Golden Motor 48V 1000W - Is this too good to be true?

[methods]

I am having trouble searching tonight.

http://www.goldenmotor.com/
More specifically the 48V 1000W motor

I am thinking about running two of these on Project Mayhem with a pair of modified ecrazyman controllers.

Can anyone help point me to threads about these 48V 1000W motors?

Is this buyer beware? Bad seller?

Has anyone run these at high voltage or a couple KW?

Thanks!

I will reward your help with lots of krazy stories :wink:

-methods

 

[Drunkskunk]

I'm going to take a guess here, but since Clytes are rated as 36V750 watt motors, and they are listing that as a 36V, 750 watt OR 48V 1000watt, then its nothing different.

 

[methods]

Except the price :wink:
I could almost buy 3 of those for the price of one X5.
If the performance is even 3/4's that of the X5 then 2 of them would put me in style.

Seems like X5's go for around $400 - $450 + shipping
These are about $100 + $80 for shipping.
If I buy 3 I bet I can get a deal on the shipping.

Thats what is making me suspicious. . . Too cheap.

Only thing I have heard lately was from that Bret White thread, some guy complaining that Golden Motors stuck him for $98 bucks.
Thats just one data point though.

Anybody want to sound off about your experiences with the motor or the seller?

I have seen a lot of pictures of people running what look like these hubs
I dont even know if they are geared or direct drive.
(EDIT, Ok, I looked around and found the info. Direct Drive.)

EDIT 2: Ok, what the hell am I supposed to make of this "performance" data?
http://www.goldenmotor.com/e-Bike-DIY/HBS-48V1000W%20Performance%20Data.pdf

Looks like they are running 1800W through it at 48V

Volts 47.85
Amps 37.46
Watts 1792.61
Eff. 68.4

I should be able to run two of these and make a nice 4KW "safe" setup.
Set my packs up as 44.4V 18Ah
Get a lot more riding in!
I can use the basic cheap controllers
Spread the weight out front and rear

Make for a hell of an uphill mud bike

Wonder what would happen if I ran one on a 24" rim and one on a 26" rim....

-methods

-methods

 

[Almasi]

You get what you pay for.... I wouldn't buy a 100$ hub motor

Robin

 

[slayer]

justin wanted to do the cross canada with the golden motor but on his trial ride he realized that it was not up to the task and changed his mind to go with 5304
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5652

 

[slayer]

but you know i was looking at the link you posted and it is very interesting for the prices ...of course you could not push it like you did for the 5305 but if you go easier on it it might be ok ...

 

[kazbluesky]

Yes it's too good to be true.

Im the guy who is still waiting for 95 dollars back. I might be wrong here (someone please chime in if I am) but the Golden Motor is the same or pretty much the same as the old Nine Continents motor but they brand it differently. The Golden Motor motors and batteries are the first early versions that have been stripped out of Chinese bikes that were bought and used and went kaput. The new Nine Continents motor (I have one myself and love it) is a nice motor. The problem is with the company Golden Motor, if you buy from them you are getting second hand stuff repackaged - intentionally, badly repackaged - as new (it gives them a good excuse when things arrive at your door all scratched and scuffed). Before buying from Golden Motor just go to the Golden Motor forum and see what others who have bought from them are saying. Look for my posts there, my user name was the same - kazbluesky. The guys on the Golden Motor forum were very helpful and supportive to me, (no offense meant to them but) most stay there I believe because of 3 things: 1 they HAVE TO in the hope of getting some com from GM, 2 they NEED TO to get their heads together to try to work out the flaws with the motor and the controller and batteries and bits and stuff, and 3 The Stockholm Syndrome. I think they would ALL agree with me though when I say that once you have paid your money that that is the last timely communication you'll ever have with GM.

Oh yeah and GM lies........

I think if you want one of these Nine Continent motors you should get it from Ampedbikes or Ebikes.ca, both of these companies are American and you can trust what they say.

 

[voicecoils]

Isn't one of those brushless golden's what 'Link' has on his "S-GO" project I think it was called?

He was talking about watercooling it at some stage...

Time to search

I don't think it's half an X5. Maybe Mark_A_W will weigh in. I think his brother has one...

