was unpaid for, and nothing to show for it... WHERE IS OUR FREE OIL???? and WMDS????
Click to expand...

Is that what you were expecting from the war? The rape and pillaging of oil rich nations? I'd be asking 'Where was the second terrorist attack on American soil?' 'Where was the nuke heading towards Israel?' (well, actually, the answer to that question is probably Iran - one of the few anti-US islamic states that wasn't put under the pressure of occupation)

If free oil is what you were expecting, then war would have been an unjust war. But if it was to prevent terrorism, then I think its worked remarkably well.
 
Jason27 said:
Bush is by far worse than Obama or any other president. He wrecked the USA with his horrible policies.

In the Bush tax cuts businesses actually get a tax cut to outsource a job overseas. wtf ???

A trillion dollar war that was unpaid for, and nothing to show for it... WHERE IS OUR FREE OIL???? and WMDS????

I can go on and on but I dont have the time. Obama hasnt been great either but hes no where near as bad as Bush.


Oh and notice how NONE of the Republican presidential candidates mention his name??? It's always Reagan this, Reagan that. etc. They are embarrassed by what he did.
Click to expand...


Nope. They both took the identical paths, which is a game of how rapidly can your sink a country.

I agree, Bush took the cake for making extremely dumb policies and pointless war.

However! That's all a drop in the bucket compared to the devaluation of the dollar that has happened from the absurd fiat currency printing since Obama took office.

You realize, when folks are complaining about gasoline prices at $4/gal, $4 only buys you $2.70 worth of product since the massive devaluation of currency. At $4/gal, our gas is sold for less value than it was when it was $2 a gal 10 years ago.


Obama mastered the ultimate trick on the people (and I'm sure any other person would have done the same, they all have the same goal). He promised helping "main-street" and the working class rather than wall-street. Then, he bails out wall-street and the banking system on an unprecedented never-seen-in-history level, by just printing funny money, so that everyone making $10 an hour only has ~$7 of buying power with that $10, and if they had saved up $100,000 for retirement, you just paid $30,000 of it's value to support wall-street and banks.

Further, the ENTIRE CONCEPT of how capitalism works, the ONLY way it can work, is if things that can't survive are allowed to die. The banks that were 50x over capital extended should NOT have been allowed to survive, they operated in a way that ensures death and failure in exchange for huge short-term profits. Instead of letting them reap what they sewed, and letting millions of Americans benefit from that in the form of debt relief on housing/business etc (which would have made an unprecedented boom/stimulus in the economy), he supported them all, protected them from everything they had coming to them, and shuffled the burden they created onto the backs of all the peoples wages and savings in the form of an epic scale currency devaluation.


Bush did tons of seriously f'ed up things, and made some really really stupid destructive policy and wars. However, he didn't stick the knife in nearly as deep, or as sneakily as we've seen in the last few years.



This is why voting for Ron Paul this year is as simple of a choice as an IQ and vision test. Are you blind? No. Can you think? Yes. Check the Ron Paul box, or, since the party system is so corrupted they even dictate the ballots, write him in the box.
 
Elect me as supreme dictator and I'll straighten all this crap out in 30 days.:)
 
wesnewell said:
Elect me as supreme dictator and I'll straighten all this crap out in 30 days.:)
Click to expand...

I'll vote for that, as long as you prove to me you're not really a Sith Lord in disguise :wink:
 
what is this 'gas' you speak of?



+one of those 'massive' banks holds my retirement account and I'm personally glad it didn't die... even if what monies left is now hardly worth what it was.
because the other option, for me personally, would likely have been worse
 
ddk said:
what is this 'gas' you speak of?



+one of those 'massive' banks holds my retirement account and I'm personally glad it didn't die... even if what monies left is now hardly worth what it was.
because the other option, for me personally, would likely have been worse
Click to expand...


Should have pulled it out. There is no bank CD or mutual fund etc that is growing at nearly the rate the dollars value is dropping, and it's only dropped half of what it has to drop when the impact of the printing hits (which takes about 2 years historically).

