Greentime controllers

[John in CR]

these controllers works flawlessly with 24s

I was told my regen was only good to 84V, so I'd say flawlessly to 20s.

 

[Gordo]

"I'm pretty usless at unsoldering FETs, especially on cheaper PCB's where tracks can be lifted."

Even if you are a total spaz you can easily get the FET's out by clipping off the legs and then just heat the joint and blowing through the hole. Better yet is to take some old copper braid off any antenna or CATV wire and use it as a wick. Give it a try, catch another skill?

 

[ian.mich]

these controllers works flawlessly with 24s

I was told my regen was only good to 84V, so I'd say flawlessly to 20s.

Did you change the LVC resistor?

 

[XLR8]

i just bought one of these. Just waiting for it to arrive.

if i don't use 3 speed will i just get max speed?

what if i wanted to run 140volts LiMn? is there a fet that can handle that?

Yes, but i think i read if you connect the blue and black wires (3 speed wires) then you get a slight speed upgrade, havent tried it yet. For 150v you're looking at 4115s which they have. you made the right choice, this is the best controller supplier in china.

I'm running a 60v controller and the three speed works by connecting a momentary switch to the blue and black (ground) wires. If you press it once it limits the speed by about 80% and pressing the switch again reduces the speed to approximately 60%. A third press of the switch brings it to full speed again. The EABS feature works by connecting the yellow ( on my controller) which isn't paired with any other wire to a purple wire which has battery voltage on it. To play safe, I connected a 4.7K ohm resistor in series with the yellow to purple to drop the voltage below 5 volts by the time it reaches the processor via a divider network. I must confess that I haven't tried the EABS on the road yet because of all the rain we're having here in "sunny Queensland" but it does work on my bike stand.

 

[HypnoToad]

"I'm pretty usless at unsoldering FETs, especially on cheaper PCB's where tracks can be lifted."

Even if you are a total spaz you can easily get the FET's out by clipping off the legs and then just heat the joint and blowing through the hole. Better yet is to take some old copper braid off any antenna or CATV wire and use it as a wick. Give it a try, catch another skill?

In fact I've been unsoldering IC's more now that I've been trying to modify my Ezee controller, and I'm getting to grips with it. Cutting the legs and pulling out each leg one by one is a nice idea, I'll give that a try as I have a cheapy 6 fet controller on it's way that I may try swapping the FET's.

 

[Emoto]

Interesting supplier Ian, the dc-dc converter looks good, 24-72v range

Did you see his motor http://www.aliexpress.com/item-img/...ing-E-motorcycle-High-Quality/575036230.html# looks like a popular hub motor we all know.

 

[ian.mich]

Interesting supplier Ian, the dc-dc converter looks good, 24-72v range

Did you see his motor http://www.aliexpress.com/item-img/...ing-E-motorcycle-High-Quality/575036230.html# looks like a popular hub motor we all know.

Thanks, that converter is actually good up to 100v, just like most of their controllers. oil cooling that motor and running some serious power through it would be awesome, and much cheaper. Greentime has some seriously quality stuff. First time i opened their "1000W" controler i was expecting cold solder joints and shoddy worksmanship. This board is perfect, there is nothing I could improve on except maybe the positioning of things.

 

[Emoto]

Contact Keywin Ge (e-crazyman on ebay) and ask him to give you a price for controllers with no FETs fitted.

jeremy
I have contacted him and done the same, do you know a ebay supplier who sells genuine 4110 fets.

 

[Jeremy Harris]

jeremy
I have contacted him and done the same, do you know a ebay supplier who sells genuine 4110 fets.

My personal view is that buying FETs from ebay is a pretty sure-fire way to get counterfeits. I bought a batch of dud 4110s via ebay a couple of years ago, I don't know what they were, but they sure as heck weren't real IR made FETs, despite being badged as IR parts.

Your best bet is to buy them from a reputable company that deal with genuine IR parts. In the UK/EU RS Components and Farnell are good suppliers, in the US Digikey and Mouser are similar.

 

[John in CR]

oil cooling that motor and running some serious power through it would be awesome, and much cheaper.

Unless you plan some kind of radiator you have been badly misled.

 

[ian.mich]

oil cooling that motor and running some serious power through it would be awesome, and much cheaper.

Unless you plan some kind of radiator you have been badly misled.

The oil speeds the movement of heat from the windings, to the case, then to the outside air.

 

[Arlo1]

oil cooling that motor and running some serious power through it would be awesome, and much cheaper.

Unless you plan some kind of radiator you have been badly misled.

The oil speeds the movement of heat from the windings, to the case, then to the outside air.

I think what john is saying you wont make the power you think you will. I mean I got 6.5 HP from a stock x5304 and I don't care how much cooling you do because I found this with a cold motor. The cooling will not allow it to make anymore power it will just allow it to run at the higher power levels for a longer time.