 

[oldhaq]

I've been running a GM 48v/1000w on a 24" hookworm since July. I couldn't be happier with it and hasn't missed a beat and everything works as well as on day 1.
It's powered by a 51.2v 8s14p 18650 pack and tops out at 51km/h on flat with no wind, highest speed is 66km/h on a slight downhill with wind, without pedaling. My wattsup says max current draw is about 33 amps/1700 watts.
My frame is pretty heavy, a Jesse James West Coast Chopper with MTB rear suspension added, so speeds would be a bit more with a lighter frame and front wheel. My long wheelbase is good for handling at speed though.
When I initially ordered the GM kit, they sent a regen controller instead of the 15 mosfet non-regen I ordered, I emailed them about it and the other controller arrived 5 days later without having to return the regen controller. The kit also took 5 days to arrive. Everything appeared to be new and was all well packed.
So, having actually used one alot and without ever having a problem, I can only recommend them. Good value for money in my book.
Your idea for a 2WD bush basher sounds like it could be fun, got me thinking of making one myself but with one wheel at 20" for torque.

 

[kazbluesky]

Oldhaq, wow - wish Id had your experience !!!!!!

The short version of my experience : They took near a thousand dollars of my money, held it for a couple of months, meanwhile sending me not one but 2 obviously used and broken batteries (and wired up to make the motor let out it's magic smoke) and finally after threatening Credit Card action said we dont do 700c wheel motors because there are no 700c wheels in the whole of China!!!! (this after they repeatedly said earlier they'd already sent it) They then finally gave me my money back minus 95 dollars for the fun they put me through.

I would just advise people to go to the Golden Motor forum and see what's been going on, spend 20 minutes there and you'll be disgusted.

I was stupid, almost the second post I posted on that forum was to a guy who was telling me 'Don't do it!" and then proceeded to tell me his horror story. I think I said something like, "Thanks for your imput, but I guess all companies must have the occaisional problem." The cheapness of the product just suckered me in.

I was stupid, I don't want anyone else to be.

Again though, remember, I'm not talking negative about the motor, I like the motor, I have one myself, Im talking about the company Golden Motor who sell these motors on to you. You just cant trust where they got it from. Maybe you will get a good one, maybe you will get a factory reject, maybe you will get one stripped from off of a used bike - YOU JUST DONT KNOW.

I know I bang this drum a lot, but when you've been in a shipwreck and you see another about to happen you just want to do something about it.

Talking specifically about the motor, mine is a 36v 500w, 9x7 winding motor that I run at 48v 22amp max. Using 700c wheels I get 46kmph on the flat. I was thinking of buying that exact same motor - the 1000w motor - but some educated chap told me that writing the watts on a motor was bogus, that the watts were a fuction of the volts x the amps and so of course putting 48v with a 30 amp controller into the exact same motor would easily make it a 1000watt motor. Seemed to make sense to me....Im no electrician though. There was a lot of discussion/confusion/suspicion about this in the GM forum too.

 

[methods]

.....I think I said something like, "Thanks for your imput, but I guess all companies must have the occaisional problem." The cheapness of the product just suckered me in.
......
I was thinking of buying that exact same motor - the 1000w motor - but some educated chap told me that writing the watts on a motor was bogus, that the watts were a fuction of the volts x the amps and so of course putting 48v with a 30 amp controller into the exact same motor would easily make it a 1000watt motor. .....

Lol, I always do that. someone tells me DONT DO IT and then I do

As far as the power ratings go, the way it *should* work is that the 48V motor should have slightly lower KV windings than the 36V motor so that the top speed is the same but you have more torque on the way there.
If the 48V motor were the same the top speed would be much higher. I suppose the "performance charts" would prove this out in a second.

Your feedback is good feedback. It is important to separate the company from the product. A bad company can have great product and a great company can have terrible product. A company that sells totally bogus batteries can sell awesome motors and a company that will sell you good batteries might rip you off on a motor.

I am thinking about rolling the dice. . . Even though 90% of the feedback so far is negative..... I am telling myself that running 2 of them will put me in a different efficiency zone.
We will see.

Let a little more feedback come in.