Buy something with value.


Ironically, a great investment is buying US coins made with silver. It's pretty striking that it costs about $280 to buy $10 in pre 1964 quarters (which are 90% silver), because in 1964, the quarters value was substantially higher than the silver metal contained inside it.

They make an easy unit to deal with for a couple of reasons. It's legit US currency, so dispite the efforts they make to ban owning precious metals (or the Obamacare clause to tax and/or seize private citizens owning precious metals if deemed needed, don't ask me how that applies to health-care), you can just say it's worth it's face value, because it's legit currency. They don't have the balls to raid your kids piggy banks yet, or to declare having a piggy bank illegal...

Secondly, unlike bullion, they are easily recognizable sizes and weights and known silver %. This makes transactions very simple. No scale and cutting blocks of silver or gold etc. Just hand them a quarter from pre 1964, and they know it's worth $6.05.

At this point, the illusion of value is still strong in the waiting-to-crash fiat currency, so it's still most convenient to work with. However... we've seen what happens in so many examples of so many countries that go down this slipper money-printing slope, and it's just a matter of time before people aren't willing to trade goods of real value for slips of paper that say "federal reserve note" on them, no matter how many zero's you draw on the paper.
 
I'm right there with Ron Paul until he starts burying his head in the sand on foreign policy.

I love what he has to say about the Fed and most other things, but you can't over compensate for an over-active foreign policy and bad choices made over the last 30 - 40 years by acting like we can ignore the world around us and pretend threats like Iran don't exist.

That being said, right now we have mainly the opposite problem.

We opened pandora's box when we gave too much power to the executive branch and homeland security to declare "enemy combatants", but going too far the other way doesn't make sense either. :?

We are very VERY close to a true police state where all you have to do is be declared an "enemy of the state" and having your constitutional rights stripped away simply by being declared a terrorist of a sort, and now that we have summarily executed a US citizen in a foreign country with hellfire missiles, what is to stop the already over-reaching "powers that be" to execute citizens with out trial or legal protections inside the country?

I also agree that the president is largely a figure-head, and in many cases a "useful idiot" controlled by government, corporations and a complicit media.

We have to focus just as much if not more on the executive branch's members who stay on from administration to administration, don't think the president is consulted every time they make a decision to pursue a target or that they have control over all these actions, there aren't hours in the day for them to over-see it all personally.

How many of you have heard of the be-headings that have happened recently in the USA?!

(Mexican Drug Cartels mainly)

http://www.madcowprod.com/02022012.html

http://newsok.com/still-no-charges-for-okla.-man-held-in-slaying/article/3645855

Why are the important things not even being reported by mainstream media?

Why are these things not being talked about, why are freedoms being stripped, UAV's flying inside our country to spy on US citizens and instead of real problems being talked about and taken care of, it's who was at the latest celebrity funeral and what's the latest smartphone?

How has the TSA groping grandma done anything about making flying safer?

We accept this treatment with out as much as a whimper, why wouldn't this embolden them to do even more to invade our privacy?

We as a country are not involved, and are letting our politicians decide whats best instead of being representatives for the will of the people.

No small thing that a 4yr old's lunch was confiscated and replaced with a "school approved" lunch and a bill sent home to her mother!

http://www.fox26medford.com/enterta...ated-for-being-unhealthy-story,0,622623.story

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/exc...-lunch-replaced-for-not-being-healthy-enough/

This is the kind of large government that inevitably over-reaches and takes control of our lives while we sit fat and happy watching TV and not paying attention.
 
Obama was handed a $770 billion stimulus. $250 billion was tax cuts. So over $500 billion was spent, and where did it all go? Hardly anyone has seen tangible results.

Obama could have bought every American tax payer an ebike for $1000 and it only would have cost $156 billion.