 

[ian.mich]

I think what john is saying you wont make the power you think you will. I mean I got 6.5 HP from a stock x5304 and I don't care how much cooling you do because I found this with a cold motor. The cooling will not allow it to make anymore power it will just allow it to run at the higher power levels for a longer time.

Well yeah that's kind of what i meant. theres a local ebike guy who uses the chinese hubs (pro 901 type deal), oil cools and runs 24s lipo and 60a through a 4110 greentime.

 

[Emoto]

jeremy
I have contacted him and done the same, do you know a ebay supplier who sells genuine 4110 fets.

My personal view is that buying FETs from ebay is a pretty sure-fire way to get counterfeits. I bought a batch of dud 4110s via ebay a couple of years ago, I don't know what they were, but they sure as heck weren't real IR made FETs, despite being badged as IR parts.

Your best bet is to buy them from a reputable company that deal with genuine IR parts. In the UK/EU RS Components and Farnell are good suppliers, in the US Digikey and Mouser are similar.

Unfortunately im in Australia so ebay would have been great,
We have a rs here but but the only differance between a mugging and there prices is they dont use a gun.
So i was hoping a genuine ebay supplier had surfaced

 

[Jeremy Harris]

Unfortunately im in Australia so ebay would have been great,
We have a rs here but but the only differance between a mugging and there prices is they dont use a gun.
So i was hoping a genuine ebay supplier had surfaced

Sorry, I didn't see you were down under. You have Farnell down there too, http://au.element14.com/international-rectifier/irfb4110pbf/mosfet-n-100v-to-220ab/dp/1436955 at not too bad a price. Digikey and Mouser also ship to Australia, but are pretty much the same price as the other two and may hit you with shipping charges and taxes. The last lot of real IRFB4110's I bought came from Farnell, I think, and were about the equivalent of $6.50 AUD over here, but Farnell ship for free in the UK, making the price not too bad.

 

[Emoto]

Wow thank you verrrry! much, having a look now.

Edit ok i see your's and ill raise you this 1.53 USD per unit.http://www.arrownac.com/parts/detail/42590206S7624301N3340

 

[John in CR]

I think what john is saying you wont make the power you think you will. I mean I got 6.5 HP from a stock x5304 and I don't care how much cooling you do because I found this with a cold motor. The cooling will not allow it to make anymore power it will just allow it to run at the higher power levels for a longer time.

Well yeah that's kind of what i meant. theres a local ebike guy who uses the chinese hubs (pro 901 type deal), oil cools and runs 24s lipo and 60a through a 4110 greentime.

I've been running a sealed motor of similar dimensions without oil at 20s80A for 2 years, so your local ebike guy's results aren't impressive. The heat transfer limit is determined by the outer surface area. In the short term the oil fill approach gets the heat to the covers quicker, but in the long term, unless an external radiator is used, oil fill just smooths out the temperature spikes of the windings. It doesn't change the continuous power limit. GCinDC demonstrated this with his motor simply taking longer to get up to the same temperature.

Be careful following the crowd and their latest fad, especially when no one has shared before and after no load current, no load speed, or even wh/mile. A couple of years ago MWKeefer did thorough testing of oil fill and came to the conclusion it's really only worthwhile in geared hubs, so until better info is presented I'll remain a skeptic. Winding temperature is only a small part of the puzzle, and since I've managed to climb mountains without a temp sensor without melting a motor, I'm not too worried about the windings.

When I want to go to higher power than a stock hubbie can handle, I employ a simple proven ventilation strategy, but not simply the holes in the pizza pan ventilation that was last year's fad that proved marginally effective. If I did lots of low speed launches, then I'd employ a force air ventilation like Arlo has proven to be effective.

My sealed motor at 80A does get pretty hot, but I'm running an identical motor but ventilated at 137A with a Greentime controller, and that motor never gets past warm including climbing steep mountains.

John

 

[ian.mich]

I think what john is saying you wont make the power you think you will. I mean I got 6.5 HP from a stock x5304 and I don't care how much cooling you do because I found this with a cold motor. The cooling will not allow it to make anymore power it will just allow it to run at the higher power levels for a longer time.

Well yeah that's kind of what i meant. theres a local ebike guy who uses the chinese hubs (pro 901 type deal), oil cools and runs 24s lipo and 60a through a 4110 greentime.

I've been running a sealed motor of similar dimensions without oil at 20s80A for 2 years, so your local ebike guy's results aren't impressive. The heat transfer limit is determined by the outer surface area. In the short term the oil fill approach gets the heat to the covers quicker, but in the long term, unless an external radiator is used, oil fill just smooths out the temperature spikes of the windings. It doesn't change the continuous power limit. GCinDC demonstrated this with his motor simply taking longer to get up to the same temperature.