-methods

 

[nicobie]

I also have a GM hub motor. I bought the 36v/500w kit but quickly up graded it with a GM 48v controller. I think these controllers are 35a ones as it was common to see 38a on my wattsup meter. I run a 48v/20ah ping (54v normal) with a 9.6 NiMh booster pack through up-graded phase wires. It was common to see 2100w powering up super steep hills. The only problem was the hall sensors. I fried 2 sets before buying a set from ebikes.ca. These seem to hold up better but I am not pushing the motor so hard anymore. The bike was capable of 30+mph speeds but scared the shit out of me at those speeds. It was a walmart full suspension cruiser that I don't recommend anyone buy. I put a ton of money into that bike, but it still ended up a POS. Now I am building a Electra Townie 21 with the BMC 600w motor.

Nick

 

[Mark_A_W]

Isn't one of those brushless golden's what 'Link' has on his "S-GO" project I think it was called?

He was talking about watercooling it at some stage...

Time to search

I don't think it's half an X5. Maybe Mark_A_W will weigh in. I think his brother has one...

My brother has a Brett White GL2, which looks identical to a Golden Motor, but I can't be certain.

At 48v 20A the GL2 has good speed, 40 to 45kmh with pedalling. But very little torque.


It is a toy compared to an X5. As is my front Nine Continents motor (smaller diameter than the ones going around now). My motor has WAY more torque than the GL2, which is interesting as it is smaller. But I need 60V to do 43-47kmh with pedalling.

An X5 is too much for a commuter IMO...but methods isn't a commuter...

 

[Hyena]

I too have the 500w 36v version, with a resistor mod to the controller it runs up to 56v now and with a 44.4v lipo pack does about 40km/hr no pedalling. It pulls around 1400w and 30a max on my wattsup meter and even on 36v it was around 1000w. It seems there might be a few different versions of the 1000w motor floating around - I think the earlier ones were the same 500w motor I have with a 48v controller, the speed others were getting running 1000w 48v motors is the same I was getting with my 500w @ 48v. (ie around 40km/hr)
Oldhaq is getting ~50km/hr on the same voltage with his though, and thats on a smaller 24" rim which should be slower if anything...

My kit was all brand new and I've had no dramas with it, although I didnt buy it direct through GM.
Is it only the GM batteries that people are having problems with or are they selling actual second hand motors as well ?

 

[karma]

im running the 36v 500watt gm at 90v no problems im going on 2 years. a few new spokes a rim and bearings later.
come income tax time im upgrading x5 sounds about right 8)

 

[Hyena]

Did you upgrade the wiring and/or halls Karma ? Nicobie mentions problems with his at lesser voltages.
90v is the highest I've heard of through a golden! What sort of speeds does it do ??

 

[voicecoils]

im running the 36v 500watt gm at 90v no problems im going on 2 years. a few new spokes a rim and bearings later.
come income tax time im upgrading x5 sounds about right 8)

Good report. Can you comment on your max and continuous current you sustain? How many km's were logged in the 2 yr period? Cheers!

 

[philf]

I have three of the GM 36V/500W hubs. Every single one of them has been solid, and so have the Shenzhen controllers supplied with them.

I think where GM falls down (and they appear to be improving on this) is with peripherals. Batteries, chargers, and rims where a joke. All three of the chargers I got were wired with reverse polarity (I fixed the other two after I smoked the first one, and they work fine). All of the rims were tossed, and the wheels relaced with something decent (and double-walled) - though it looks like they are now shipping double walled rims.

If I were given a choice, I'd do GM again in a hearbeat. Never had a problem with delivery, and I've ordered things from them on six separate occasions. If you're just interested in the motors, then I'd say "no worries".

What made Justin choose the GM, originally, for his Cross-Canada trek was efficiency and low cogging torque. Where the GM falls down is if you run them at high current, uphill, for a couple of kilometers. They overheat, and the halls come loose. I've never been able to get my motors past luke-warm to the touch in regular riding conditions.

I guess I'm saying that, despite reading a significant amount of bad press, I've been happy with them... I've never been one to take what folks who slag a particular brand/manufacturer say without a grain of salt. If there were one product that was perfect for everybody, there'd only be one product.

 

[methods]

This has been great feedback.
Thanks everyone.