Think of how many AMERICAN small companies could have profited from building ebikes on a massive scale. It could have put lots of people back to work virtually overnight... Wow that would have been awesome!

Just a thought
 
His foreign policy is perfect.

The conflicts only exist because we created them long ago, and now we keep trying to escalate.

The biggest terrorist organization in the world is NATO, and it's just our puppet to lead.

The biggest terrorist organization in the USA is homeland security.

The mexican drug cartels only exist due to amazingly foolish and insanely stupid drug laws making it so profitable. Otherwise it would be local farmers in the USA just growing plants and harvesting them. You don't see a lot of carrot or cabbage related violence.

The DEA has absolutely not reason to exist, and should immediately have all funding pulled, and those people should seek gainful employment. Likewise, people made criminals by absurd laws (remember, I could make you a criminal right now if I just passed a law against reading this thread on ES). This includes the 3million Americans imprisoned by Regans personal confused moral agenda for a "war on drugs."

The FED also should obviously be destroyed immediately. 4 private families get to control the printing and value of our currency and interest rates with no oversight of any type. They also made it illegal for newly created currency to go anywhere but a fed bank when it first is released, so they always get to use it before it's de-valued, that's how they have nothing to lose, and only gain from each new round of absurd bail-outs.

There should be no standing or deployed army, only national defense, and that can be as strong as they like, it's still going to cost pennies compared to rampantly going on oil crusades twisted up in some sort of sick war-for-morality illusion they package it in.

Ron Paul understands these obvious realities, AND has the balls to do things that are right, regardless of how many feathers of the evil control parties or special controlling families get ruffled.

It's a no-brainer.
 
I couldn't have said it better. Thanks for saving me so much typing Luke :lol:

On another note..

Gas prices SHOULD be high - it is our fault for designing a country that is so spread out, so petro dependent, and so designed for cars and minimal mass transit/shipping rail/etc, that we need to constantly battle for more oil.

The solution is to reduce the demand per capita.. which is higher in the North America than any other country..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum#Consumption

note: Saudi Arabia is a huge statistical blip since they do a lot of refining, shipping, and drilling..

What reduces demand? higher prices! Left to our own instincts, America will generally use as much energy as it possibly can, look at all the SUVs on the road transporting 1 person to work back and forth. We'll also continue to sprawl out our cities and plan poorly... until we are squeezed into doing otherwise. Things don't change until there's a crisis - we're really that stupid.

Bring the high prices on, i say. Let's force the low hanging efficiency fruit to be picked and start designing our country so that it will actually withstand peak oil, rather than fully falling apart..
 
When this thread drifts back to gas prices just want to note that we buy gas in liters in Canada and in the Vancouver area its about a $1.36 a liter at the moment.

Oh and to add my thoughts to the current arguement. Oil is sold on a world market for a world wide price set by speculators on the stock markets. Anything over that is profit and government taxes. I don't think the President sets your states gas taxes. The Congress and the Senate may well have a hand in the federal taxes so it doesn't matter which of those greedy bastards you vote for your still coming out on the short end.
 
liveforphysics said:
His foreign policy is perfect.

The conflicts only exist because we created them long ago, and now we keep trying to escalate.

The biggest terrorist organization in the world is NATO, and it's just our puppet to lead.

The biggest terrorist organization in the USA is homeland security.

The mexican drug cartels only exist due to amazingly foolish and insanely stupid drug laws making it so profitable. Otherwise it would be local farmers in the USA just growing plants and harvesting them. You don't see a lot of carrot or cabbage related violence.

The DEA has absolutely not reason to exist, and should immediately have all funding pulled, and those people should seek gainful employment. Likewise, people made criminals by absurd laws (remember, I could make you a criminal right now if I just passed a law against reading this thread on ES). This includes the 3million Americans imprisoned by Regans personal confused moral agenda for a "war on drugs."

The FED also should obviously be destroyed immediately. 4 private families get to control the printing and value of our currency and interest rates with no oversight of any type. They also made it illegal for newly created currency to go anywhere but a fed bank when it first is released, so they always get to use it before it's de-valued, that's how they have nothing to lose, and only gain from each new round of absurd bail-outs.

There should be no standing or deployed army, only national defense, and that can be as strong as they like, it's still going to cost pennies compared to rampantly going on oil crusades twisted up in some sort of sick war-for-morality illusion they package it in.

Ron Paul understands these obvious realities, AND has the balls to do things that are right, regardless of how many feathers of the evil control parties or special controlling families get ruffled.

It's a no-brainer.
Click to expand...

Isolationist policy no more stopped us from getting involved in the world wars of the past, why would that work now?

I agree some of these problems are our own policy's failures (especially in the Mid-East), but to say take the troops back from major bases in Europe , the Middle East and Asia is not the same as also ignoring threats to our security and stability altogether.

I have no idea why we maintain such a presence in Germany, Japan and North Korea, I would love to see all these bases closed and reduce our forces accordingly, however, to not maintain some global presence mainly in the form of human intelligence would be foolhardy.

The beginning of our major blunders in recent history IMHO was getting involved in trying to stop the spread of communism, mainly in Korea and Vietnam.

We have continued these blunders in the way we have handled all the recent wars, not fighting a total war, but a limited war with out defeating an enemy, but simply weakening them and prolonging warfare which makes no sense unless someone is getting rich selling weapons, etc. (this isn't just the result of one or two figurehead's actions, but a problem with-in government and corporate interests)

It's foolish to say we can simply pull out of everywhere and draw a line around our borders and pretend we aren't part of a global economy, and ignore geopolitical realities.

I can agree NATO has done wrong, but calling it a Terrorist Organization?

What actions are you referring to that would cause you to label the US and it's Allies Terrorists?

I can think of a few actions NATO has performed that I strongly disagree with, but to compare them to Al-Qaeda?

I'd have to see what you're using to support that statement to even take it seriously.
 
Define terrorism for me. (in your own words)

Perhaps it will help me see why you don't think they are the biggest terrorist group on the earth.
 
Ron Paul has one character trait that is political suicide. He tells the truth.
 
I was reading the January 2012 Car and Driver at the barber shop this afternoon and they had an article on oil imports. The USA is importing 50% down from 70%. Of that 50% imported, half of it comes from Canada these days.

Sort of interesting, don't you think? $5 gallon gas is going to mostly domestic sources and our Canadian friends up north. Makes me feel all warm and happy inside.
 
bigmoose said:
I was reading the January 2012 Car and Driver at the barber shop this afternoon and they had an article on oil imports. The USA is importing 50% down from 70%. Of that 50% imported, half of it comes from Canada these days.

Sort of interesting, don't you think? $5 gallon gas is going to mostly domestic sources and our Canadian friends up north. Makes me feel all warm and happy inside.
Click to expand...


That makes me happy too Dave!

I just wish we would pay the real price of the gasoline at the pump rather than paying part in the form of our tax dollars going to billions of dollars in petro business subsidies, and part at the pump when we buy it.
 
To show how much the energy companies love us a natural gas company is trying to build a pipeline 2 miles from us. It was originally supposed to be for importing gas. Now they want to use it for export.
 
Luke has it right on Ron Paul and foreign policy. There are actually measures in our Constitution for dealing with "pirates" and Thomas Jefferson utilized them for the first time in Libya called "marque and reprisal". What we need are international bounty hunters willing to sell out the so called "terrorists". The idea of war should be just as the Constitution demands all out WAR on the enemies of the republic and none of this peace keeping and policing BS. Then when we send the troops in we can let Genghis Kahn be the war general. Iran is no threat to us and Israel is the only one debating attacking anyone? How screwed up is that? Oil subsidies should end so the market forces can decide which direction the energy solution must take. I could probably make some concessions based on pollution in urban areas, but oil subsidies and the war machine must end! 8) 8)
 
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