Be careful following the crowd and their latest fad, especially when no one has shared before and after no load current, no load speed, or even wh/mile. A couple of years ago MWKeefer did thorough testing of oil fill and came to the conclusion it's really only worthwhile in geared hubs, so until better info is presented I'll remain a skeptic. Winding temperature is only a small part of the puzzle, and since I've managed to climb mountains without a temp sensor without melting a motor, I'm not too worried about the windings.

When I want to go to higher power than a stock hubbie can handle, I employ a simple proven ventilation strategy, but not simply the holes in the pizza pan ventilation that was last year's fad that proved marginally effective. If I did lots of low speed launches, then I'd employ a force air ventilation like Arlo has proven to be effective.

My sealed motor at 80A does get pretty hot, but I'm running an identical motor but ventilated at 137A with a Greentime controller, and that motor never gets past warm including climbing steep mountains.

John

Thats great information, thank you for that. So I could run a chinese hub with no ventilation but new wiring at the 24s 60a?

 

[Emoto]

My sealed motor at 80A does get pretty hot, but I'm running an identical motor but ventilated at 137A with a Greentime controller, and that motor never gets past warm including climbing steep mountains.

John

John you were going to do a new motor comparison thread ventilated vs sealed , any progress/ link?

 

[The Mighty Volt]

£1.80 per 4110 Fet from one of the UK Suppliers, and thats for 200 Units.

PS nice to see you here again Jeremy, thanks for all the info

 

[Jeremy Harris]

£1.80 per 4110 Fet from one of the UK Suppliers, and thats for 200 Units.

Would make for a decent group buy if enough people wanted them, though. It's a heck of a saving over the small quantity price.

PS nice to see you here again Jeremy, thanks for all the info

Thanks!

 

[John in CR]

Thats great information, thank you for that. So I could run a chinese hub with no ventilation but new wiring at the 24s 60a?

Every system needs to be tested under your own riding conditions. Once you understand the limits and which of your conditions create the most heat, then you can ratchet current up. I could melt any hub motors at 12s30a, and on the other hand I could make any DD hubbie survive 24s100a. So much depends on hills, weight, and how you ride that generalizations result in burned up motors and controllers.

The only generalization that is truly valid is that smaller wheels are always better for hubmotors.

John

 

[John in CR]

My sealed motor at 80A does get pretty hot, but I'm running an identical motor but ventilated at 137A with a Greentime controller, and that motor never gets past warm including climbing steep mountains.

John

John you were going to do a new motor comparison thread ventilated vs sealed , any progress/ link?

I was wanting to give oil a try for a beach and mud riding bike, but after GCinDC reported the ATF was weakening the insulation on some of the internal wiring. Combine that with erosion erosion over time and it's just not for me. I don't like to open hubbies, so ventilating, bigger phase wires, and good bearings gets done in one shot. I should add a protective coating for the stator to that list, but my lack of rusty stators has made me complacent. The reason I don't like opening them is that the unavoidable rubbing of the magnets and stator can scrape up the end laminations and can create shorts between lams. The one motor I opened multiple times was running hotter than before using the same controller and settings. That was after a phase wire upgrade and new bearings. I opened it back up and the edges of the stator appear to be scraped and joined enough to short quite a few of the lamination layers together resulting in more eddy currents. I want to try a wax paper wrap during extraction and insertion of stators, but haven't had one open since to share the reults.

Stock vs vented I've done comparison for over a year with identical motors in the same size wheel at the same voltage. The stock one I can't turn high enough to climb my sons favorite mountain road, but the vented one can climb it without issue and is cooler at the top than the sealed motor is running around on flat roads. Hubmonster which is ventilated, but a larger motor, blasted to the top of that mountain on a 70° morning and was exactly body temperature at the top, which surprised the hell out of me due to the numerous accelerations out of every curve on the way up. I'm waiting for dry season to do a video of a hardcore climb.

John

 

[ian.mich]

Thats great information, thank you for that. So I could run a chinese hub with no ventilation but new wiring at the 24s 60a?

Every system needs to be tested under your own riding conditions. Once you understand the limits and which of your conditions create the most heat, then you can ratchet current up. I could melt any hub motors at 12s30a, and on the other hand I could make any DD hubbie survive 24s100a. So much depends on hills, weight, and how you ride that generalizations result in burned up motors and controllers.

The only generalization that is truly valid is that smaller wheels are always better for hubmotors.

John

or i could just oil cool and run it at 24s 60a no problem.

 

[e-biker]

Greentime controller has anyone ever used one of their 36 fet controllers ? I am thinking about buying one but I never heard of them before, the price is right. it says it has 36 IRFB 4110 fets. I need this to run with my x5303 motor.