There has been enough positive feedback that I feel comfortable with the risk.
I am going to see what kind of deal they will give me if I order 2 or 3.
If they wont deal then I will just evaluate one on my wife's new bike.

The wife has demanded a "downhill" bike for our spring riding.
She tells me that if she cant go over curbs then she is not interested.
This motor will suit her fine.

I will report back.

-methods

 

[Mark_A_W]

I think this motor will be fine for your wife Methods.


But I don't think that even two of them will be what you are after.

They will not handle a few thousand watts EACH.

 

[methods]

Yea... I know.
None of the hub motors are what I am after. :wink:

I have a lot of plans though. I have been picking up all kinds of weird bikes. Road bikes, choppers, cruisers, parts bikes. . .
I have been ordering different controllers and now I am starting to try to find some motors.
I would like to have 4 or 5 sets of everything so that I always have some wheels. . . Know what I mean?

I will try out the 2WD thing, get all fired up, post some pictures, have some fun.
I am sure it will end up in the parts bin with the other 10,000 things I have blown up

I dont know where all this will end.
The one thing I know is that I have to keep the power to weight right.
In the past I have made the mistake of going high power w/ heavy chassis.
This time I want to go high power and keep the chassis light!

So... the most obvious choice wont be happening (motorcycle)

Just cant see putting a huge Mars on a bicycle. Just does not feel right.

-methods

 

[morph999]

I seriously considered one of those 48v 1000w goldenmotor kits. I met a guy on youtube (other than the well known users here) who has been using his 1000w golden motor for a year and says it's been really reliable and goes 30 mph with 48v. He did a video of it too. I didn't go with it because I don't like ebay and so many negative comments about golden motor.

 

[Hyena]

it looks like they are now shipping double walled rims.

Is this a double walled rim ? I dont know much about rims, but it looks alot tougher than the standard crap that came on the bike and the spokes are bigger too

The wife has demanded a "downhill" bike for our spring riding.
She tells me that if she cant go over curbs then she is not interested.

While far from downhill, I often take my standard GM rim off gutters at 30+km/hr and very small jumps on trails with a 1 foot jump and its been fine so far. I'm not sure how much more it will take though!

 

[karma]

Did you upgrade the wiring and/or halls Karma ? Nicobie mentions problems with his at lesser voltages.
90v is the highest I've heard of through a golden! What sort of speeds does it do ??

the original wires got shortened on a spin out i had last year so im sure that helps with the wires heating up. i up the voltage but keep the amps down. with the shunt i get about 35mph without 45mph.
the motor plate get warm but the axle stays cool. i found 60v was the max for gm with a safety margin. 90v its drive at your own risk. i could easily fry the motor on a mean hill or headwind. that's how i like it
my izip was the same way.

when i had a watt meter at 60v i was getting a little over 3000watts

im working on a dashboard to monitor the amps volts watts. ill post results when finished.

 

[oldhaq]

...It's powered by a 51.2v 8s14p 18650 pack

It's 16s14p, 2x 24v packs in series, from lifepo4.hk

...I think where GM falls down (and they appear to be improving on this) is with peripherals. Batteries, chargers, and rims where a joke. All three of the chargers I got were wired with reverse polarity (I fixed the other two after I smoked the first one, and they work fine).

I remember now that the supplied GM charger was wired reversed polarity for the supplied connectors and also reverse to the charger that came with the battery, a friend advised me to check it as he had been caught out. I opened it up and re-soldered the output wires around.
I saw that there were many quality problems with GM batteries as well, and it looks like kazbluesky was a victim of that with considerable effort to get justice.
I was confident in buying the just the motor side of things as my friend had a 36volter which seemed ok.

...Oldhaq is getting ~50km/hr on the same voltage with his though, and that's on a smaller 24" rim which should be slower if anything...

I suppose that my speeds are due to the 48v GM standard controller which has more mosfets than a GM regen, shenzhen or ecrazyman, and a 24x2.5" hookworm is fat, about the same diameter as a normal 26" tyre.

I will try out the 2WD thing, get all fired up, post some pictures, have some fun.
I am sure it will end up in the parts bin with the other 10,000 things I have blown up
-methods

Look forward to see the progress and pics, hopefully before you blow it up :wink: